These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE Information Portal

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

EVE Online: Retribution 1.0 Feedback

First post
Author
Necroromantic
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#1621 - 2012-12-15 13:06:22 UTC
Yonis Kador wrote:
Necro,

Everything in EvE is pvp....even posting here on the forums. Prior to the bounty system, ganks were staged and wars were initiated based on forum warrior disagreements. That's pvp. Bounties are simply an extension of this dynamic. In fact, some people are asking for a bounty button to be added here too so bounties can be placed without even using the client.

YK


Finding it hard to understand what me telling a troll to go do one has to to with the bounty system other than it was stated to enphisis the fact not all players who are continuing to play rather than to 'whine' as was stated by the post i was replying to where in fact happy and further more not all unhappy players chose to offer feedback and went strieght to playing something else instead..
on the subject of the bounty system though i totally disagree with you. The whole bounty system holds no valid in game pleasure unless your motives are to disrupt players who themselves dont want to PVP.
The game is kinda for 13 years and up so if a gang of vet players want to come to high sec to gank kiddies just starting out in the game and who are neither skilled nor mature enough to fully grasp every aspect of the game. these Players are not recognisable or distigushable from any vet player on their alt isk maker toon.. these younger players DO NEED to be protected from online bullying and that is all the new free for all bounty system is.

It appears that the issues this petition concerns are currently being addressed in your other petition which has been discussed by the Lead Game Masters. As the original issue this petition pertains to has been resolved, this petition will now be closed.

If you have any further comments concerning the bounty system then please feel free to update your other petition.

Best regards,
GM *******
EVE Online Customer Support

The other pet he is referring to is that the bounty office not only breaks ccp's own terms of player conduct but also that of international laws on cyber bullying:


pulled from on line legal definition of cyber bullying..
Examples of what constitutes cyberbullying include communications that seek to intimidate, control, manipulate, put down, falsely discredit, or humiliate the recipient. The actions are deliberate, repeated, and hostile behavior intended to harm another. Cyberbullying has been defined by The National Crime Prevention Council: “When the Internet, cell phones or other devices are used to send or post text or images intended to hurt or embarrass another person."[1][2]
A cyberbully may be a person whom the target knows or an online stranger. A cyberbully may be anonymous and may solicit involvement of other people online who do not even know the target. This is known as a 'digital pile-on.

The line between in game 'role playing' and cyberbullying is an issue CCP need to start taking seriously as they risk having Eve shut down due their new programming then how much 'fun fun fun' will all the trollers flamers and high sec gankers have? ..

There are more ways to engage in pvp than all the other activities added togerther.. so why do we need a system that forces a minority of players to pvp when the do not wish play that way?

To ccp dude who will want to pull this thread for the Pet copy over.. A CCP employee needs to make a public declaration regarding this matter as continued 'public' ignorance has left players with the belief that your silence is your conformation that they are right... when you are in fact consulting with legal to confirm the complaints are legitimate and not just whining....

Quick see if you can spot the grammer and spelling mistakes b4 someone else does.. i left them just for you!! :)

Keko Khaan
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#1622 - 2012-12-15 13:08:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Keko Khaan
Ive noticed this new feature that is extremely annoying and it pretty much brokes my overview. When i hover my mouse on top of overview some stupid black info box appears in top of my overview and it blocks my overview so i cant see my overview anymore. I dont either undersrand idea of that info box as it shows same info i allready have in my overview. Huge issue is that it causes me to see only one object at the time from overview cause that info window blocks rest of my overview.. This means that always when im undocked im pissed at that stupid info box and it makes just want close eve and go play some other game.

Pls fix!! Either remove it totally or make settings where i can remove it myself!!!

Why the heck u guys want change things that havent ever been problem to anyone.. Theres saying "if its not broken dont fix it".

Also i want my carriers corp hangars divisions back asap. You guys managed to make life of capital pilots a horrible nightmare..
Wigster Atild
Enderas's Holdings Corporation
#1623 - 2012-12-15 13:22:56 UTC
Necroromantic wrote:
Yonis Kador wrote:
Necro,

Everything in EvE is pvp....even posting here on the forums. Prior to the bounty system, ganks were staged and wars were initiated based on forum warrior disagreements. That's pvp. Bounties are simply an extension of this dynamic. In fact, some people are asking for a bounty button to be added here too so bounties can be placed without even using the client.

