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Establishments in Winter 2011 Expansion, yes or no?

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Mystic5hadow
Koku Uchu Industries
#1 - 2011-10-06 13:51:15 UTC
It was my understanding that Establishments were slated for the Winter 2011 Expansion, but going by this Devblog, I see no mention of Establishments in the upcoming Expansion any more, when it was promised multiple times in the past.

So, I'd like a simple yes or no (or SOMETHING, anything.), are Establishments coming with the next Expansion?
Grey Stormshadow
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#2 - 2011-10-06 13:53:19 UTC
Would you accept no for an answer without making an issue about it ?

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Mersault
Blue Nine Industries
#3 - 2011-10-06 13:57:09 UTC
Establishments, like pies, take a good deal of preperation. They need time to rest before they are good to go.
Mystic5hadow
Koku Uchu Industries
#4 - 2011-10-06 13:57:45 UTC
Grey Stormshadow wrote:
Would you accept no for an answer without making an issue about it ?

Yes, I'd just like to know if they're coming or not. The idea of Incarna (WiS at the time.) is what got me into EVE. I was really excited to know that Establishments were coming this Winter, now I'd just like to know if I should still be excited for them or not.
Ciar Meara
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
#5 - 2011-10-06 14:03:33 UTC
I would like to answer this question with a definate: Mmmnoyermaybe?

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Alua Oresson
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#6 - 2011-10-06 14:05:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Alua Oresson
From Zulu

Quote:
I want to make it clear that this is not a final list. As we go through design and implementation phases some things may require more work than initially expected and others may not hold water in the design phase and therefore may not make it into this particular expansion. Similarly some things might get added to the list. We will keep you updated on our progress every step of the way because, as Hilmar said, communication is one of the things we are dedicated to improve.



Emphasis is mine.

However, I would not be holding my breath. Incarna was initially supposed to release with all four CQ's. They are just getting around to releasing the other three. I would assume the art assets are quite a bit behind. Wouldn't expect to see Establishments until around the summer expansion actually.

http://pvpwannabe.blogspot.com/

Mystic5hadow
Koku Uchu Industries
#7 - 2011-10-06 14:12:33 UTC
Alua Oresson wrote:
From Zulu

Quote:
I want to make it clear that this is not a final list. As we go through design and implementation phases some things may require more work than initially expected and others may not hold water in the design phase and therefore may not make it into this particular expansion. Similarly some things might get added to the list. We will keep you updated on our progress every step of the way because, as Hilmar said, communication is one of the things we are dedicated to improve.



Emphasis is mine.

However, I would not be holding my breath. Incarna was initially supposed to release with all four CQ's. They are just getting around to releasing the other three. I would assume the art assets are quite a bit behind. Wouldn't expect to see Establishments until around the summer expansion actually.

I read that, and I understand. I just found that the fact they said Establishments were coming this expansion, then them not appearing on that list, was kind of odd. You'd think something that was promised is coming would already be on that list.

So, of course, now I doubt they are. I'd just like a definite answer.

Really, the moment I read that CCP was "reorganizing" internally, I figured Establishments weren't coming and that (maybe) these fixes are easier to achieve than actually pushing out Establishments, so CCP took the easy road to pleasing the mass whiners on the forums and used this whole thing as a cover for "we won't have Establishments ready by December, so lets do something easier and say we're listening to people. Win-win." buuuuut.. That's just me speculating on the internal workings of CCP.

Honestly, I just want a "yes" or "no" so I know what I'm waiting for.
Mystic5hadow
Koku Uchu Industries
#8 - 2011-10-06 14:14:23 UTC
Also, I'd like to point out that that "not a final list" is almost certainly there so when they remove something at the last minute, people can't say that the list was supposed to be a definite thing, I honestly doubt anything will be added.

Ugh, I'm starting to hate my posts. I'm becoming anti-CCP :/
Mia Restolo
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#9 - 2011-10-06 14:20:28 UTC
I'll go with no. Considering it's taken them months to get 3 new rooms to the test server I would expect interactive multiplayer environments to show up around the winter 2015 expansion.
Calipygian
State War Academy
Caldari State
#10 - 2011-10-06 14:21:17 UTC
Mystic5hadow wrote:
Also, I'd like to point out that that "not a final list" is almost certainly there so when they remove something at the last minute, people can't say that the list was supposed to be a definite thing, I honestly doubt anything will be added.

Ugh, I'm starting to hate my posts. I'm becoming anti-CCP :/

They can hedge their bets all they want, but no MMO dev is ever let off the hook because they used non-comittal language. MMO fans tend to harsly punish and endlessly bring up any "promise" devs fail to deliver on. Not mentioning something they'd like to get in but aren't pretty confident about is a good strategy in my opinion.
Aidan Brooder
Dynasphere Ltd.
#11 - 2011-10-06 14:21:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Aidan Brooder
Well, I'm certainly not that much anti-CCP, but I was very much looking forward to WiS myself, even though I played the game for many years just being a spaceship.

And I agree with you:
They - likely - figured out: "Phew, Incarna is harder to do than we thought. Luckily we have a bunch of loud 0.0 whiners in the backyard! Lets please them, even though nothing will actually change for them in game. And say we listened to players, even though they only represent a very small percentage of playerbase."

Then the CCP Genius Handshake Award was presented to someone.

