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Warp scramblers jammers and ganking
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Oswald Bolke
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#1 - 2013-01-31 23:30:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Oswald Bolke
I think personally, not enough is sacrificed to jam warp in PVP.

Sure, Jammers and scramblers use a lot of power, but...they give you an ENORMOUS advantage while ganking and ratting. Tactically he who can disengage the best from a fight can dictate the terms of an engagement, and that's good, but shouldn't we have to make concessions for such a tactical advantage? I think so

Personally, I feel Warp jammers should be...I hope you are seated...A high power slot...and have it use A LOT of power.

Why is this?

because as stated before, I feel there should be a price paid for the giant tactical advantage of not allowing your opponent to escape.

I like the fact that a Frig can jump in, jam your cruiser and then their buddies can jump in, but I feel if a jammer sufficiently nerfed offensive capabilities of the ship it was used on, it would make it a bit more fair, and put it in line with the debuffs added on to the stabilizers for warp fields, because right now, people who don't wanna get their warp taken out have to have a 50 some precent debuff on targeting range vs. nill on a jammer (oh and heaven forbid you expend a little cap).

so yeah, I feel like if we make it a little harder to tackle we will find it's a little easier to get around in lowsec and means pirates, who are already coordinated will have to run a jammer ship, and make that ship using said item be very nerfed, so where noe every tom **** and harry with a warp jammer and some tech 2 guns can gank hardcore

If we aren't going to actually make all but the most hardcore pirates wanted in high sec, and their lives made harder by killing other players, we might as well make their combat a little harder, making the life of crime not exactly a walk in the park
TehCloud
Guardians of the Dodixie
#2 - 2013-01-31 23:39:14 UTC
Yeah, because having to sacrifice tank as a shieldtank and dps as an armortank (dps in form of better tracking, slower target etc.) isn't enough.

You just want to enjoy your carebear haven and if somebody annoys you killing npcs you want to have more guns than him and more tank so you can easily kill him.

How about you use your directional scanner (aka D-Scan) to just not get tackled? It might be a huge step into unknown territory for you, having to actively do something to prevent being killed.

Also they are called Warp Scramblers/Disruptors not Jammers, Jammers are those fancy pancy modules the Guristas NPCs use, bet you're familiar with those :3

Regards, TehCloud

My Condor costs less than that module!
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2013-01-31 23:45:55 UTC
What is the common response to this again? Oh yeah,
Please show me on the doll where the bad pirate touched you.

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
Oswald Bolke
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#4 - 2013-02-01 00:05:32 UTC
ahhh, and the pirates chip in with their side: "don't nerf me!", IMO with the turkey shoots I see it's seems to easy to gank

honestly the truth is somewhere in between

I feel like it needs to be at a point with some savvy you can at least put up a good fight rather than all of your systems being jammed, yet your enemies still do good DPS.

I could give a rats behind if you have to give up tanking, If I can't jump out or fight back why does that matter? I might as well pee into the solar wind
Luc Chastot
#5 - 2013-02-01 00:24:33 UTC
Don't want to be rude but, you're passing for a moron while making such a suggestion.

Make it idiot-proof and someone will make a better idiot.

ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#6 - 2013-02-01 00:40:34 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
Oswald Bolke wrote:
I like the fact that a Frig can jump in, jam your cruiser and then their buddies can jump in, but I feel if a jammer sufficiently nerfed offensive capabilities of the ship it was used on, it would make it a bit more fair,

How so? Your industrial ship is still pinned and a cap booster can fix all the capacitor problems a ship might have.

Oswald Bolke wrote:
and put it in line with the debuffs added on to the stabilizers for warp fields, because right now, people who don't wanna get their warp taken out have to have a 50 some precent debuff on targeting range

Warp Core Stabs were nerfed for a reason.

I highly doubt that you want battleships warping in at long range, sniping you, and warping away as soon as someone gets tackle on him/her.

Oswald Bolke wrote:
people who don't wanna get their warp taken out have to have a 50 some precent debuff on targeting range vs. nill on a jammer (oh and heaven forbid you expend a little cap).

Shield tanks give up a precious medium slot for a warp disruptor/scrambler making them more squishy... armor tanks are generally slow and can be outrun.

Oswald Bolke wrote:
so yeah, I feel like if we make it a little harder to tackle we will find it's a little easier to get around in lowsec

It's already easy to avoid gatecamps. Take alternate routes and/or blow through them using cloaky blockade runners like the rest of us who live down there.