YK


Finding it hard to understand what me telling a troll to go do one has to to with the bounty system other than it was stated to enphisis the fact not all players who are continuing to play rather than to 'whine' as was stated by the post i was replying to where in fact happy and further more not all unhappy players chose to offer feedback and went strieght to playing something else instead..
on the subject of the bounty system though i totally disagree with you. The whole bounty system holds no valid in game pleasure unless your motives are to disrupt players who themselves dont want to PVP.
The game is kinda for 13 years and up so if a gang of vet players want to come to high sec to gank kiddies just starting out in the game and who are neither skilled nor mature enough to fully grasp every aspect of the game. these Players are not recognisable or distigushable from any vet player on their alt isk maker toon.. these younger players DO NEED to be protected from online bullying and that is all the new free for all bounty system is.

Edit:
Quote removed
Edit

The other pet he is referring to is that the bounty office not only breaks ccp's own terms of player conduct but also that of international laws on cyber bullying:


pulled from on line legal definition of cyber bullying..
Examples of what constitutes cyberbullying include communications that seek to intimidate, control, manipulate, put down, falsely discredit, or humiliate the recipient. The actions are deliberate, repeated, and hostile behavior intended to harm another. Cyberbullying has been defined by The National Crime Prevention Council: “When the Internet, cell phones or other devices are used to send or post text or images intended to hurt or embarrass another person."[1][2]
A cyberbully may be a person whom the target knows or an online stranger. A cyberbully may be anonymous and may solicit involvement of other people online who do not even know the target. This is known as a 'digital pile-on.

The line between in game 'role playing' and cyberbullying is an issue CCP need to start taking seriously as they risk having Eve shut down due their new programming then how much 'fun fun fun' will all the trollers flamers and high sec gankers have? ..

There are more ways to engage in pvp than all the other activities added togerther.. so why do we need a system that forces a minority of players to pvp when the do not wish play that way?

To ccp dude who will want to pull this thread for the Pet copy over.. A CCP employee needs to make a public declaration regarding this matter as continued 'public' ignorance has left players with the belief that your silence is your conformation that they are right... when you are in fact consulting with legal to confirm the complaints are legitimate and not just whining....



+1..

Have removed the quote to keep my post.. however i too have received reply from in game pet stating pretty much the same thing.. time to tell the whole community CCP.. should have finished counting your 30 pieces of silver by now you have had nearly 2 weeks since the Retribution patch...upgrade..expansion...sorry lost track of what it was - although the majority giving ignored feed back would say 'Nurf'....
Ulath
Red Sun Trading
#1624 - 2012-12-15 13:24:00 UTC
Yes nice going CCP.. remove some fun from the game... now what to do to keep my self entertained?
Yonis Kador
KADORCORP
#1625 - 2012-12-15 13:31:00 UTC
Necroromantic wrote:
Yonis Kador wrote:

Necro,

Everything in EvE is pvp....

YK


The whole bounty system holds no valid in game pleasure unless your motives are to disrupt players who themselves dont want to PVP.

There are more ways to engage in pvp than all the other activities added togerther.. so why do we need a system that forces a minority of players to pvp when the do not wish play that way?


They don't have a choice. EvE is pvp. If you're mining, you're competing against other players for available resources. That's pvp. If you're trading, you're outbidding other players to sell your goods instead of theirs. Pvp. If you're running missions, you provide opportunities to other players (i.e. you are bait.) Pvp again. Unless you are in a station ship spinning, everything you do in-game is pvp. It's the nature of the sandbox. We're all squirrels fighting for nuts. Besides, getting bountied doesn't force you to engage in combat. But no matter what you're doing once you undock, you're pvp'ing.

Don't get me wrong, I think some valid points have been raised about the mechanics of the bounty system. Because this is an everybody vs. everybody else game, conceivably one day everyone might have a bounty. Does that enhance gameplay? Maybe. An argument can certainly be made then that this does, in fact, incentivize combat pvp over other pvp types. Which is probably good for the quality of pgc, but was New Eden meant to be a world of outlaws by design? Just for the way the huge "Wanted" tag diminishes the awesome character portraits I'm not a huge fan of that idea.

