Player Features and Ideas Discussion

so ur saying walking down dark and strange alleys alone when u are unable to defend urself ISNT a stupid thing to do? the mugger is doing something against the law true, but u would be at fault for being so stupid. also, CCP isnt doing anything that is against the law.



a more competent miner can still skill for and mine better than an incompetent miner, so it still applies.

i've also already said, i read up on this game 2-3 months before starting a free trial. what initially attracted me was the spaceships, what really captured me tho was the player driven community, especially the economy; the drama around the delve wars, player made videos, the freedom to be an internet space bastard, mature players, the scale of the game and the 'eliteness' over whining of players



i know, isnt it great that it can always surprise, u have near unlimited room to grow, and its always changing. the difference between u and me is that i dnt cry like a baby when things happen out of my control and then come to the forums with a broken idea. instead i re-evaluate and move on. some might say i adapt

There is a big difference between the historic "reallocation" of SP and what you are proposing. I'd even argue that we have not in fact had "reallocation" of skillpoints, but a refunding of skillpoints. I know, from your post history there is no difference to you, as you ultimately moved SP from one group of skills to the next, but there is a big difference. In the past, you never had a CHOICE!! CCP removed learning skills, and refunded you those SP; CCP removed some of the social skills, and refunded you those SP. You didn't get to choose whether or not you prefered the skills they removed, they just simply removed them. And that is why you got to "reallocate" those SP to another group of skills.

Just because EvE has microtransactions does not make it F2P or P2W. Again, there is a subtlety in these definitions that you can't seem to understand or choose not to acknowledge.


You don't offer as much opinion as the rest of us.... Your entire basis for this thread is an Opinion:


Fact CCP changed attributes on a Ship.
Opinion: "you need to train months for another ship to use instead...." While it is a fact it requires training time for another ship, your "need" is a feeling = opinion. Additionally, the notion that changes make a ship useless for your play style is generally an opinion too. Please tell me what ship was made "Useless" from the changes... and for icing on the cake, point to skillset you "needed" to remap to that takes "Months" of training.

Your so called reasons, off page 1:

It deals with SP that are focused in a skillset you don't use.

New player opportunities and the Learning Curve

Unused skills which are years old.

Streamlining the skillsystem so it is less complicated.

Making Eve more about the game play, then about What You have trained and what you don't. Right now because of the limited structure of the Skill System, you get in Eve and your only focus is to "Train skills".

With this feature the player will no longer need to spend months training for another ship, item or whatever, simply because the devs decided to change something critical on a ship, item, weapon, whatever, which then made it useless for your play style, or ability.

I want to shift this focus from "Train Skills" to "Play Game". Allowing people to respec their skills lets them focus more on having Fun, then worrying about how they fapped up by training Mining when they figured out they wanted to pvp instead, and now have to worry about training basic pvp skills rather then simply transferring the SP and then going off to have fun while training other skills they need for pvp.

That long list is really two reasons, just stated many different ways:
1.) It allows you to move SP from previously trained low-utility skills to skills you currently want to use.

2.) It allows you to instantly adapt your SP to game/playstyle changes.

--- Point 1.) You have already benefited from the skillpoints you have. Even if they are of low utility to you now, they still have the potential to be useful in the future. THe ONLY reason you have provided for this argument is "I want to"

--- Point 2.) People have already explained this is NOT good for the game. This is a slow-paced game where you plan for the future, and your Skillpoint investments require Real Time. Taking that away from the game, so you can get your instant fix, is NOT good for the game...

Reasons why you should NOT be able to respec:

1.) It's increases the general skillpoint training rate for higher skillpoint players: They just train Titan V all year at max training, and then respec those skills to something else they desire... You can easily find 1-year worth of Per-Will skills to do this with. Even if they only take a month's worth and shift it, it still gives them a month of accelerated training.

2.) You've already benefited from those SP, and can continue to benefit from them in the future. If tomorrow, you decide you want to swap areas of the game... you've already benefited from your current SP, even if you don't ever use them again.... why should you be able to refocus that SP to instantly be good in another area of the game? This seems detrimental to the game because it devalues the time invested in specialized training.

