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You CANT Nerf HighSec!

First post First post First post
Author
Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#2161 - 2013-01-04 08:27:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Lord Zim
GetSirrus wrote:
CONCORD protection

Keep seeing this throughout the thread. Since when does CONCORD protect anything? Have suicide ganks ceased?!

Can I sit in hisec in a freighter with 93 ships in its hold, and not get ganked? Yes? Why golly gosh, I think concord might possibly have some protectional value after all! Who'd've thought!

GetSirrus wrote:
wealthy NPC dwelling industrialist

I would be very keen to hear how such a player maintains blueprints. NPC players can not anchor a tower. Without a tower, there is a reliance on public slots. Upto 40days waiting time for a research slot in high-sec? If this is an isk printing machine, then the handle's turning really slowly. And tech2 BPO (done to death already) earn marginal returns.

Put up a tower in lowsec, open up a corp hangar in a station, research from there.

This isn't rocket science.

GetSirrus wrote:
barge buff

Everybody now flies a Mack. Interesting complaint. Where was this level of concern when everybody flew a hulk? (and the crowd is silent). Indeed lets widen the parameters on this. For some time the top three ships in Eve were Hulk, Drake and Hurricane. (maybe still are - CCP we need more stats). There was the occasional thread about "OP Drake" but it was never taken seriously. So, again not really an issue when one ship is the best to use. (until the missile nerf and following threadnaught) but everybody in a mack is definately imbalanced?!

I, too, think a ship which lets me press a button every 3-5 minutes and can hold 45 minutes or whatever it is worth of mining is just a-ok. Just like having the biggest ship in the eve universe blap anything down to the smallest ship with impunity was a-ok until CCP nerfed them through a hack. Roll

GetSirrus wrote:
Miners still don't tank, don't observe local or d-scan nor do they bother with alignment to warp. Not seeing a problem here which needs CCP intervention.

Guess we'll have to increase the HP even further, then, or completely remove any and all aggression in hisec.

GetSirrus wrote:
As for high sec industry, I figured out sometime ago how to really cripple it. And I am smugly amused that such an obvious solution hasn't been tried or even discovered by players who pride themselves on being complete bastards.

Hey, if you want to throw away your mineral, go ahead and fart around in hisec and setup 30 day slots and cancelling them. I'm sure you'll have the stamina to keep this going for oh I dunno 5 minutes?

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat

Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#2162 - 2013-01-04 08:29:32 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
GetSirrus wrote:
As for high sec industry, I figured out sometime ago how to really cripple it. And I am smugly amused that such an obvious solution hasn't been tried or even discovered by players who pride themselves on being complete bastards.

No you haven't. If you had you would have done so by now instead of trying to impress us with talk.
Come back when you have something to show for your boasting.

You don't believe the forums alt?


What if it wasn't an alt? Is that possible?
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#2163 - 2013-01-04 08:31:07 UTC
Does anyone care?

Enjoying the rain today? ;)

Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#2164 - 2013-01-04 08:41:17 UTC
Tesal wrote:
CCP doesn't just look at forum posts to determine what they nerf/buff, they look at the numbers too. There are 16,000 dead exhumers on the Goon leader board. That number probably did more to bring on the barge nerf than countless miner posts on the forums. I wrote on the forums long before the nerf that CCP would intervene. I saw the numbers on the leader board and came to that conclusion. It was blatantly obvious that something needed to be done.

My bet is that CCP will look at this "Nerf Hi-sec" campaign and will run the numbers for various scenarios and will conclude that the costs outweigh the benefits. They will throw a bone to null, and that will be that.

Can I have some rage filled tears now?


You'll get your tears when they run the numbers, compare the amount of industry taking place in hi-sec to that in sov space and rebalance accordingly.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#2165 - 2013-01-04 08:50:42 UTC
Except they'll obviously think it's just the way things should be balanced, because hisec is the las vegas of eve and sov space is the shanty town. Like duh.

