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Remove Medium / Large Static Bubbles

First post
Author
Sentient Blade
Crisis Atmosphere
Coalition of the Unfortunate
#1 - 2012-12-26 20:54:08 UTC
So a little back-story for this post. I've spent the last 3 or 4 hours trying to engage in a little solo PVP flying destroyers, cruisers and the likes. I've tried to make my way into nullsec where I would be free to engage without worrying about security status.

I was up for some good PVP, and I found the game lacking.

One of the biggest obsticles to getting decent fights is the presence of medium and large mobile disruption bubbles on the paths into nullsec, some covering gates entirely, sometimes 10, 20 or more out to a range of some 30, 40 or 50 km.

This gives the equivilent of a half dozen heavy interdictors constantly on guard for no effort at all, ships simply sit at range and give anything which comes in the choice of either burning back to the gate, or being exploded from range because there is an infinite point on them for dozens of KM in every which direction.

I question why it is good gameplay to allow a gate to be locked down with so many bubbles that traversal in most ships becomes extremely impractical. I question why 1 or 2 people have the power to infinite-point every ship which comes in, without commiting a single ship to the task.

Individual Proposals:

* Remove medium and large static warp bubbles. Allow small ones to remain as drag / catch bubbles.

* Prevent bubbles from being anchored within (radius + 5 / 10km) of another static bubble.

* Prevent bubbles from being anchored within 30km of a gate.

My thinking is that if a person wants to bring 20 dictors he or she is welcome to, but allowing a gate to be surrounded with 40 or 40km of infinite warp scramble strength without comiting a single ship is poor design.
masternerdguy
Doomheim
#2 - 2012-12-26 20:55:22 UTC
EVE is not balanced around solo pvp.

Things are only impossible until they are not.

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#3 - 2012-12-26 21:18:10 UTC
Sentient Blade wrote:
I question why it is good gameplay to allow a gate to be locked down with so many bubbles that traversal in most ships becomes extremely impractical.
Because there needs to be a way to somewhat secure your borders and, at least initially, slow down incoming forces.
Romvex
TURN LEFT
#4 - 2012-12-26 22:52:01 UTC
masternerdguy wrote:
EVE is not balanced around solo pvp.

Sentient Blade
Crisis Atmosphere
Coalition of the Unfortunate
#5 - 2012-12-26 22:59:53 UTC
A nifty phrase, but what's the relevance?
Bobo Cindekela
Doomheim
#6 - 2012-12-26 23:34:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Bobo Cindekela
the relevence is that you are only worried about your own playstyle in the proposals you make

there are plenty of people who live in those areas that don't want random solo pvpeenesses to be swarming them with destroyers, and they have dedicated alot of isk (bubbles arent free last I checked) to anchor bubbles and camp gates to secure their claimed boundaries

you in the meantime just fit up some rat loot on a destroyer and want to **** in their cereal

your investment into the game pales in comparison to the lengths they are going
your the guy in the lowsec pic, tryin to live in the nullsec pic and your angry that the mafia killed your ship

You are about to engage in an arguement with a forum alt,  this is your final warning.

Sentient Blade
Crisis Atmosphere
Coalition of the Unfortunate
#7 - 2012-12-26 23:48:32 UTC
Well, I actually spent most of the last couple of years living in nullsec, where we would make effective use drag and catch bubles. However, if we needed to bubble an incoming fleet, we would put either an Onyx or Broadsword on field as static bubbles did not offer the flexibility we needed.

That said, there's a difference between tactical bubbles, and covering a gate with large bubbles in every direction. There should need to be a comitment to lock down a gate so severely. As I said, if this were HICs or dictors on every gate, and god knows I've ran into a few (hundred) in my time in Null, then I'd have no problem with it.
Zan Shiro
Doomheim
#8 - 2012-12-26 23:53:42 UTC
Sentient Blade wrote:
A nifty phrase, but what's the relevance?



bubble camp ='s bubble camp breaking fleet. Ie. unless really good/lucky bring some friends to bum rush the stage as it were.

Gratz, you chose space where the occupants give at least 2 craps about system secuity. Don't like the bubbles, don't roam the space. Lots of crews in 0.0 do not do bubble camps perimeter defences full time and you can find other stomping grounds.

Or be real patient. Unless really disciplined or this bubble net is bringing in nice catches often most of these camps eventually dissolve as people start going man do we really need to be here daily. .
Crimeo Khamsi
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#9 - 2012-12-27 04:30:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Crimeo Khamsi
If you can find a station somewhere in the null region of interest that will let you dock and refit, then it's not that hard.

You can get past those gates in either direction the significant majority of the time in any destroyer with just a MWD and a proto or improved cloaking device.

They usually arent very heavily camped by active players (as you point out), which means that you can almost always get past by cloak + MWD for a boost of speed that will move you far enough away to stop them from decloaking you at range 2000m. Then once you've lost them, you just slowly troll your way out of the bubble at 50m/s or whatever with cloak on, align manually, and warp off or gate jump once you get where you need to be.

The station that is dockable allows you to refit to PVP fit once you get past (and then refit to gate running again at the end of the roam)

Be wary of any ships that might have a lot of drones, most of all (on the way back out, as you observe from afar with your cloak and dscan). Those are the real killers for people running with low quality cloaks.
Mars Theran
Foreign Interloper
#10 - 2012-12-27 08:38:39 UTC
Bubbles already have a minimum anchorable distance iirc, though I can't recall exactly what it is, I'm fairly certain it applies to all objects in space aside from Drones and player ships.