But I'm not buying the idea that in a game where, by definition, all activities are pvp, giving players new tools to pvp equates to cyberbullying.

Yonis Kador
Anun Hen
Perkone
Caldari State
#1626 - 2012-12-15 13:37:21 UTC
Safety settings resets after each login

Quote:
Thank you for your bugreport titled: Safety settings reset after loggin

The problem you have described is an intended game feature or function, and not a bug.

Hello there, This is correct as per the patch notes: "At login, the safety will always reset to Full.". When you login you will need to disable the safety again. Thanks, BH Quivozis


Apparently this is a "feature"

Could you please reconsider CCP? I live in low-sec space, we are NBSI, I want that security feature permanently OFF.

Why do you think it is an improvement to make players like me have to reset the thing every.single.time we login? We know what the safety is for, we made a conscious decision to turn it OFF fully, we also know how to turn it back on if we ever wanted to do so. But you decided you know better than your players and turned this into yet another silly inconvenience.

How about you at least give us the OPTION not to have to reset the thing every time?!

As an aside, why does it always have to be 1 step forward, 1 step back with you guys ....
Wigster Atild
Enderas's Holdings Corporation
#1627 - 2012-12-15 14:00:23 UTC
Yonis Kador wrote:
Necroromantic wrote:
Yonis Kador wrote:

Necro,

Everything in EvE is pvp....

YK


The whole bounty system holds no valid in game pleasure unless your motives are to disrupt players who themselves dont want to PVP.

There are more ways to engage in pvp than all the other activities added togerther.. so why do we need a system that forces a minority of players to pvp when the do not wish play that way?


They don't have a choice. EvE is pvp. If you're mining, you're competing against other players for available resources. That's pvp. If you're trading, you're outbidding other players to sell your goods instead of theirs. Pvp. If you're running missions, you provide opportunities to other players (i.e. you are bait.) Pvp again. Unless you are in a station ship spinning, everything you do in-game is pvp. It's the nature of the sandbox. We're all squirrels fighting for nuts. Besides, getting bountied doesn't force you to engage in combat. But no matter what you're doing once you undock, you're pvp'ing.

Don't get me wrong, I think some valid points have been raised about the mechanics of the bounty system. Because this is an everybody vs. everybody else game, conceivably one day everyone might have a bounty. Does that enhance gameplay? Maybe. An argument can certainly be made then that this does, in fact, incentivize combat pvp over other pvp types. Which is probably good for the quality of pgc, but was New Eden meant to be a world of outlaws by design? Just for the way the huge "Wanted" tag diminishes the awesome character portraits I'm not a huge fan of that idea.

But I'm not buying the idea that in a game where, by definition, all activities are pvp, giving players new tools to pvp equates to cyberbullying.

Yonis Kador



12 years of gamming with an area in game called 'High sec' and an in game protection force called 'Concord' begs to differ.

Fact is, there is, when mining a very limited amount of ore you can get the increase in value to sec security is obvious too as with belt rat drops and with complexes.. the nearer to 1.0 you get the less value your mining is.. why will players be mining veld in 1.0 -0.8 if they cant do it piece? and if you dont join a big ass corp/alliance u got no chance to mine rarer ores at a high isk value..

fact is players play off the loss of income from high sec ores with increased profit from keep the same mining tub day in day out rather than run the gauntlet of low to no sec space.

It was stated some pages back that we don't live in crime-less communities and eve is only reflecting that.. and that was true until high sec lost all meaning.. sure you always had to keep an eye out for some jerk or pack of jerks roaming through high sec disrupting the activities of others - but now they get rewarded for it and the bounties are placed on players for reasons that do not respect cyber bullying laws and even CCP's own terms for player conduct and should be seen for what they are victimisation and bullying..


Necroromantic
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#1628 - 2012-12-15 14:14:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Necroromantic
Yonis Kador wrote:
Necroromantic wrote:
Yonis Kador wrote:

Necro,

Everything in EvE is pvp....

YK


The whole bounty system holds no valid in game pleasure unless your motives are to disrupt players who themselves dont want to PVP.