I don't want a yes/no for winter expansion. I want to hear from them that they further invest themselves into Incarna, because many people are looking forward to it and have not been loud whiners, because they thought they would actually get it as promised.

If they say, they need 6 more months for total CCP-awesomeness, fine. But currently it sounds like "off the table" and I personally couldn't care less about the FiS changes they plan, because they will not change much for the players.

Blog: http://aidanbrooder.wordpress.com My EVE Playlist on YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLSNuHY7z8n1q1BdLvW2verIfH8vvWtz_x

flakeys
Doomheim
#12 - 2011-10-06 14:23:34 UTC
Mystic5hadow wrote:
I just found that the fact they said Establishments were coming this expansion, then them not appearing on that list, was kind of odd. You'd think something that was promised is coming would already be on that list.




You do know how long us oldtimers waited on WIS while it was promised to come soontm?I'd think next summer earliest to expect any big new content to the WIS so keep your hopes low is my advice , if you can't enjoy eve without the WIS then you've joined the wrong game imho.IT's there as a sideshow for the main game.

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.

Iohet Nolafew
Perkone
Caldari State
#13 - 2011-10-06 14:24:26 UTC
Based on the other dev blog, I'm willing to bet establishments are going to come when they're done, rather than rushing a half finished product out, which bit them in the ass already this year. So I'd guess no.
Mystic5hadow
Koku Uchu Industries
#14 - 2011-10-06 14:30:51 UTC
flakeys wrote:
Mystic5hadow wrote:
I just found that the fact they said Establishments were coming this expansion, then them not appearing on that list, was kind of odd. You'd think something that was promised is coming would already be on that list.




You do know how long us oldtimers waited on WIS while it was promised to come soontm?I'd think next summer earliest to expect any big new content to the WIS so keep your hopes low is my advice , if you can't enjoy eve without the WIS then you've joined the wrong game imho.IT's there as a sideshow for the main game.


I've only been waiting since 2008, it's not that I can't enjoy EVE without it, it's the fact that CCP always promises stuff then doesn't deliver. Now it was just the ultimate tease to me, as Incarna is something I'm really excited for, they kept saying that Establishments are coming this Winter, we already have CQ teasing us, and now it seems CCP has dropped Establishment from this Winter. Which, for all I know, may not be the case as we all know CCP isn't very good at being clear about everything, but if that is the case then I am severely disappointed.
It's the solitary thing I have been waiting for, the rest has just been bonuses to me, and now that it seemed it was finally arriving.. CCP decides to focus on the stuff those-with-the-loudest-mouths (or clickiest-keys? I dunno, lol) complained about.

I will always love EVE, regardless if Establishments come this Winter or not. Though I may be disappointed if they aren't coming any time soon, I will still play and enjoy EVE... Unless they pull this again, then I dunno, I'd probably be really pissed by then.
Alxea
Unstable Pirate Sharks Of The Damed Sea
#15 - 2011-10-06 14:33:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Alxea
I think they were delayed thanks to the playerbases moaning and I was looking forward to the bars and trophy rooms. :( It is not ccps fault that enough people whined about ship spinning among other things that in tern delay's the real parts of walking in stations.
Herold Oldtimer
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#16 - 2011-10-06 14:34:34 UTC
Iohet Nolafew wrote:
Based on the other dev blog, I'm willing to bet establishments are going to come when they're done, rather than rushing a half finished product out, which bit them in the ass already this year. So I'd guess no.


I agree with this, both the release date and what they will be hopefully releasing.

I have no problem waiting till they feel confident enough to give us something good.

Tristan North
The Scope
#17 - 2011-10-06 14:35:23 UTC
Mystic5hadow wrote:
"We won't have Establishments ready by December, so lets do something easier and say we're listening to people. Win-win."

This.
Jokerface666
Intergalactic Expeditionary Corp
#18 - 2011-10-06 14:38:21 UTC
Are going to make a new post every 3 hrs if you do not get an answer??

Ffs some official write "no" please
Alua Oresson
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#19 - 2011-10-06 14:40:07 UTC
The squeeky wheel gets the grease. However, I think that this refocus of their time is well spent. They are still working on WIS. And I do believe they will have something out in about a year. However, I am excited that the actual core gameplay is being addressed. These are items that have plagued the game for years. I'm all for fixing the game before you add more stuff to it.

http://pvpwannabe.blogspot.com/

Mystic5hadow
Koku Uchu Industries
#20 - 2011-10-06 14:47:44 UTC
Alua Oresson wrote:
The squeeky wheel gets the grease. However, I think that this refocus of their time is well spent. They are still working on WIS. And I do believe they will have something out in about a year. However, I am excited that the actual core gameplay is being addressed. These are items that have plagued the game for years. I'm all for fixing the game before you add more stuff to it.

I'm happy they're working on FiS, I just wish they would have finished up with Establishments at least before switching to focus on WiS, rather than cutting off WiS and potentially upsetting players (like myself) that were actually excited and waiting for WiS stuff.

They should have just made their intention clear like so "Folks, we know you want FiS stuff, so let us just finish up what we're working on for WiS right now so we don't **** off people waiting for the WiS stuff we promised, then we'll get right to this FiS stuff you want, okay? Okay."

That would have made me perfectly happy.
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