3.) You don't deserve it. Never did CCP guarantee you that your current ship will remain the same, both in terms of power spectrum, utility, etc.. Never did CCP guarantee you that your play style today will be valid tomorrow. And in light of past and future changes, your suggestion really comes across as "since I'm a vet with lots of SP I should be able to remap them to try a new area of the game without going through the growing pains in becoming efficient "skillwise" at it. As a vet, I oppose this attitude (and think it comes across as obnoxiously entitled). When I branched out from PvP to Industry, I had to train up many skills to be competetive with other industrialists. When an industrialist branches into PvP, there are many skills they need to train up to be competitive with me... Neither one of us should insta-swap SP Specializations to be awesome at our new direction in EvE!!!

If the skill remap was spammable, I would agree with you 100% on all of your points. But only being able to remap once a year makes them irrelevant for the most part, and as I said before, no system is perfect. And there are people who will always abuse anything if they can.

It's why I suggested the Severe limitations for the system itself. Especially if you add having to spend a plex for it as someone else suggested. AND only being able to do it once a year.

Each one of the points I point out have vastly different effects on the game, Currently which are Negative for the most part. It's the reason they are listed.

So you're saying that because something was made balanced but still performs the same job as before, people should just be able to switch to the next big thing. We're better off without this.

1. then it sounds to me there is little that could have been done to prevent or mitigate the effects of the attack. Infact it sounds like there was no warning and it was impossible to predict. there was plenty that could have been done to mitigate the effects of the nerf on ur characters, even if u could not prevent the nerf itself. it was also announced ahead of time and could have been predicted even before it was announced. still ur fault and u could have began training into other ships before the nerf even happened.

2. i put forward, with quite some confidence, that someone who reads up on mining will make significantly less mistakes than someone who just dives into it. one example may be someone who uses a retriever because they know they want to semi-afk mine over someone who wanted to semi afk mine but chose the covetor just because it had higher yield. thats just not playing smart.

3. shall i link the post again?

In response to the comment on skill reallocation vs skill refunding.

This is why my version of this idea is a refund.

You lose the skills you choose to remove sp from, and must pay for new skill books if you don't already posses the skills you wish to wish to put that sp into.


Now, on the analogy of CCP and the cable company.

Worst analogy ever.
You didn't put the player, CCP, or SP in the right places to even remotely represent the matter at hand.....

You on the other hand, should stop posting.

First off... I do like the drawback of losing the Skillbook when you remove the SP... but that's, generally speaking, not a big drawback... There are lots of rank 8 skills that don't cost much isk (< 5m)... and would be popular for SP dumping in 2m Sp chunks, which is a lot of SP. Addition notions: Isk is rarely a balancing factor... so even if you give up Racial Dread (100m, Rank 12, 3m SP) or Carrier (500m sp, rank 14, 3.5m SP) these are still "inline" with the cost of a PLEX to make the transfer in the first place...

A more relevant drawback would be... you lose 50% of the skillpoints you remap...

Now for the Analogy:
Please explain why the analogy is the "worst analogy ever". Because your random opinion is frankly meaningless to the discussion if you don't.

Point in fact: I've had very similar experiences with the cable company to this when they changed their cable signals (to make it more encrypted and less hackable) in the late 90's. My old converter, which I bought from the cable company ceased to work with their new cable stream. My choices were to buy or rent a new cable converter box from them, or give up the service. They offered a discount when purchasing a new cable box to encourage us to buy new boxes, but they didn't refund my old box, and they didn't replace it for free...

Other more recent examples would by Cable modems.. I have several "old" cable modems that I purchased several years ago, that are incompatible with the current signal from my cable internet provider. (although I suspect some of the proclaimed incompatibility is hogwash)

I would also bring up how the FCC regulated that all Analog Public TV broadcasts required all Broadcasters to Switch to Digital Broadcasts in the U.S. in 2009, but since the FCC didn't "sell" you the TV it's not as appropriate an analogy.

Also, what would an appropriate analogy be?

Didn't you hear, there is no way this will be abused. I'm serious, I've been told and everything.

It would take you 4 years to create any extra xp and it would be a negligible amount by then, Not to mention a waste of time. And as I stated before if this is actually an issue tweaks can be made to the skill system in order to prevent it.

Not a huge deal.