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You CANT Nerf HighSec!

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Author
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#1141 - 2012-12-25 23:16:35 UTC
La Nariz wrote:
This is a "if you nerf highsec ship prices will go up and that is bad," and a "if you nerf highsec people will unsub."

Luckily the OP already answers this:

7) If High Sec were nerfed ship costs would increase massively and that is bad.

- The absolute price of ships doesn’t really matter, what matters is how much effort it takes to get set up with a ship that can compete, whether a battleship or a mining barge. With a more dynamic eco-system outside High Sec the barriers to entry for all professions would be lower and so the fact that an individual ship costs more would not matter.

16) I’ll quit if you nerf High Sec, so will many others, the game will crash and CCP will go bankrupt!

- Firstly if you are a person who will rage quit when they don’t get what they want how long will you stay in the game for anyway? You’re probably not a legacy player.

- Secondly people subscribe to EVE because it is awesome, and it’s gameplay makes it into the gaming press because of it’s awesomeness. This is what CCP need to protect for the long term health of the game and overall profitability, not pandering to an irrational few.

Pandering to an irrational mass is the way to go. Go highsec~

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Elrich Kouvo
Doomheim
#1142 - 2012-12-25 23:17:16 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Natsett Amuinn wrote:
NPC corps undermine the gameplay that CCP went to great length to provide the tools to facilitate. They expect us to take part in that stuff, not use the NPC corps to get around it.

Pretty sure undeccability is like the CONCORD npc protection, it's something you must buff constantly because otherwise people will unsub and EVE will die.

The true nature of EVE is afking with NPCs protecting you from any consequences of your idiocy or the like. By the way, buff freighter EHP.

LOL naw Hulkageddon proved that high sec ain't safe at all.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#1143 - 2012-12-25 23:19:44 UTC
Elrich Kouvo wrote:
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Natsett Amuinn wrote:
NPC corps undermine the gameplay that CCP went to great length to provide the tools to facilitate. They expect us to take part in that stuff, not use the NPC corps to get around it.

Pretty sure undeccability is like the CONCORD npc protection, it's something you must buff constantly because otherwise people will unsub and EVE will die.

The true nature of EVE is afking with NPCs protecting you from any consequences of your idiocy or the like. By the way, buff freighter EHP.

LOL naw Hulkageddon proved that high sec ain't safe at all.

No it didn't. All it proved is that you can still die if you're a complete moron. There are plenty of miners who got through every hulkageddon just fine.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)

Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#1144 - 2012-12-25 23:22:56 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Elrich Kouvo wrote:
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Natsett Amuinn wrote:
NPC corps undermine the gameplay that CCP went to great length to provide the tools to facilitate. They expect us to take part in that stuff, not use the NPC corps to get around it.

Pretty sure undeccability is like the CONCORD npc protection, it's something you must buff constantly because otherwise people will unsub and EVE will die.

The true nature of EVE is afking with NPCs protecting you from any consequences of your idiocy or the like. By the way, buff freighter EHP.

LOL naw Hulkageddon proved that high sec ain't safe at all.

No it didn't. All it proved is that you can still die if you're a complete moron. There are plenty of miners who got through every hulkageddon just fine.

Don't worry we've gotten the barges buffed. It'll be very different the next time around !

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Luanda Heartbreaker
#1145 - 2012-12-26 03:09:44 UTC
Bump Truck wrote:

1) If you nerf high sec I won’t be able to play anymore!

- A nerf doesn’t mean taking away any activities, it simply means making them less profitable. If missions paid 1% less they would still be worth it, what if it was 10% or 15%? You can still mine if the roids yield 8% less ore per cycle. You can do everything you can do now, just for less profit.


making enough isk to pay your sub with a solo toon is hard and boring enugh (im not talking about players with 10 research and manufacturer alts, just solo, casual players) and i didnt talk about buying ship to be killed in. living in highsec is like getting an other job. 90% of playtime is working for ur plex. in 0.0 its just a lazy afternoon. what do u want to still nerf on it?

Bump Truck wrote:

5) Nobody could ever mine/mission in low, they would be instantly killed by pirates.