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat

Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#2166 - 2013-01-04 08:58:46 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:
Except they'll obviously think it's just the way things should be balanced, because hisec is the las vegas of eve and sov space is the shanty town. Like duh.


In before 25% transaction taxes!

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#2167 - 2013-01-04 09:10:02 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Lord Zim wrote:
Except they'll obviously think it's just the way things should be balanced, because hisec is the las vegas of eve and sov space is the shanty town. Like duh.


In before 25% transaction taxes!

Nonono, it's been thousands of years in the making, things like concord, awesome stations etc are free! Didn't you watch star trek?!

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat

James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#2168 - 2013-01-04 09:25:39 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
Lord Zim wrote:
Except they'll obviously think it's just the way things should be balanced, because hisec is the las vegas of eve and sov space is the shanty town. Like duh.


In before 25% transaction taxes!

Nonono, it's been thousands of years in the making, things like concord, awesome stations etc are free! Didn't you watch star trek?!

Silly hu-mans and their abolition of money.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)

Debora Tsung
Perkone
Caldari State
#2169 - 2013-01-04 10:16:51 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:
GetSirrus wrote:
CONCORD protection

Keep seeing this throughout the thread. Since when does CONCORD protect anything? Have suicide ganks ceased?!

Can I sit in hisec in a freighter with 93 ships in its hold, and not get ganked? Yes? Why golly gosh, I think concord might possibly have some protectional value after all! Who'd've thought!


Wrong, the answer is "maybe!" :)

Someone might just figure out that the cargo is worth it and get enough peeps to gank You anyways.

Stupidity should be a bannable offense.

Fighting back is more fun than not.

Sticky: AFK Cloaking Thread It's not pretty, but it's there.

Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#2170 - 2013-01-04 10:17:31 UTC
Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:

post a killmail of a properly tanked hulk being suicide ganked
By 'properly tanked' i mean "one able to survive 0.0 belt rats'.
If one could be found, an exhumer buff could be justified


1) Suicide gankers would be morons to go after a "properly tanked" ship, considering the wreck revenue comes from intact armor plates and mining mods. The kill boards of course are filled by the best candidates for a gank (duh!) not by the worst.

2) The Hulks able to survive 0.0 belt rats have actually been quite numerous because a metric ton of miners copy pasted the famous "Halada miner's guide" which suggested exactly a 0.0 fitting. Since that fitting involves a deadspace active tank, those Hulk would provide for very ludicrous kill mails. Also, that 0.0 fitting being active and zero buffer, would be a very bad choice against a ganker, so your "challenge" was only met by noobs who copied a null sec fit off a several years old (albeit famous) miner's guide.

Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#2171 - 2013-01-04 10:19:25 UTC
Debora Tsung wrote:
Lord Zim wrote:
GetSirrus wrote:
CONCORD protection

Keep seeing this throughout the thread. Since when does CONCORD protect anything? Have suicide ganks ceased?!

Can I sit in hisec in a freighter with 93 ships in its hold, and not get ganked? Yes? Why golly gosh, I think concord might possibly have some protectional value after all! Who'd've thought!


Wrong, the answer is "maybe!" :)

Someone might just figure out that the cargo is worth it and get enough peeps to gank You anyways.

Someone might, yes. Go outside of hisec and do the exact same thing, and see how many weeks you can sit on a gate in that very same freighter with the exact same cargo.

Concord does protect. It isn't perfect protection, but then again hisec is called high security and not perfect security for a reason.

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat

Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#2172 - 2013-01-04 10:23:50 UTC
Marlona Sky wrote:
He is talking about rich null players purposely hogging up every assembly line with long orders and canceling. Allegedly you get your **** back, but the slot is still take for the length of time.

Saw someone bragging about it a week or so ago. Can anyone confirm this is possible?


Yes when you cancel a job you get the BP back but the slot stays "taken" like the BP went to full completion.

Now PLEASE go and indeed game the "system" and make those slots perma-taken.

