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New toon. Cybernetics V and +5's worth it?

Author
Crash Lander
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#21 - 2013-01-11 05:52:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Crash Lander
Time to settle this with some bad math!
Assuming you are properly remapped and currently have +4's.

Switching 2x +4 implants to +5

Average SP/Hour Diff
from 2610 SP/Hr => 2700 SP/Hr => Gain of 90SP/HR

SP Gain with +4's in a month: 1906563.24
SP Gain with +5's in a month: 1972306.8
=>
SP gain over 1 Month: 65743.56 SP

1 Month = ~ 730.484 hours = 1 Plex = ~$20 USD

price of 2x +5 implants: ~240mil ISK = ~$8.51 = ~313.06 hours

So where is the break even point? What should +5's cost?
So the return rate is 1/29th or (i.e: 90/2610)
==> 25 hours per month = 19.16mil ISK
240mil / 19.16mil = 12.52 Month

In other words the 2x implants would pay for themselves after 12.5 Month in the amount of time they have saved your char in training.

That's not including the time for Cybernetics 5. Or the opportunity cost of investing 240mil ISK. Or the chance of you getting blown up with them!

Side fact from above:
1906563.24 SP / 90 (SP/HR) = 21184.036 hours = ~882.667 days = ~29 Month!
==> By switching to +5 from +4s after 29 month you will have gained one month of training vs +4's.

TLDR: Really waste of ISK unless you are in it for at least a year and are not going to remap and not going to get podded.

Disclaimer: Its late and I didn't feel like double checking this.
Justin Valentine
Mickey Mouse Club
#22 - 2013-01-11 12:07:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Justin Valentine
+5s are very worth it look at it this way 2x+5 implants primary/second 180m isk after 3 months you will have an extra 180k sp..
180 000 sp for 180m isk? Bargain.
After 6 months it is 360k sp..

You cant compare the cost of implants with plex due to the fact time is priceless.

Also Cybernetics 5 for slot 6 Omega implants.
Crash Lander
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#23 - 2013-01-11 15:15:17 UTC
Justin Valentine wrote:
+5s are very worth it look at it this way 2x+5 implants primary/second 180m isk after 3 months you will have an extra 180k sp..
180 000 sp for 180m isk? Bargain.
After 6 months it is 360k sp..

You cant compare the cost of implants with plex due to the fact time is priceless.



Somebody sell this man some implants. Time has a price. Its called character bazaar.
GreenSeed
#24 - 2013-01-11 19:37:27 UTC
if you really want a faster skill up, get a cerebral accelerator and upgrade implants as you get more levels of cybernetics. i think you start with +3s, then plug 2 +4s and finally 5 +5s.

on the long run you WILL be saving a lot of training time, just be sure of what you want the character to be, and train him on that path only.

and again... BE SURE of what you want the character to be, and max THAT only. you wont regret having highly specialized characters. max leadership, max frigs/dessies, max cruisers/hacs, etc etc.

having one spec means you can go for those lvl5s skills that people always leave for last, which usually means never.
McRoll
Extraction and Exploration Ltd.
#25 - 2013-01-12 00:49:56 UTC
In my opinion not worth it unless it is a highly specialized alt planned for a long time. Almost never worth it for the first char.

As others have pointed out, it is helpful to train certain long skills to V or stick to a skillset depending on your mapped attributes. However you will want to try out many skills from different categories and you will want to have them earlier, because unless you are pretty hardcore into this game, the interest will start do decline after some time and you probably won't be playing enough after the time it took you to reach the break even point. It is more fun to try out different stuff than getting 2% more efficiency in a certain area, which you probably won't even notice in practice.

You also need to consider that after years of playing it won't really matter if you have some more million SP with 5's. I am in such a situation, I play since 2008 and I am training Marauders V because I don't really know what else I could train that would really benefit me (I don't plan training for capital ships). Also, after a long time you probably only play occasionally and dont give a damn if you have some specializations to V instead of IV, generally speaking.

So I wouldn't make long plans into the future because they will never fullfill themselves as planned :)
SinTeryx
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#26 - 2013-01-13 08:13:12 UTC
Crash Lander wrote:
Justin Valentine wrote:
+5s are very worth it look at it this way 2x+5 implants primary/second 180m isk after 3 months you will have an extra 180k sp..
180 000 sp for 180m isk? Bargain.
After 6 months it is 360k sp..

You cant compare the cost of implants with plex due to the fact time is priceless.



Somebody sell this man some implants. Time has a price. Its called character bazaar.


Time does have a price. When you go to school full time (18 credits) and have a full time job 38+ hours a week, waiting an extra 9 days 18 hours (according to ingame skill que) to have +5's while I sit in station and get a bit of trading done while I train core skills to IV or V seems worth it to me.

