EVE General Discussion

CONCORD builds and protects, highsec benefits. In the NPC corp alliance.

Assuming a nerf and buff, the alts that belong to nullsec players will move to nullsec, the rest for the most part will remain in a much nerfed hi-sec. If they can't compete with nullsec they will lose money and go out of business.

Well, I dont have 16hrs a day to work at a video game. I have a real life for that. Just out of curiosity, when exactly do you have fun?

It isn't 16 hours every day obviously

During the actual fights its fun.

That's right you owe nullsec nothing, this entire thread has nothing to do with owing nullsec anything, its all about balancing risk:reward.

Okay to bridge the understanding gap here lets do a thought experiment. Highsec industry is nerfed the almost free npc given resources have been vastly reduced. The oppressive NPC empires have raised taxes on everything. So you and your small group of friends decide you like mining and you aren't going to put up with that crap anymore. You and your friends begin a corporation, get a POS with refining mods, and set it up in highsec. Now your POS has much better refining and the tax of the oppressive npc empire isn't as arduous now that you can refine better.

Some other corporation gets mad that you are doing so well and decides that they want that to stop. So they wardec you and attack your POS.* Now you successfully defend your POS, so now you can continue to receive the benefit of having better refining than other people. One day one of your friends decides to get mouthy in local and angers a more powerful corporation. This more powerful corporation wardecs you and you fail at defending the POS, it is destroyed (same as surrendering by taking down the POS).* Now you no longer have better refining than other people.

In that experiment you and your friends built something to further a goal you set (being better miners). In the first scenario you made something valuable and defended it allowing you to have greater reward than others. In the second scenario you made something valuable and failed to defend it losing your advantage over other miners. In both scenarios no one had any advantage over each other using resources that were handed to you by NPCs.

*Excludes regular wardec evading shenanigans that should be fixed.

Don't worry, You CANT Nerf HighSec!

Hello and Merry Christmas.

Another partial off-topic that replies to your post.

I have an insane degree of competitivity, I can be aggressive, I don't lack of ego.
Back when I had time to play enough I have always belonged to high ranks (if not leadership) of hard core PvE and PvP guilds. Not hard core due (just) to number of hours played but because trying to get in the top 30 guilds worldwide, top killers, largest own Keep Holders and so on.
I and my team would engage whatever came across my group in a position of advantage (numbers were not often the advantage) and farm them and humiliate them if they were "known sworn enemies".

The only differences I have vs some of you are: I don't scam, I discover exploits but refrain from using them and I know when to stop the greed (others don't... and thet get boomerang and barges nerfs when they could have farmed faces forever...) . I used to stop not because of being a kindly mannered angel, but because I could forever farm people without enticing the developers into an obvious subsequent nerf.

Also, I am not a grunt, never been but twice in my life... and it lasted little.
Also, I don't chase moving goals, I am a moving goal, never stopping creating trouble and basically "content".

I have born as shameless, disturbingly nasty d!ckhead and a lot of other "properties" that could put me in your ranks with honor. When Weaselior tells I am "risk averse", he makes me grin, I could have been in Privateers outside Jita if I still had the time and the age for that.

These days - I have elected EvE as my retirement game (EvE-Search for these keywords for past threads) and I have also slowed down A LOT in my behaviors.
I am even trying to change and - with GREAT GREAT fatigue - to become decent, but the old me often still shows between the "cracks".

Are those qualities that make most people consider "good"? No idea, probably not. But I am like that, sometimes even against my own "new course".

Its not about nerfing anymore its about change the game now..... I dont see how you can fixs that. How about people that starting the game and never leave the high sec..

It is not about changing the game at all there is a highsec nerf in there, more highsec taxes, less efficient refiners, reduction in available industrial lines and an increase in cost to use them. There was a reward for social interaction, forming a corporation, the ability to put up a POS. There was a reward for defending something you invested in, continued higher profitability compared to those who only used NPC lines. There was a removal of reward for failing to defend something you invested in, the destruction of the POS. There were assumed warranted fixes but that is all. I have no idea where you are getting "its about changing the game" and you don't even make a point/argument.

If you can't get the general message that player built things should be intrinsically better and more rewarding than anything NPC given, I don't know what to tell you.

Who cares if they stay in high sec?

Why do you guys keep going to this?

If you want to spend the next 10 years playing in high sec that's great; do it. Just do it in a player run corp; not the NPC corp making billions upon billions of isk manufacturing T2 items with zero risk, and minimal effort.


The rational among us understand that you shouldn't be forced to play outside of high sec.
We also understand that you shouldn't be allowed to live in the starter corp.

Some of you keep trying to argue around the fact that there is NO penalty for playing in the NPC corp, THAT is a big problem.
A lot of the industry problems don't have anything to do with WHERE you play, but HOW you play. NPC corp industrialists do not receive any form of a penalty for staying in a corp that can't be war decced.

Taxes are not a factor for anyone but the serious min/ maxers.

There is nothing you can do in a player run corp, outside of the most advanced industrial work that the majority of people will never do because of the way those jobs function, that you can not do in the NPC corp. As a general industrial, as in people who build and sell T2 mods and ships, moving to a player corp only reduces the tax you pay; which isn't an impactor anyways.

You do not get better refining.
You do not get cheaper manufacturing. (free manufaturing lines isn't really saying much considering how few there are and how cheap lines in the NPC stations can be.)
You do not not more manufacturing slots.

RnD is pretty much the only thing that really benefits from joining a player run corp, and then only if you're the type of person that really doesn't want to grind missions.

The other stuff? Faster production or research lines or something?
Good lord, if you can't even notice it, how much of a benefit can it be? I pay less taxes, awesome, you can sell like 50x the amount of crap in a single day than I can.



Being in a high sec corporation is no better than being in a null one, except for the luxury of being in the busies regions of space. Aside from that the rank and file guy in a high sec indi corp isn't benefiting more from being in that corp then he already was being in the NPC one. The only thing he did was swap an undeccable corp for one that is deccable.

It shouldn't matter where you play.
If you join a player run corp there should be a noticable difference in potential then if you just stay in the NPC ones.
No amount of "buffing" can fix it, when everything is already on par and to closeto perfect to make any buff noticeable.

Being the best in high sec should carry a cost. That cost should be war decs.

YOU SHOULD NOT BE ALLOWED TO INFLUENCE THE MARKET TO SUCH AN ENORMOUS EXTENT WITHOUT OTHER GROUPS BEING ABLE TO INFLUENCE YOU.

The guys that live in high sec, within a player run corp, who do not disband there corp and hide when someone war decs them, should be the guys reaping the most reward in high sec; NOT the guys in the NPC corps.

When people use the NPC corps as a sheild, there's an obvious problem. When so many people have no problem with disbanding a corp and rejoining an NPC corp just because there's a war dec, there's an obvious imbalance.

They wouldn't be abandoning corporations left and right if they were actually losing something of value!
The fact they do this without a care in the world makes it perfectly obvious that nothing of value is being lost.

That is not balance.