I have ALL to gain from this. Pirate
Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#2173 - 2013-01-04 10:25:05 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
1) Suicide gankers would be morons to go after a "properly tanked" ship, considering the wreck revenue comes from intact armor plates and mining mods. The kill boards of course are filled by the best candidates for a gank (duh!) not by the worst.

And what would've happened if the majority of miners had been "properly tanked"?

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat

Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#2174 - 2013-01-04 10:25:44 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
Marlona Sky wrote:
He is talking about rich null players purposely hogging up every assembly line with long orders and canceling. Allegedly you get your **** back, but the slot is still take for the length of time.

Saw someone bragging about it a week or so ago. Can anyone confirm this is possible?


Yes when you cancel a job you get the BP back but the slot stays "taken" like the BP went to full completion.

Now PLEASE go and indeed game the "system" and make those slots perma-taken.

I have ALL to gain from this. Pirate

If you have "all to gain" from this, why don't you do it?

Oh, right, you don't want to waste the minerals, so you try to get others to do it for you. Gotcha.

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat

GetSirrus
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#2175 - 2013-01-04 10:53:33 UTC
remove auto repeat from strip miners and afking ends.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#2176 - 2013-01-04 10:55:34 UTC  |  Edited by: James Amril-Kesh
GetSirrus wrote:
remove auto repeat from strip miners and afking ends.

What does that have to do with this thread?
Besides, asteroids deplete, which already accomplishes what you're suggesting.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)

Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#2177 - 2013-01-04 11:04:30 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
1) Suicide gankers would be morons to go after a "properly tanked" ship, considering the wreck revenue comes from intact armor plates and mining mods. The kill boards of course are filled by the best candidates for a gank (duh!) not by the worst.

And what would've happened if the majority of miners had been "properly tanked"?


It would not happen, the 80% / 20% (and sometimes the 90% / 10%) rules apply.
Any developer (and expecially game developers) know that and act accordingly.

MMOs are games for the masses, the masses are statistically made of bad players / bad investors / bad PvPers. That's why it's easy to be "elite" in a MMO, your opponents are often worse than well made NPCs.
Frying Doom
#2178 - 2013-01-04 11:14:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Frying Doom
GetSirrus wrote:
remove auto repeat from strip miners and afking ends.

So does mining

But if you remove moon mining arrays super afk mining does end.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!

Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#2179 - 2013-01-04 11:16:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Lord Zim wrote:

If you have "all to gain" from this, why don't you do it?

Oh, right, you don't want to waste the minerals, so you try to get others to do it for you. Gotcha.


1) Loners don't achieve as much as groups. Getting several or many people to do the same thing will achieve quicker and bigger results. Unless you do it stupid and "too much" and then it get nerfed. Something which is a speciality for certain alliances in EvE.

2) Certainly wasting 2-3k isk on a starter BP is going to break my wallet! Oh wait, it's the fact one would have to spend hours a day with a terrible and clunky UI just to "take out" one of those 5-6 stations systems.

3) I don't *need* to do it, since I do more than fine as is, for me it's a plus. Since my whole playstyle is made upon completely passive, cumulating gains over time, going all out berserker in a menial task for lots of time is against my playstyle and that's just for a plus.

4) I prefer letting others do the hard work. That's what grunts are for and that's exactly how alliances food economy chain work. I have already reaped some substantial profits (double digit billions just in 2012) by encouraging people into doing what I need and I have already a budget to do the same for 2013. I expecially love saying people my agenda in advance and then proceed into it anyway. That's a VASTLY more satisfying PvP win, because it goes beyond EvE, some times even beyond meta. You may find past references about that activity including during the barges tiericide beta testing, I had some GD post-lords bump my agenda very much and then showing them about it. They almost stopped quoting / bumping my posts since then, there is ALWAYS something brewing up when I post.
Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#2180 - 2013-01-04 11:23:54 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
It would not happen, the 80% / 20% (and sometimes the 90% / 10%) rules apply.
Any developer (and expecially game developers) know that and act accordingly.

I guess that means all aggression being banned from hisec is next, then.

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat