Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Not sure why nullification "fits better" with BRs instead of DSTs. But if they did add nullification to BRs, you might as well go out and sell your DSTs and their BPs, because there won't be much reason to fly anything BUT a BR. At the moment, the only reason to fly a DST is for a lark, because whatever a DST can do (dodging a few points at a gate via warp core stability), the BR can do better (cloak + warp). I totally think the DST warp nullification idea is great, because at least it gives the DST some identifiable role.

Ogod, my body is so ready right now

I don't like this for stratcrus. Strategic Cruisers can fit both Covert Reconfiguration and Interdiction Nullification subsystems on the same ship, and frequently do. These ships are incredibly hard to catch with a gatecamp, even a camp with a t2 hictor and a lot of competent decloakers. If Covert Reconfiguration allows them access to Covert Cynosaural Field Generators, what you now have is a cyno-capable ship that is near impossible to prevent from coming into your pocket and camping your mining/ratting/whatever operation.

Suggested fixes:
* Remove this capability from stratcrus. They can fit a covops cloak, but they can't be as good as a real covops ship. This is in line with the philosophy behind the strategic cruiser line.

Or:

* Change the Interdiction Nullification subsystem to have a giant inertia penalty, so the align time of the ship is increased. This way, a good decloaker can buzz the cruiser before it's able to make warp, and an instalocking 'ceptor/keres/whatever can get a point.

I would like to see a complete overhaul done. here is my idea.
Overview
The proposal I would like to suggest would be to overhaul the mechanics, ships and functions of Black Ops and Force Recon.
Black Ops ships and Force Recon tie together hand in hand but are currently not used very often in today’s game as it is really limiting new players and players with high and specific skills. The proposed changes would introduce changes to Ships and skills with and introduction of new ships and tools to help the black ops and Force Recon ships.

Game play changes
Black Operations should be a name of a style of combat and not the battleship. Black Operations should be a form of game play which allows new-ish players and experienced players the ability to experience and grow black operations together.
To be able to perform these changes and introduction and change of ships would be needed.

Why Change
Black Operations in itself is reliant on so many different factors that make it very difficult to use. Black operations is very dependent the ability to move ships from point A to Point B to perform its tasks. To be able to do this the Black Ops Battleship is required to use Faction Isotopes to allow the other ships and its self to jump to other systems. The amount of isotopes used is dependent on:

Ship Size (mass)
Distance to Target

As there are no tools giving the ability to judge the distance for bridging against the amount of isotopes required. It makes the job of a single or multiple bridging’s and jumps harp to determine. Because of the reliance of the Isotopes as fuel against the size of ship and distance it would make sense to introduce more classes of ships to allow a variety of fleet sizes.

Concept
Introduce a whole black operations class of ships from frigate to carrier all still based upon the aspect that all ships would need to be able to be fitted with the tier 3 cloaking device or designated as a Portal Generator ship.
the Black Operations ships would be:

Black Ops Frigate
Covert Ops
Bomber
Tackler Webification / Covert Cyno generator
Tackler Warp Disruption / Covert Cyno generator
ECM
Tracking Disruption
Cap neutralisation
Logistics
All Frigates would require the use of a Tier 3 cloaking device

Black Ops Destroyer
Damage dealer
ECM
Tracking Disruption
Cap neutralisation
Tackler Webification / Covert Cyno generator
Tackler Warp Disruption / Covert Cyno generator
Logistics
Interdictor / Covert Cyno generator
All Destroyers would require the use of a Tier 3 cloaking device

Black Ops Cruiser
Damage dealer
ECM (Currently the Falcon)
Tracking Disruption (Currently the Pilgrim)
Tackler Webification / Covert Cyno generator (Currently the Rapier)
Tackler Warp Disruption / Covert Cyno generator (Currently the Rapier)
Logistics
Heavy Interdictor / Covert Cyno generator
Command
All Destroyers would require the use of a Tier 3 cloaking device