I would really like to thank everyone for their responses. Some have been incredibly helpful while others have been helpful but almost pushed me in the wrong direction. Thanks again.
-Sin

These may as well be farts in the wind but I have had a few beers since the start of this thread.

Scuzzy Logic
Space Spuds
#27 - 2013-01-14 14:11:02 UTC
Kirkwood Ross wrote:
If you are going to do activities in Eve that are safe to your pod then +5s are well worth it.


*MY SIDES*

There is no such thing in EVE. Well, maybe shipspinning. Dock up in jita and speculate on Spreadsheets Online, if that's your thing.
Ace Realist
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#28 - 2013-01-15 22:38:14 UTC
Canabi wrote:
SinTeryx wrote:
Thanks for all the responses guys. I still haven't decided what to do but the advice is helping push towards some other decisions. Unfortunately I can't use evemon because I have a mac FML especially because I would play with it for an hour and know exactly what I was going to do


SinTeryx wrote:
Unfortunately I can't use evemon because I have a mac FML especially because I would play with it for an hour and know exactly what I was going to do


SinTeryx wrote:
Unfortunately I can't use evemon because I have a mac FML


SinTeryx wrote:
I have a mac


The end.


I ended up laughing and crying since I just had a back tooth cut out, those damn mac's alwayse make me cry.
Lost Greybeard
Drunken Yordles
#29 - 2013-01-16 20:40:22 UTC
Short answer: NO

Long answer: Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo.

Slightly more nuanced answer: Cybernetics V is good to have, +5s are a waste of your time (or money if you're buying them with PLEX money). +4s are fine for basically whatever and if you're in a situation where you might actually be podded you probably wanna stick with +3s, since they can be replaced basically instantly form pocket change.
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#30 - 2013-01-18 13:55:52 UTC
Pros: +5 implants across the board is a Very Good Thing as they're the best investment you can make - i.e., your toon itself, and SP the one thing you can be sure of having forever unless you really screw up on your clone upgrades.

Cons: Jump clone is mandatory if going anywhere out of hisec, and pod flying is verbotten even in hisec - buy a dozen shuttles spread them everywhere as needed.

http://youtu.be/t0q2F8NsYQ0

Princess Saskia
Hyperfleet Industries
#31 - 2013-01-26 10:19:00 UTC
When I Start new alts I train cybernetics 5 first and then actually start training. Thats just how I roll though. I also do a remap

 ♥ 

xHOUSTONx
Doomheim
#32 - 2013-01-26 13:00:31 UTC
Princess Saskia wrote:
When I Start new alts I train cybernetics 5 first and then actually start training. Thats just how I roll though. I also do a remap


I've actually done the exact same thing, too early in my training to see the net results yet though. Cybernetics V completes in a little over a week.

..

Agolon
Insight Limited
#33 - 2013-01-29 12:59:59 UTC
I went with 5's on both my toons and don't regret it one bit.
If you want to do alot of pvp with frig's to start out join Red vs Blue since they don't pod ppl and it will let you get a feel of it.
Celeste Taylor
Ruby Dynasty
#34 - 2013-02-07 13:53:24 UTC
Princess Saskia wrote:
When I Start new alts I train cybernetics 5 first and then actually start training. Thats just how I roll though. I also do a remap


Same here. I wouldn't advise +5 on a first character who has money issues but +5s are a must for characters in the "oven." I did get this current character training on Cyber V early on after only getting most other skills up to level III, but by then a complete set of +5s were not that big of a financial deal.

I began my most recent character with last month's "Power of Two" deal and started that character off with Cyber V and a Int/Mem remap. In about 5 months I plan to switch to a Per/Will remap and pick up those related implants and will be ready to play in about a year when the first annual remap is ready to switch to Drones.
SinTeryx
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#35 - 2013-02-07 13:55:57 UTC
My 1 month is coming up here pretty quickly. I have been able to pull ~2 million skillpoints since first posting this...granted I am int/mem remapped and am training industry skills so I might be closer to 2.3 mil. I think if you can pull off getting +5's this early it is absolutley worth it.

These may as well be farts in the wind but I have had a few beers since the start of this thread.

Onyx Nyx
Trillium Invariant
Honorable Third Party
#36 - 2013-02-07 14:39:08 UTC
For now, I think you should settle for +4 and once you got some jump clones up, designate one of them as your "training" clone and then you can seriously start thinking about +5s.

I kill kittens, and puppies and bunnies. I maim toddlers and teens and then more.

  • Richard (http://www.lfgcomic.com/)
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