Oswald Bolke wrote:
If we aren't going to actually make all but the most hardcore pirates wanted in high sec, and their lives made harder by killing other players, we might as well make their combat a little harder, making the life of crime not exactly a walk in the park

Let's see... as an "outlaw"...

- I can be shot at by every player in the game free of penalty. No gate guns or CONCORD will come to my aid or punish the people who kill me. Ever.

- I am harassed by NPC police every time I enter high-sec... making travel long, tedious, and hazardous in ships larger than a destroyer.

- Since I can be shot by everyone and anyone and must contend with NPCs in high-sec getting stuff from known trade hubs myself is a non option... leaving me with...
--- low-sec trade hubs. But they are far from "well-stocked" and often quite overpriced.
--- making a hauling alt, which takes time away from my main's training unless I spend another 15 bucks a month JUST for logistics.
--- putting myself at the mercy of a local industrialist to make me ships and mods.
--- relying on "law abiding" corps/friends to haul stuff to me for a fee.

- The only way I can ever re-enter high-sec is by ratting for hours upon hours upon hours, for days at a time in null-sec... provided that I don't get killed by the local null-sec alliance. I COULD also rat in low-sec where it is relatively safer... but that'd take even longer.

- I am stuck basing in the same areas (low and null-sec) that other outlaws base out of... and most of them are not very friendly to me.

- Earning money is quite a bit more difficult if you don't know what you are doing.

- "Hotdrops" from capital ships and Black-Ops are an actual threat I must be concerned about.

How did you Veterans start?
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#7 - 2013-02-01 01:17:14 UTC
i dnt see an issue with the ease of scramming.

preventing ur opponent from fleeing is a basic necessity for the vast majority of PvP, and this is a PvP game. expect them to be common, cheap (isk AND requirements) and robust as modules. If scramming was to be more taxing or difficult, then it would make PvP even more difficult for newer players.

also, if ur not fitting a scram and ur oppnent is, u have an extra mid slot over him, meaning u can shield tank harder or have an extra web for dictating range, ECM to jam him, tracking computer or TP for the better application of DPS. sacrificing a slot, just to make sure ur opponent cannot warp, does gimp ur fit.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs
Sura Sadiva
Entropic Tactical Crew
#8 - 2013-02-01 03:45:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Sura Sadiva
Not sure if is a troll... anyway:

Oswald Bolke wrote:

so yeah, I feel like if we make it a little harder to tackle we will find it's a little easier to get around in lowsec and means pirates, who are already coordinated will have to run a jammer ship, and make that ship using said item be very nerfed, so where noe every tom **** and harry with a warp jammer and some tech 2 guns can gank hardcore


Getting someone not willing to be taken is already too hard. Basically already now 90% of fights are consensual, if one has a basic know how on how to move and want to avoid to be caught 9 out of 10 he will success.
If changes have to be made are in the opposite direction, to make things lss consesnual and harder to avoid fights. In low, as in high as in null.


Oswald Bolke wrote:

If we aren't going to actually make all but the most hardcore pirates wanted in high sec, and their lives made harder by killing other players, we might as well make their combat a little harder, making the life of crime not exactly a walk in the park


And how would you caught those evil pirates if you nerf tackling, taunting and shouting profanities at them?
TheGunslinger42
All Web Investigations
#9 - 2013-02-01 08:30:30 UTC
tl;dr version: I want pvp against me to be even harder, abloo bloo bloo

no
TheSkeptic
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2013-02-01 09:03:45 UTC
terrible idea that would make every shield tanker with a utility high OP

...

Super spikinator
Hegemonous Conscripts
#11 - 2013-02-01 09:46:09 UTC
TheSkeptic wrote:
terrible idea that would make every shield tanker with a utility high OP


I bet you the OP flys a drake. Only a drake pilot would make this suggestion.
Schmata Bastanold
In Boobiez We Trust
#12 - 2013-02-01 09:56:33 UTC
Isn't that sweet, fw puppie can't stand his stabbed farmboat being tackled by dualscram frig.

As a fellow Minmatar warrior I say you are disgrace for our proud race and you never should leave Amarr slave barracks. You don't deserve freedom our fathers paid with blood for.

Invalid signature format
Morgan North
Dark-Rising
Wrecking Machine.
#13 - 2013-02-01 11:32:18 UTC
Heavy Interdictors already get tht high-slot disruptor. It doesn't really change anything.