There are more ways to engage in pvp than all the other activities added togerther.. so why do we need a system that forces a minority of players to pvp when the do not wish play that way?


They don't have a choice. EvE is pvp. If you're mining, you're competing against other players for available resources. That's pvp. If you're trading, you're outbidding other players to sell your goods instead of theirs. Pvp. If you're running missions, you provide opportunities to other players (i.e. you are bait.) Pvp again. Unless you are in a station ship spinning, everything you do in-game is pvp. It's the nature of the sandbox. We're all squirrels fighting for nuts. Besides, getting bountied doesn't force you to engage in combat. But no matter what you're doing once you undock, you're pvp'ing.

Don't get me wrong, I think some valid points have been raised about the mechanics of the bounty system. Because this is an everybody vs. everybody else game, conceivably one day everyone might have a bounty. Does that enhance gameplay? Maybe. An argument can certainly be made then that this does, in fact, incentivize combat pvp over other pvp types. Which is probably good for the quality of pgc, but was New Eden meant to be a world of outlaws by design? Just for the way the huge "Wanted" tag diminishes the awesome character portraits I'm not a huge fan of that idea.

But I'm not buying the idea that in a game where, by definition, all activities are pvp, giving players new tools to pvp equates to cyberbullying.

Yonis Kador



I thought Eve was an unscriped sand box where anything could happen?? so where in the unscripted script does it say 'you are not allowed to play if you don't PVP'??
Maybe you need learn to define PVP - as for me this means lock targets on another player and shoot at them. all other activities between 2 or more players are called interactions.. maybe a trip back to school could help you to understand english better.

Why must i be forced to pvp exactly in this free style mmo that brags about how totally interactive and how varied its activities are ??

As for pvp equates as bulling i never said that - please learn to read in english if you are going to post in an english forum - I said miss using the forum and help chats to silence other players from asking for help or is bullied out of the forum with bounties for having an opinion in a feedback thread as pointed out not just by myself but by other players too that is what equates to cyberbullying and anyone over the minimum age of 13 should be able to understand this hence the need for a minimum age for players..

Quick see if you can spot the grammer and spelling mistakes b4 someone else does.. i left them just for you!! :)

Yonis Kador
KADORCORP
#1629 - 2012-12-15 15:41:11 UTC
"We need to get back to our roots if that makes sense. I think EVE has become a little soft, as strange as it sounds. It’s really easy to make money, it’s pretty safe, it’s become too much of a happy fairy land where everyone holds hands and eats lollipops than the dystopian universe it’s supposed to be.

I basically want to give some people a special set of shovels to build massive sandcastles, while at the same time giving another set of players reinforced steel boots that come with directions to stomp said sandcastles. Winter is going to be a ton of fun, whether you like creating, or just tearing everything down."


--Kristoffer "CCP Soundwave" Touborg

Everything I wrote is accurate and my reading comprehension isn't the issue.

EvE is pvp.

"maybe a trip back to school could help you learn English better"

"please learn to read in english if you're going to post in an english forum"

"anyone over the minimum age of 13 should be able to understand this"

Have you considered that maybe the reason you were bountied wasn't because you expressed an opinion but the manner in which you did so? Learn some tact. This is, after all, a social game. With responses like that, I wouldn't be surprised if you get bountied again.

YK
Necroromantic
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#1630 - 2012-12-15 16:48:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Necroromantic
Yonis Kador wrote:

Have you considered that maybe the reason you were bountied wasn't because you expressed an opinion but the manner in which you did so? Learn some tact. This is, after all, a social game. With responses like that, I wouldn't be surprised if you get bountied again.

YK

OMG Really? LOL you argue the fact that every aspect of Eve is PVP ?? ok how many rounds of ammo do you use placing n order on the market? or when you put on a new manufacturing job? or a research job?
when solo mission running when does the PVP start? thats right when someone comes to agro you LOL..

