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New AI battleships think that salvage drones are more dangerous than a battleship
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Flurk Hellbron
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#21 - 2012-12-09 03:34:36 UTC
Meh, fighting NPC's
Nexus Day
Lustrevik Trade and Travel Bureau
#22 - 2012-12-09 05:16:51 UTC
Codie Dunier wrote:
If it was me who was losing a fleet of several dozen ships to one ship, I'd honestly also go for their squishy clean-up ship to limit their profits, and completely disregard the actual threat if it's already a losing battle. It makes plenty of sense, actually. "We can't win this, but we sure as hell can limit their profits!"

If you can't deal with it, just keep the Noctis out until it's completely safe to bring it in.

Yes, because logically if they were getting their ass handed to them they wouldn't just warp out.

I think you are trying too hard to use "logic".
Sisohiv
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#23 - 2012-12-09 08:15:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Sisohiv
I think the point the OP is trying to make, How do you "learn EVE" and be a drone boat pilot when nothing stands up to rhyme or reason? How do you adapt to modified AI when the AI are on some random targeting system that has no foundation leading to what CCP suggested it was put in place for?

Cut out all the spin doctoring and smoke and mirrors and it condenses to "drones got nerfed out of PvE in EVE".

- Be sure to parse that last sentence when you quote me, so you can spin doctor a reply.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#24 - 2012-12-09 11:55:06 UTC
Of course they do. It may not look like much, but those wrecks still contain sealed compartments and air pockets with survivors in them, and then you come along and meticulously disassemble what little protection is left for the poor souls?

Sisohiv wrote:
I think the point the OP is trying to make, How do you "learn EVE" and be a drone boat pilot when nothing stands up to rhyme or reason? How do you adapt to modified AI when the AI are on some random targeting system that has no foundation leading to what CCP suggested it was put in place for?
Well, for one, you can learn how the target prioritisation works and trick them into attacking what you want them to attack rather than what they'd normally want to attack.

Quote:
Cut out all the spin doctoring and smoke and mirrors and it condenses to "drones got nerfed out of PvE in EVE".
…except that drones are still just as viable for PvE.
raskonalkov
Tie Fighters Inc
#25 - 2012-12-09 12:13:06 UTC
^ Yeah, good point, suppose drone boats can still do recon 3, so they are pretty rock solid at PVE.

Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#26 - 2012-12-09 12:15:46 UTC
raskonalkov wrote:
^ Yeah, good point, suppose drone boats can still do recon 3, so they are pretty rock solid at PVE.




Tbh those not doing Recon 3 in a speed buffed stabber are doing it not optimally.

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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#27 - 2012-12-09 12:19:18 UTC
raskonalkov wrote:
^ Yeah, good point, suppose drone boats can still do recon 3, so they are pretty rock solid at PVE.
Good news: they can do all other missions too and they are, in fact, pretty awful for Recon 3.
Alara IonStorm
#28 - 2012-12-09 12:22:07 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Good news: they can do all other missions too and they are, in fact, pretty awful for Recon 3.

...

Nerf Clouds. X
Tykari
The Observatory
#29 - 2012-12-09 12:30:57 UTC
Remiel Pollard wrote:
I think that's one of the biggest problems with missions - they were too predictable. It's like playing the same Halo game five times in a row. While I agree that this is an odd behaviour for an AI - I think it's a necessary one, as well. Get your mate in another battleship to help you clear the threats, THEN start salvaging.


While I agree that salvaging should be done after everything is cleared when dealing with the new AI, let's not kid ourselves about missions. This new AI won't do change a thing about it. Sleeper sites are as predictable as missions and doing them is just as repetitive, maybe less so in C5 or C6, but C1 to C4 certainly qualify. The biggest surprise or unpredictable thing that can happen is if you get jumped by a hostile gang because you're weren't paying attention to other entrances and/or d-scan.

Tippia wrote:
…except that drones are still just as viable for PvE.


Technically non sentries have got their range nerfed tremendously, because sending them out over long distance will only end up with being dead because they can't get back to you in time before dying. On the other hand I also don't think that this was a good thing so I'm not really upset that it is no longer the case.

The biggest game breaker for drone users is the getting a room full of aggro bug at the moment. If they can fix that I'm sure a huge part of the problem will go away. Of course we then simply get back to exactly what missions were before with the added annoyance of constantly having to recall and redeploy drones when the NPC's switch targets. The AI wasn't and isn't the big problem with missions that makes it tedious.

In this dark void we are like brilliant stars, holding within us both the creative and destructive power to bring a new dawn upon worlds or plunge them into eternal darkness.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#30 - 2012-12-09 12:39:06 UTC
Tykari wrote:
Technically non sentries have got their range nerfed tremendously, because sending them out over long distance will only end up with being dead because they can't get back to you in time before dying. On the other hand I also don't think that this was a good thing so I'm not really upset that it is no longer the case.
Yes, I'd agree with that — with both points. On a pure capability level, as in “what can I reasonably do with the equipment”, drone range is reined in a bit (although proper aggro management would still let you send them all over the place), but I rather see this change as an enforcement of good practice. Having your drones out beyond 30km was never a good idea to begin with — nothing that flies out there needs to have a drone sent after it, and anything closer than that can either be dealt with using heavier weaponry or by using drones that are fast enough to cover that distance without dying.

Quote:
The biggest game breaker for drone users is the getting a room full of aggro bug at the moment. If they can fix that I'm sure a huge part of the problem will go away.
Pretty much. That's a general trigger bug and not a done-boat problem, though.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#31 - 2012-12-09 12:43:10 UTC
Sisohiv wrote:
I think the point the OP is trying to make, How do you "learn EVE" and be a drone boat pilot when nothing stands up to rhyme or reason? How do you adapt to modified AI when the AI are on some random targeting system that has no foundation leading to what CCP suggested it was put in place for?

Cut out all the spin doctoring and smoke and mirrors and it condenses to "drones got nerfed out of PvE in EVE".

- Be sure to parse that last sentence when you quote me, so you can spin doctor a reply.


Took me all of 10 seconds to figure out how to keep my drones alive.
MadMuppet
Critical Mass Inc
#32 - 2012-12-09 14:39:07 UTC
Alara IonStorm wrote:
Just so I got this straight. You brought the Corpse Desecration Mobile in while you were still murdering all their friends and were surprised they were pissed?

Of course they took a shot at it!!!


I love it. "The scoops are coming, clear the streets" (Soylent Green)

This message brought to you by Experience(tm). When common sense fails you, experience will come to the rescue. Experience(tm) from the makers of CONCORD.

"If you are part of the problem, you will be nerfed." -MadMuppet
AstraPardus
Earthside Mixlabs
#33 - 2012-12-09 16:48:50 UTC
MadMuppet wrote:
Alara IonStorm wrote:
Just so I got this straight. You brought the Corpse Desecration Mobile in while you were still murdering all their friends and were surprised they were pissed?

Of course they took a shot at it!!!


I love it. "The scoops are coming, clear the streets" (Soylent Green)



This made me smile. :3
Every time I post is Pardy time! :3
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