- Again a solo retriever is a tempting target but a combined fleet of PVPers and miners/PVEers with warp core stabilisers and scouts would be much harder to take down. Again it’s feasible; it just requires some skill and some friends.


you are either ignorant or just dont know what are u talking about.
-solo casual players are mostly alone or have 1-2 friends. they have no chance against even ONE single pirate. not everybody want to keep alts and set them to sit afk to give command bonuses, but most of the pirates do. and we didnt even talk about the hassle to warp out and back every time a pirate attack takes more time than do 5 solo mission in highsec or kill 10 anomalies in a stable 0.0. where the reward worth it? what reward can make it worth?

-big fleets will insta attract PL like alliances and you have a good chance of a hotdrop, very good.

Bump Truck wrote:

6) I pay my subscription so I should be able to play however I want, it’s a SANDBOX.

- This is not the meaning of a sandbox, I pay my sub too, can I have a ship that respawns? No, because it would be too damaging to industry. In the same way a super safe High Sec with massive rewards is too damaging to the rest of the game and overall balance.


where are those massive rewards for a casual player? if u show it i insta move back to highsec. earning in 0.0 is already fun compared to highsec ones, there is more chane to pick ur targets so pvp is also more fun. what are we talking about?

Bump Truck wrote:

9) I enjoy the game the way it is, why change it?

- The fact that 71% of toons live in High Sec is a clear indication that it is too good and may be in need of a Nerf. High Sec is the perfect storm, it has great mining, all the trade hubs, the vast majority of the manufacturing slots and really great high level missions, all while being protected and safe. The rewards easily outbalance the risks and so it needs rebalancing. It’s not really a personality clash between players, it’s a case of keeping the game true to it’s guiding principles.


it just clear indication that most of the ppl like to spend their time in a peaceful sims instead of being in fear for their toon or ship, or just simply would hate to live under the rule of an unknown person. make the game even harder for that 71% and u will kill the 71% of the playerbase of eve. with that will die ur precious 0.0 and lowsec

Bump Truck wrote:

13) This is just about some players trying to force everyone to play like them.

- It really isn’t, diversity in the game is obviously really important, the vast majority of players specialise and that is a good thing. This is about balancing the regions of the game.


you cant balance the regions. its like to try to make the getto as attractive as Paris. its just impossible. not all like to be surrounded by morons whose only joy if they can make me feel bad. there are enough griefers in highsec already. or even too many


14) You broke null and now you want to break highsec too, go away!

- No player caused the problems null is now facing. HighSec produces goods so cheap and in such great supply it’s not worth doing industry in null. If you do it’s an unnecessary hassle and you open yourself to attack by your enemies. This causes the majority of moneymaking to be done in highsec, making things worse.


0.0 is broken by huge alliances who care only of themselves and make that unplayable to others. its not cos 0.0 mining or industry doesnt worth it. make allinaces maxed in playernumber 50, and more corp will move into 0.0. destroy commandships makes a tengu undestroyable and more will go to lowsec...
Malphilos
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1146 - 2012-12-26 03:19:53 UTC
Luanda Heartbreaker wrote:

0.0 is broken by huge alliances who care only of themselves and make that unplayable to others.


That's not broken, that's by design.

The broken part is that the outcome turns out not to be all that "compelling".
Luanda Heartbreaker
#1147 - 2012-12-26 03:29:33 UTC
Malphilos wrote:
Luanda Heartbreaker wrote:

0.0 is broken by huge alliances who care only of themselves and make that unplayable to others.


That's not broken, that's by design.



if they create something scare away everybody, dont complain if nobody goes there...
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#1148 - 2012-12-26 04:15:05 UTC
Luanda Heartbreaker wrote:
Malphilos wrote:
Luanda Heartbreaker wrote:

0.0 is broken by huge alliances who care only of themselves and make that unplayable to others.

That's not broken, that's by design.

if they create something scare away everybody, dont complain if nobody goes there...

We have plenty of newbies, don't worry about them.

Really, they don't need to be told how horrible nullsec is or the joys of mining. So please don't.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1149 - 2012-12-26 04:50:21 UTC
Luanda Heartbreaker wrote:
:words: :words: :words:


The op literally answers every point you made. Nullsec is player made, I know you really hate our amazingly successful diplomatic relations but whining about blues is pointless. We made friends, you can make friends too in fact CCP wants you to make friends. That's what nullsec is for building your own empires and if that includes maintaining inter-empire relations then guess what we're going to have blues. I'd fully support removing local from base nullsec as long as we could install an upgrade that allows us to have local for only blues/alliance/corporation members. It's player made local then in the player made empire section of space.