Black Ops Battleship T1
Damage dealer / Covert Cyno generator
ECM / Covert Cyno generator
Cap neutralisation / Covert Cyno generator
Tracking Disruption / Covert Cyno generator
T1 Black Ops Battleships can only bridge via the Black Ops Carrier

Black Ops Battleship T2
Command / Covert Cyno generator
Logistics / Covert Cyno generator
T2 Black Ops Battleships can bridge and Jump to Cyno

Black Ops Carrier
Command / Covert Cyno generator
Carrier can bridge and Jump to location

T3 Ships
Black Ops Command Sub System
All T3 would require the use of a Tier 3 cloaking device

Blockade runner
No Change

Black Ops Noctis
See Below

Ship Description

Black Ops Neutraliser
This ship would be similar to what the pilgrim does currently and adjusted to the ships type.

Black Ops Logistics
As per the new logistics ship given at the 2012 EVE tournament the Black Ops Logistics ships would be a variant of this ship.
All the ship Classes would be relevant to the current versions (Frigate and Cruiser) the only new one would be the destroyer class logistics which would be a variant change and the difference between the Frigate and Cruiser.
The T3 cruiser is use full but the Cost, size & speed of the ship limits this type of ship really to be jumped into a Battleship class fight. It would not be good as a Frigate or destroyer fleet.

Black Ops Noctis
The Black Ops noctis would be limited to the same category as the battle ships where it is a black ops ship and can bridge through black ops ship but can nit use a covert ops cloaking device. This noctis would have all the standard noctic specifications nit have the ability to have a fuel storage are for Black Ops battle ships to use.

Command ships
Black Ops command ships are not able to fit the normal standard warfare links but fit a Black Ops warfare link.
Command Ships are not effected by ECM or tracking Disruption. The role of a command ship is to give bonuses but not necessarily command the fight. Because everything is manual and not automatic it gives the command ship pilot more work to do protecting his own pilots.
Black Ops Command ships are able to lock up to a number of ships dependent on skills and the type of ship flown. E.g. Carrier = 50, Battleship = 30, Cruiser = 15

Continued on part II[

Does this mean Viator (and possibly other BRs) will get more than one highslot? I would hate to have to choose between being covert and equipping a covert cyno when operation.

Firstly relatively new players are not exempt from black ops fleets as bombers are the mainstay of black ops as they provide a good chunk of dps with a lot of adjustable utilities. the ideology of complete tactical control is a mainstay of black ops.

Secondly warfare links are possible on covert ops fitted t3s. no need for black ops command ships.

Thirdly the idea of black ops logistics is waaay overpowered. the reason the Etanu exists in the first place is only because such a ship is an exceptional rarity and their sheer cost and massive lossmail keeps it in check.

Fourthly the black ops noctis is rediculous as the suggested role is one of the best uses for Blockade runners. Theyre used for fuel and bomb trucks if you didnt know.

and Fifthly that change to cynos would make sooo many people rage soo hard that itd just be overturned.


the different gang link mechanic is interesting. but even then itd mean ur forcing bonuses on field by the need to be on grid. and many many pvp'ers have shown many reasons for it to also be providable off-grid.

the only real idea thats worth merit is possibly the black ops carrier bt even then not in the style you suggested and you havent really suggested much about it, as it can be assumed to be seriously overpowered.

Gee,
Thanks for the constructive advice.



You are correct that stealth bombers are the main stay of DPS however new players getting into the 50+ km for safe-ish torp range will take time. Most new players getting into stealth bombers go pop when just looking at their shadow. By adding more frigates to the group you would allow young players the ability to join in the fun. Most of the unistas I train love the first time they Hot Drop a RAT BS for practice. but when it comes to live Hot drops they almost we their pants.. As the training for new players is so diverse it takes dedication to stay on a training path that takes them towards Targeting Range Dampening, Torps, bomb launcher, covert ops cloaking device and anything else you want to fit onto a stealth bomber. Unless your going to move into a Large 0.0 corp/alliance then you will not get the opportunity to do this as the skills to do the other roles are many months away for any player.
So by introducing in the frigates and destroyer class ships then it gives a better and cheaper oportunities to get tackle, ecm onto the which would be at the training skills of frigate pilots.