Also, I see no reason why Medium and Large bubbles should be removed. They are there for a reason, and it is to do exactly what you think they shouldn't be doing. They are a Nullsec only device intended to allow players there to create effective blockades, barriers to entry or egress.

I didn't train Anchoring V for no reason at all; still have to get Propulsion Jamming V to use the good ones though.
zubzubzubzubzubzubzubzub
Mole Guy
Bob's Bait and Tackle
High Bear Nation.
#11 - 2012-12-27 16:57:19 UTC
you think those bubbles you hit were bad, you should traverse my 2 t2 large that i bog a gate down with when i perma-camp it.

80km from side to side. huggins/rapiers go-go-go, snipers with sniper drones at the ready......fire!

dont mess with my bubbles. bubbles are tactical, be it anchored or mobile. have you encountered a cloaky hic drag bubble?
a cloaky hic drag bubble that drags you past a gate into a guantlet of smart bombing bs's with bombers launching bombs into the middle?

welcome to null sec boot. skewl is in session.
Mole Guy
Bob's Bait and Tackle
High Bear Nation.
#12 - 2012-12-27 16:58:20 UTC
5km minimal. 2 t2 large set 5001m from a gate on each side will totally enclose a regional gate for a loooong way...
Sentient Blade
Crisis Atmosphere
Coalition of the Unfortunate
#13 - 2012-12-27 16:59:30 UTC
Mole Guy wrote:
have you encountered a cloaky hic drag bubble?
a cloaky hic drag bubble that drags you past a gate into a guantlet of smart bombing bs's with bombers launching bombs into the middle?


Many times. My own Onyx has a cloak on it.
sabre906
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2012-12-27 17:40:34 UTC
Supported. The biggest problem with sov null is deep sov is too safe. Large blobs that ram through camps will never solve this problem, as the nullbears dock up. Only small gang and soloers who don't catch enough attention will do the job.

tl;dr:
Bubbles makes deep sov safer than highsec. It's not supposed to be safe.
masternerdguy
Doomheim
#15 - 2012-12-27 19:03:41 UTC
sabre906 wrote:
Supported. The biggest problem with sov null is deep sov is too safe. Large blobs that ram through camps will never solve this problem, as the nullbears dock up. Only small gang and soloers who don't catch enough attention will do the job.

tl;dr:
Bubbles makes deep sov safer than highsec. It's not supposed to be safe.


The biggest problem with empire is that deep empire is too safe.

Things are only impossible until they are not.

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#16 - 2012-12-27 19:09:47 UTC
sabre906 wrote:
Bubbles makes deep sov safer than highsec. It's not supposed to be safe.
It is supposed to be as safe as players make it with the tools at their disposal. Bubbles are one of those tools, but on their own, the safety they provide is pretty much nil.
Mole Guy
Bob's Bait and Tackle
High Bear Nation.
#17 - 2012-12-27 19:16:00 UTC
just because its null sec and no laws exist doesnt mean we have to fight tooth and nail every day.

the belt rats are dangerous to mining ships, the anoms are tough, its dangerous trying to organize and execute logistics in and out of null, deep or not.
its dangerous because little shyts keep showing up and interfering with our op. its dangerous because big shyts show up with carriers, dreads, titans and supers and blast everything to shreds and take over our system in which we loose everything.

i love the risk of null sec. the dangers involved with living there. i can govern this area as i see fit. fortify its walls to keep out the unwanted...

if i put 25 bubbles on the gate to our pocket like we did in provi, thats MY space, i can do that. use the jump bridge or stay the hell out.
wait...u arent allowed to use the jb? u dont belong then. use the gate, suffer the bubbles and suck up the bombs coming your way....traverse the 85k of bubble you have to go through to get to me while i shoot holes in your pride and joy...

in the words of eddie murphy, "this is MY house...if u dont like it, you can get da phuk out!"

=)
Mole Guy
Bob's Bait and Tackle
High Bear Nation.
#18 - 2012-12-27 20:39:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Mole Guy
masternerdguy wrote:
sabre906 wrote:
Supported. The biggest problem with sov null is deep sov is too safe. Large blobs that ram through camps will never solve this problem, as the nullbears dock up. Only small gang and soloers who don't catch enough attention will do the job.

tl;dr:
Bubbles makes deep sov safer than highsec. It's not supposed to be safe.


The biggest problem with empire is that deep empire is too safe.



its only safe because we fight tooth and nail to keep it that way.
everyday there are interlopers who come in and try to gank our industry core. they hit us 3:1, yet the dodge our 3:1 roaming gank "death to interlopers" squad thats cruisin lookin for them.
3:1=9:3 same odds.

this is every day. dont say we are too safe, every pocket has afk cloakers and interlopers.
the nullbears dock to get their pvp ships (atleast we do). usually, with intel channel, we are actually setup when u get there...and u run.
Seranova Farreach
Biomass Negative
#19 - 2012-12-29 07:56:23 UTC
for solo pvp you would be better luck in lowsec. take that sec hit in the Ass then rat your sec status up again or MAN UP and join Caldari Militia! (cause winmatar is just full of Winning team joiners cause of goons.. and gallente is full of traitors.. and amarr militia hasnt seen any action in years)

[u]___________________ http://i.imgur.com/d9Ee2ik.jpg[/u]

ISD Suvetar
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#20 - 2012-12-29 17:39:51 UTC
Hi,

A post with a personal attack was removed; please follow the rules even if you disagree with an idea, then do so constructively.

Thanks.

[b]ISD Suvetar Captain/Commando Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department[/b]

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