EVE General Discussion

How did I know someone from Null sec would say that

No, because of the little thing known as "risk vs reward". Having everything null, whs, etc have in highsec without any of the risk or extra costs and efforts required to operate in those areas of space would be broken. Having low ends from highsec (plus the extra stuff) but with all the extra added risk, effort and overhead isn't as ridiculously imbalanced.

Quit EVE.

Anyone that would refer to player driven content as "cheap ass emergent gameplay" doesnt' belong here. You're in the wrong game. That's the essense of EVE.

You sir, would be better suited in a game where the content is entirely generated by the developers.

There is such a thing as a bad customer, and you sir are a bad customer.

Tools are more important in EVE than content, because tools allow for MORE content to EMERGE than structured developer created content.

Anyone that would post what Darth posted, should have thier forum posting privelage revoced.

All right.
I always hate myself in the morning, but I will bite at what a goon says, because some of what you suggest sounds almost reasonable.

You call yourself a null sec carebear. Cool. One of the rare posts by a null sec player that actually admits that anything possible in high sec is also possible in null.

I too was a "null sec carebear". My old corp EDROP was part of FCON prior to NC falling, and I was in charge of our T2 module and T1 ship building wing. We topped out running 18 POS's for our corp, about 4 of which were dedicated to T2 module building, the balance moon mining of various quality. We operated out of the UMI pipe, which for anyone who knows that area, is a busy speedway for Darkside and at the times PL. Our POS's were NEVER hit. All except the tech moon POS we had for solely for our corp for about 3 months. R&Kdecided then wanted it eventually. And you know what? That POS was one of the rare LOW SEC tech moons, so was impossible to defend within sov anyway. But I digress here...

Bottom line, we made billions every month buying high end minerals on the local market way below Jita prices, then building our own T2 products, and JF'ing what we didn't use ourselves to export at Jita and higher other high sec trade hubs.

So yeah, I think we can agree that when null sec people whine about how difficult it is to do industry in null, we both know that is a complete lie.

I also agree with you in regard to null sec and high sec being intertwined. That has to be a fact since they share the same economy.
BUT....while they may share a great many rules and game mechanics, they are not the same.
There are far too many differences to suggest they are the same thing.

And yeah, high sec DOES NEED its own reps. WE should have at least 3 of the 7, maybe 4, to have proper representation. And yes, agreed, these reps do need to understand all concepts of the game. But to infer that high sec does not have such people is a total lie. We have plenty of people in high sec who understand every facet of the game as well as any null sec rep.

I am wandering off the thrust of what I want to say, so I will make it point form:

1. It is a lie used by null sec to suggest that all high sec players are worried about losing the ability to afk anything. What high sec people are terrified of is not being able to do ANYTHING in high sec without a huge group of people. If CCP suddenly changed the rules and Null sec NPC's so people could not solo Sanctums, Havens and most 6/10's solo, but had to to in groups of 3-4, null sec would go insane.

2. Null sec zealot propagandists throw around the phrase "balancing risk/reward" to justify burning high sec profitability to the ground. Well guess what, the pendulum has swung way way over to where null sec is too safe for its reward. Have a look at Jester's blog today. Some moron lost a Titan, then got pissed off at his ex-corp (they tossed him), and he proceeded to lose 2 supercarriers. That is over 100 BILLION in losses. I can't state the Titan was a personal ship, but the 2 supercarriers sure sound like they were. And this is a clearly stupid player in a small null sec corp. When dumb players have that kind of coin to throw away, there is far far too much money in null sec compared to high sec.

3. You guys in null are simply bored, and have no one to shoot, so have been mounting a campaign against high sec through manipulation of the CCP devs's (most, let's face it, come from null in the first place) to destroy high sec via game mechanics. I figure you are about halfway done. Now that you have destroyed PvE income in high sec, you will be going after mining and T2 industry next. By the June release you should have achieved total victory over high sec.

Then let these 3 or 4 people stand up and earn their place by making a name for themselves, and showing that they have what is necessary to lead. Right now, I can only see James 315 making an effort in this regard - if anyone else wants to step up to the plate, nothing is stopping them.

you know, there's a tiny problem with trying to represent high sec carebeares, most of them i suspect, are casual players, who probably don't have forum accounts, and maybe don't even know how to find the forums..

how do you represent the large number of CCP's paying customers who don't want to talk?
all we really do is guess what they want

seems to be though that high sec vs low sec is fairly balanced, judging by that the low/null vs high sec complaining seems balanced, both groups complain a lot about wanting more stuff, and suggest that said stuff be taken from the group they don't belong to..

this argument seems omnipresent on the forums, seeing as i remember this all the way from the beta..

and yet i never see many say that eve is a sandbox game, more then a "PvP game" or a "PvE game"


because that's really the reason i'm still here 10 years on(approx)
noone tells you what to do or where to go at this level.
there's no predefined path

you make your own game

You are correct about a large percentage of the high sec players are casual, and don't follow what is happening to their environment. They won't know is is destroyed until it is too late.

As for high sec and null sec being balanced, I would say yes, until about a year ago that was true. Then null sec became completely consolidated, and the null sec zealots stopped shooting each other, became bored, and focused their eyes on a new perceived enemy: high sec in general.
They started an ideology war against high sec, using propaganda, lies, the CSM, and certain other weapons (I can't state what they are because I will likely get banned).

And they are winning. In fact, they are about halfway to complete victory.
The null sec group has managed to devastate high sec PvE, and the next phase is going after high sec mining and T2 industry. We have already seen the posts by the CSM, many null sec players, and the occasional dev alluding to the mining imbalance. Expect those to increase in frequency and viciousness, and then the attacks on the "imbalance" and "risk/reward" of T2 manufacturing in high sec vs null. BTW, Soundwave already voiced his displeasure about high sec T2 mfg in his Ten Ton Hammer interviews last Fanfest.

I would expect that this Fanfest, just like he announced the obliteration of datacore farming at the last one, he will drop another bomb on high sec again.

Yes, you can do everything in null that you can do in high sec. The problem is that the amount of effort you have to put in compared to high sec is considerably greater.

Its not really fair that those of use that choose to take advantage of all the game has to offer have to work considerably harder to achieve the same level of reward. You shouldn't be able to sit in a belt ark for hours on end, mining the cheapest ore in the game, and make more isk than someone who actually ventures into null to mine.

There are several things that can be done to improve null sec, both industry and pve content wise.

Yes, you can do the same stuff in null that you do in high, but that's not the same as saying its ok here.

Your point 1-3 wrong though. You're generalizing, and I suspect using your own personal experiences to make your own points. I personally don't agree with any one of them.

I'd ask "can't we all just get along?" but then I remember that this is EVE and the mere thought starts me convulsing with laughter.

you know, the new NPC ai makes missions more fun, i mean, come on, the old one was ********..

and they just removed the pvp aggro traps from missions, i wont miss those as they were annoying, but i cant call that PvP focused

edit: ccp is as always trying to nudge people towards low/null sec, without trying to mess stuff up for those who really dont want risk, they are all paying customers

personally i dont envy ccp having to try to make everyone happy