This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Improve the forums, support this idea: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=345133

Malphilos
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1150 - 2012-12-26 04:51:12 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Luanda Heartbreaker wrote:
Malphilos wrote:
Luanda Heartbreaker wrote:

0.0 is broken by huge alliances who care only of themselves and make that unplayable to others.

That's not broken, that's by design.

if they create something scare away everybody, dont complain if nobody goes there...

We have plenty of newbies,....


Hence the hue and cry to get more people to come to null, and to buff/nerf to make it more interesting.

?

Roll
Frying Doom
#1151 - 2012-12-26 04:53:53 UTC
La Nariz wrote:
Luanda Heartbreaker wrote:
:words: :words: :words:


The op literally answers every point you made. Nullsec is player made, I know you really hate our amazingly successful diplomatic relations but whining about blues is pointless. We made friends, you can make friends too in fact CCP wants you to make friends. That's what nullsec is for building your own empires and if that includes maintaining inter-empire relations then guess what we're going to have blues. I'd fully support removing local from base nullsec as long as we could install an upgrade that allows us to have local for only blues/alliance/corporation members. It's player made local then in the player made empire section of space.

So havent you yourself argued against a Null buff?

The mining income is so low due to all the blues, so now so many people can mine.

The risk level has dropped so much, just have a look at the number of barges destroyed in the last year in Null vs Hi-sec.

You diplomacy is successful, congrats. You have managed to make Sov Null the most boring space in the game.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!

La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1152 - 2012-12-26 05:10:37 UTC
Malphilos wrote:
Hence the hue and cry to get more people to come to null, and to buff/nerf to make it more interesting.

?

Roll


The cry is an attempt to balance highsec risk:reward and bring it inline with the rest of the game. Way to miss out on the last 57 pages of thread.

This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Improve the forums, support this idea: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=345133

Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#1153 - 2012-12-26 05:12:08 UTC
La Nariz wrote:
Malphilos wrote:
Hence the hue and cry to get more people to come to null, and to buff/nerf to make it more interesting.

?

Roll

The cry is an attempt to balance highsec risk:reward and bring it inline with the rest of the game. Way to miss out on the last 57 pages of thread.

If you want, you can always try being a newbie again and join a blob....

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1154 - 2012-12-26 05:16:27 UTC
Frying Doom wrote:

So havent you yourself argued against a Null buff?

The mining income is so low due to all the blues, so now so many people can mine.

The risk level has dropped so much, just have a look at the number of barges destroyed in the last year in Null vs Hi-sec.

You diplomacy is successful, congrats. You have managed to make Sov Null the most boring space in the game.


Now I know I would be better off talking to a wall here but I will dignify your post with a response because it is Christmas, thank Santa for it. I haven't argued against a null buff, I have argued against highsec buffs and for highsec nerfs. The difference here is that it is not NPC given, we made what we have and we protect what we have. If we don't protect what we have and maintain our space those blues we built all go away. The rest of your post about mining in nullsec being worthless because of blues is all terrible and not worth anymore of response than I have given you here.

This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Improve the forums, support this idea: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=345133

La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1155 - 2012-12-26 05:17:25 UTC  |  Edited by: La Nariz
Alavaria Fera wrote:
If you want, you can always try being a newbie again and join a blob....


I am too busy teaching my adopted newbies to go on boat fleets :shobon:. I should bring them to Miniluv though and try to inject some risk into highsec.

This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Improve the forums, support this idea: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=345133

Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#1156 - 2012-12-26 05:21:58 UTC
La Nariz wrote:
Alavaria Fera wrote:
If you want, you can always try being a newbie again and join a blob....

I am too busy teaching my adopted newbies to go on boat fleets :shobon:. I should bring them to Miniluv though and try to inject some risk into highsec.

Well you can turn them into evil demonic ~bumpers~ or something. I was talking to the other guy crying about nullsec though. Sometimes, you have to realize that CONCORD isn't protection that everyone leans so heavily on that we might have a broken leg.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

GetSirrus
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#1157 - 2012-12-26 08:05:52 UTC
La Nariz wrote:
The op literally answers every point you made. Nullsec is player made, I know you really hate our amazingly successful diplomatic relations but whining about blues is pointless. We made friends, you can make friends too in fact CCP wants you to make friends. That's what nullsec is for building your own empires and if that includes maintaining inter-empire relations then guess what we're going to have blues. I'd fully support removing local from base nullsec as long as we could install an upgrade that allows us to have local for only blues/alliance/corporation members. It's player made local then in the player made empire section of space.