Giving bounties for no actual role play value i.e. in help chat when players are only asking for help is not social and does not in any way help foster good will, then to add hurt to the insult any other player who wants to challenge concord can then attack them for reward - again I ask you how is this social? we have graded security systems for a reason that reason may not be clear to gun ho shooter gamers But the lower the level of security the more of the games content becomes open to the players. You have the choice to play at the level of security you feel you are ready for or the areas of the game which hold the content you wish to access. By making bounties a free for all activity you have effectively removed that old system of thinking without actually taking away that system and just giving it no definition ...

what did CCP introduce to high sec gaming to balance the equation of more hostility??
better roids to farm? NO..
better drops from missions, belt rats and complexes? NO

What they have done so far is increase mission difficulty and switched on aggression to drones, they have nurfed ships popular for mission running and they have made drones useless against belt rats so miners in barges need warp out. All these things have slowed the accumulation of wealth in game slowing newer players progress making would be PVPers less inclined to go to lower sec systems now they can profit from high sec ganking..

you argue my approach is rude and unsociable whilst advocating the game be played more aggressively and less socially... What a hypocrite

Quick see if you can spot the grammer and spelling mistakes b4 someone else does.. i left them just for you!! :)

Picentaur Janaki
Doomheim
#1631 - 2012-12-15 16:49:49 UTC
Short and sweet,
Jukebox back please


Oh, and more realistic physics engine for ships .....with collisions =)
AlkoliK
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1632 - 2012-12-15 17:11:04 UTC
Issue, Jukebox:

Been playing since 2003. Jukebox is a mainstay of this game, it was one of the features of this game that made it have that "Cool" factor. Yes, I am a bit nostalgic about the jukebox player. Still it was a "feature" of this game. Bring it back, and if you want to use your soundcloud, then make an interface for it in the current UI. I understand this will cost development time, but requiring an additional window up in an already cluttered display, is annoying to say the least. All this being said, please do not become BlizzardTwisted, who are facist dictators about their games.
Ribikoka
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#1633 - 2012-12-15 17:55:37 UTC
Necroromantic wrote:


What they have done so far is increase mission difficulty and switched on aggression to drones, they have nurfed ships popular for mission running and they have made drones useless against belt rats so miners in barges need warp out. All these things have slowed the accumulation of wealth in game slowing newer players progress making would be PVPers less inclined to go to lower sec systems now they can profit from high sec ganking..


+1
I feel same. This is the worst business model for a MMO.
Maybe they dont want to integrate new players to game because the missions now incredible hard for new players.
This is not a good treat for new players if they will just suffer from painful gameplay instantly when they start play with Eve.
Redundandis
Doomheim
#1634 - 2012-12-15 17:58:18 UTC
May have been mentioned before.

Next time, before you force the Items Limit on everyone, make sure the people that have a gazillion of bpc's have a proper way of sorting them. Meaning: Make Containers PROPERLY usable in a POS. Or even better, make BPC's stackable. I KNOW that is probably a lot of work for you guys, but ... well...
Proddy Scun
Doomheim
#1635 - 2012-12-15 18:03:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Proddy Scun
While hugely improved for virtual-fiscal wardec purposes, the Bounty system is still quite broken vs hi sec criminals.

Simply put

Shocked Competent Pirates use Moneylaundering Shocked

Oops and bounties mainly provide just a little extra expense ISK when an extra gang member shoots them just as CONCORD attacks. Oops



Just like RL organized crime, the guys who do the dirty work are dedicated sacrificial soldier peons with little to lose and the fatcats profiteers are isolated from Retribution by a firewall of moneylaundering legerdemain.

To get at the toons actually pocketing the big ISK from crime we need a skill called
Big smile"ISK Tracing"Big smile

similar to locator agents and RL

and of course a pirate skill "moneylaundering" to counter that (higher SP multiplier & less effective)

ISK tracing would not be instant but would be a EVEmail reply or hangar report delivery -- thus reducing EVE server CPU burden.



In EVE professional pirate toons are dedicated to flying nothing but destroyers and maybe the haulers to pick up loot. Maybe 2% fly something like a Tornado if they hunt bigger game. Even clone and implants costs maybe minimized. Due to negative impacts of wardecs most were already in dedicated pirate corps and alliances. With Retribution's corp and alliance bounties potentially footing bill for wardec they would be silly not to go dedicated in corp and alliance.

Actual pirate/gankers simply fly/have nothing of much value to bounty hunters. They transfer all the big loot and big ISK to another toon...possibly on another account. Nothing you can do to a professional pirate will get you Retribution for more than trivial losses (they messed up targets).