Yea i understand this but to make it fair then command ships should also be in the firing line. I run a almost un-scanable T3 in a system and it sits their all day. Black ops shouldn't be like that.



there is no problem if you have the isk/plex then you can buy a T3 and fit logi on it and jump it through but the Size (Fuel Cost) Isk Cost, Repping Range. People complain it would be way over powered but it just like other aspects in the game. Shield ships with the ASB are almost untouchable against an Armour ships Command ships who can give bonus and not be on grid is way over powered. any ship with a cloaking device that can stay cloaked all day is overpowered. Its all about finding the right balance in relation to the skills and training required.



This was just an idea of how to cover all aspects of standard ships. If you are successful in your ops then you will need a salvager to clean the place up. Yes it takes the blockade runners job in a way but blockade runners are mainly for running around LS and 0.0. the only use for the blockade runner in Black Ops is to be and extended fuel tank.



Well tough.. cyno is to easy.. so making of cyno alts would take a a few days rather than a few hours.

LAST QUOTE - the only real idea thats worth merit is possibly the black ops carrier bt even then not in the style you suggested and you havent really suggested much about it, as it can be assumed to be seriously overpowered.

Well the Black Ops carrier would only have a function of a taxi and a command ship. With the Command warfare links the pilot would be too busy keeping all of the members locked and bonuses.
Basically its like a mini titan which would allow, lets Say 10 Bo-BS to bridge through it or 100 BO-frigates or the equivalent. Its the same theory as a titan but one that after a set bridge time automatically jumps through. So once the bridge is open there is no way to stop him from automatically jumping at the end of the bridge cycle.
By doing this it gives small and medium size corps / alliances the ability to have the same fun as Large alliances giving the power back to the smaller groups.
The only ships that could jump through the BO bridge would be BO-BS, Frig, Cru, Desi.

I like the proposed changes: Improved BLOPS jump / bridge range; Reduced fuel per kg per LY for a BLOPS jump or bridge; cov-cyno also able to be operated from blockade runners and covops-fit strategic cruisers (as well as the current covops frigates, stealth bombers, force recons, and BLOPS themselves).

For most of our current longreach BLOPS efforts this change should remove one intermediate staging jump (reduced hassle and staging logistics) and reduce the fuel cost … but it hasn’t dumbed down or messed with the overall charm of BLOPSing at all.

This change seems to focus on the BLOPS activity, more than the particulars of that class of BLOPS battleships. As such it doesn’t seem likely to make them get used more as a direct-conflict combat ship, which only happens occasionally, but does make their BLOPS function … the ability to covertly insert and extract combat fleets behind enemy lines, even into cyno-jammed systems … a more powerful tool for the aggressor. I like that, I like that a lot. Thank you in slavering anticipation.

Actually, I'd like a 3rd highslot on the prowler so I can continue using it as a Prober+Cloak.

Or, what would make even more sense.. add the ability to refit on Black Ops. Now that, would really fit their role as a Covert Platform.

I approve of most of the changes here. The BLOPs needed a buff. Also covert cyno t3s already got my fits!!
I probably use my BLOPs more than most right now as i bridge bomber's bar fleets alot.

I have a concern on the range though. Since BLOPs range is currently rather small i have spent alot of time looking for clever bridge systems from high sec. With a titans bridge range a covert ops base alliance/group can easily dominate a region via high sec where they really can't be touched. Such as bombers bar case you can't exactly war dec everyone....

So in short would there be any method out side a war dec to prevent being constantly dropped from high sec?