What CCP intends is: Harvest, Build, Destory. In endless cycle. What happens when everybody is blue (or runs away "we didn't want that space anyway"). Well if you are all friends the third link in the chain does not happen. So, maybe CCP does not intended null to do all friends afterall? Doesn't everybody keep saying this is a PvP game?
Frying Doom
#1158 - 2012-12-26 08:13:37 UTC
GetSirrus wrote:
La Nariz wrote:
The op literally answers every point you made. Nullsec is player made, I know you really hate our amazingly successful diplomatic relations but whining about blues is pointless. We made friends, you can make friends too in fact CCP wants you to make friends. That's what nullsec is for building your own empires and if that includes maintaining inter-empire relations then guess what we're going to have blues. I'd fully support removing local from base nullsec as long as we could install an upgrade that allows us to have local for only blues/alliance/corporation members. It's player made local then in the player made empire section of space.



What CCP intends is: Harvest, Build, Destory. In endless cycle. What happens when everybody is blue (or runs away "we didn't want that space anyway"). Well if you are all friends the third link in the chain does not happen. So, maybe CCP does not intended null to do all friends afterall? Doesn't everybody keep saying this is a PvP game?

Nope its only a pvp game in Hi, lo and WHs, Null is set up to see if you can blue enough people to crash the database.

So I suppose it is player vs player. Who can blue who, first Big smile

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!

Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#1159 - 2012-12-26 08:20:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Vaerah Vahrokha
GetSirrus wrote:
La Nariz wrote:
The op literally answers every point you made. Nullsec is player made, I know you really hate our amazingly successful diplomatic relations but whining about blues is pointless. We made friends, you can make friends too in fact CCP wants you to make friends. That's what nullsec is for building your own empires and if that includes maintaining inter-empire relations then guess what we're going to have blues. I'd fully support removing local from base nullsec as long as we could install an upgrade that allows us to have local for only blues/alliance/corporation members. It's player made local then in the player made empire section of space.



What CCP intends is: Harvest, Build, Destory. In endless cycle. What happens when everybody is blue (or runs away "we didn't want that space anyway"). Well if you are all friends the third link in the chain does not happen. So, maybe CCP does not intended null to do all friends afterall? Doesn't everybody keep saying this is a PvP game?


No, they entertrain a vision where they build an all encompassing empire that spans the whole null sec (and not only there), where people live in their farms yet their non ISK faucet productions HAVE to have high revenue (competition even adjacent system neighbours? What's that? We SHALL mine all together megacyte at 10k per unit), where any opposition is crushed (yet demand of ~gudfites~), where the whole other players HAVE to play "as intended" else "they are playing wrong", where they control whatever markets they want yet it's everybody else's fault if stuff is not sitting at their home... Where everybody in the end is a lovely working and taxed ant under the wise directions of the Queen (the More Equals among Equals).

Basically the perfect incarnation of an all encompassing and swallowing para-socialist utopia, with specific EvE mechanics created or twisted to avoid it ends in the unavoidable dead ends all the socialist utopias meet: ~real human egos and greed~, debt, taxes, down levelling, on long term, meritocracy ban that leads to apathy and self disintegration.
Elena Melkan
Magellanic Itg
Goonswarm Federation
#1160 - 2012-12-26 09:34:03 UTC
GetSirrus wrote:
La Nariz wrote:
The op literally answers every point you made. Nullsec is player made, I know you really hate our amazingly successful diplomatic relations but whining about blues is pointless. We made friends, you can make friends too in fact CCP wants you to make friends. That's what nullsec is for building your own empires and if that includes maintaining inter-empire relations then guess what we're going to have blues. I'd fully support removing local from base nullsec as long as we could install an upgrade that allows us to have local for only blues/alliance/corporation members. It's player made local then in the player made empire section of space.



What CCP intends is: Harvest, Build, Destory. In endless cycle. What happens when everybody is blue (or runs away "we didn't want that space anyway"). Well if you are all friends the third link in the chain does not happen. So, maybe CCP does not intended null to do all friends afterall? Doesn't everybody keep saying this is a PvP game?

"What happens when everybody is blue" won't ever happen. Not very likely, anyway. There is always resistance.

It is rather funny that people, who obviously don't have a clue what's going on, are making assumptions on the forums. Very well, go on, it's always amusing to read these threads.