To get to the wiseguy toon really making use of the ill gotten gains of crime you need to be able to trace ISK. Following ships in EVE seldom yields an answer since "Give ISK" can jump anywhere without trace...currently.


Idea Possible Details:

I suggest that "ISK Tracing" skill be difficult and not widespread among players.

Thus using the skill should require not only skill minimums for task (suggest x8 skill multipier) but also corp or alliance standings of 5.0 in addtion to personal standings of the appropriate type. Also certain effects should require corps with a certain minimum membership size. Membership size means its harder or more expensive to manipulate standings on a moments notice.

Skill level would dictate the size and frequency of ISK or property transfer necessary for tracking. Skill level 1 might for instance only see one time transfers of over 250 million ISK. Level 2 might detect one time transfers of over 50 million and transfers totalling over 250 million to the same toon/corp/alliance within the same day (10 million minimum transfer). Level 3 might expand to finding 100 million transferred to the same entity in 3 day period (5 million minimum transfer). Level 4 would find 100M in a week via sums as small as 1 Million. Level 5 would flag any entity with over 100 transfers in a month in addition to stuff of level 4 and below. Direct trade of items would count as the ISK value given by the inventory program.

Tracing could be either via CONCORD standings for all EVE members or via Factional Warfare corps with tracing to terminated once in hands of first foreign born citizen. That is factional based tracing could not trace ISK at all if the original pirate was foreign born and alliance/corp with 5.0 CONCORD could trace anywhere. Both of these political standings are intended to reflect governement trust and access.


Membership (reflecting widespread government contacts):
30 members would allow you to trace ISK transfers one toon distance from original pirate to the top 10 recipients.
300 members would allow you to trace ISK transfers two toons distant at a reduction in skill of 2 levels to the top 5 receivers.
3000 members would allow you to trace ISK transfers three toons distant at a skill level reduction of 3 less to the top 3 receivers.
There maybe a government agent fee similar to locator agent and it may vary by number of top recipients requested and distance of tracing.

Sad It should be very difficult to trace ISK more than one level away from original pirate and only specialized (and probably expensive) corps should be so entrusted. They in turn probably would need to hire protection merc corps to avoid pirate assassins.

Big smile But for the proper fee you should be able to find out in couple days where the that pirate is sending his ill gotten gains...and place a bounty on the right guys. Big smile

Pirates and their bosses should of course be able to defend themsleves from this intrusion of government associates into their private business. But its a delicate matter to further obscure you tracks. Suggest skill "Moneylaundering" be at twice the SP multiplier as "ISK tracing" (hey you can afford +5 sets). Suggest that the level effects be a reduction in apparent size and frequency of transfers. Suggest that this be an active skill with bribes paid to NPC agents on a monthly basis -- perhaps by faction of effect. Perhaps the payment of bribes can be done at a lower level producing results lower than maximum skill level suggests is possible.
Proddy Scun
Doomheim
#1636 - 2012-12-15 18:13:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Proddy Scun
Redundandis wrote:
May have been mentioned before.

Next time, before you force the Items Limit on everyone, make sure the people that have a gazillion of bpc's have a proper way of sorting them. Meaning: Make Containers PROPERLY usable in a POS. Or even better, make BPC's stackable. I KNOW that is probably a lot of work for you guys, but ... well...



BPCs are not stackable due to the potential research differences.


POS containers are irrating but do simulate the fact that you are not docked and walking in your warehouse.
Thus the requirement that you take containers aboard pressurized ships to sort container contents.

Audit log containers may do slight better job of sorting once aboard ship. But other than the need for taking containers aboard combat ships with small holds...I don't really see the issue with sorting BPCs as worse than on stations.

In fact CCP has made things a lot better by making containers renamable while in ship holds and making small container BPOs available. You can simply make more containers on the spot and label the contaienr appropriately. Quite a few BPCs fit in one small container yet a small continer does not take up outrageous space if you got lots of categories for BPCs.
Wigster Atild
Enderas's Holdings Corporation
#1637 - 2012-12-15 18:30:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Wigster Atild
CCP Eterne wrote:
EVE Online: Retribution 1.0 has been deployed successfully.

Retribution 1.0 brings a large amount of improvements, including a new and improved Crimewatch, a new way to hunt bounties, 4 new destroyers, a new mining frigate, tons of rebalanced frigates and cruisers, and a lot more.

For full details, especially already known issues, please check the patch notes.

This thread is for general feedback. If you encounter any issues please use the Retribution 1.0 issues thread here.


Only 6 players liked this post... compaired to the 1600+ post most of which are objecting in some way or another without reply and most with alot more likes..
CCP FAIL should have been the one to make this thread... IMHO
Redundandis
Doomheim
#1638 - 2012-12-15 19:30:24 UTC
Proddy Scun wrote:
BPCs are not stackable due to the potential research differences.

Yeah, thats why i talked about programming effort. They should have found a way to get that sorted years ago. Imagine a bpc hangar where all the bpc's that are the exact same stats are stacked. So beautiful. So clean. And no problems with too much Items on that end.
Proddy Scun wrote:

POS containers are irrating but do simulate the fact that you are not docked and walking in your warehouse.
Thus the requirement that you take containers aboard pressurized ships to sort container contents.

Sounds like a load of bull to me. So you're trying to sell me that a corporate Hangar array that is made exactly made for the purpose of sorting and storing stuff in a pos doesn't possess the "container"- abilities that every Ship with a cargohold has?
Nah.

Why make the already *really annoying* life in a pos even harder?
Imagine if you're an Inventer in a Wormhole or hell, just a wormhole corp with a lot of stuff. You don't even have that quick access to containers, possibly for days.
Proddy Scun wrote:

Audit log containers may do slight better job of sorting once aboard ship. But other than the need for taking containers aboard combat ships with small holds...I don't really see the issue with sorting BPCs as worse than on stations.


Let me give you a short insight on how i did it before: I copied a bpc, threw them all in one hangar, used the search function to get the ones i wanted, pulled them out, had tidi, did the rest. I understand that there are a lot of people who probably already used containers before, but for me there was never any need.
Anyway, easy as pie. So even IF i accept the solution with flying a ship there just to get ~50 containers sorted and named, it's still harder and more annoying then it was before. Since this game is constantly technologically progressing, restrictions like that should go away, not be more "strictly enforced".

What I'm trying to say here is: Since CCP already knows POS's are borked and the whole system needs revamping... you know, just don't touch it in a bad way until you've done that.
Wigster Atild
Enderas's Holdings Corporation
#1639 - 2012-12-16 01:08:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Wigster Atild
Yonis Kador wrote:
"We need to get back to our roots if that makes sense. I think EVE has become a little soft, as strange as it sounds. It’s really easy to make money, it’s pretty safe, it’s become too much of a happy fairy land where everyone holds hands and eats lollipops than the dystopian universe it’s supposed to be.

I basically want to give some people a special set of shovels to build massive sandcastles, while at the same time giving another set of players reinforced steel boots that come with directions to stomp said sandcastles. Winter is going to be a ton of fun, whether you like creating, or just tearing everything down."


--Kristoffer "CCP Soundwave" Touborg




So far the only people I see with reinforced steel boots are employees as they stomp all over the mechanics of the game and a minority of players who just cannot be happy sharing a game with others who don't want to just shoot everything...
How many players really think that the Retribution expansion gave them 'steel boots'?? Not that many judging by the % of negative feedback.. I read once in a Eve form thread.. many moons ago that the vocal mass in the forum is a representation of the community as a whole... so based on the current feedback i'd say most players are p***ed..

CCP Soundwave got some things right in that quote though, they sure stomped all over the ability to make isk... unless you have the real world cash to buy extra PLEX to trade for isk tHowever players can no longer make as much isk as before Retribution .. Forcing more players to buy PLEX as a way of making extra isk...It seems self-defeating to me and it seems more like a way to make money selling PLEX than as a genuine concern about how easy it is to accumulate isk or they wouldn't like players basically getting free isk from selling PLEX. Also removing PLEX at this point would reduce the number of active account significantly and CCP know it and so they want to milk it.

Quote:
by Necromancer

we have graded security systems for a reason that reason may not be clear to gun ho shooter gamers But the lower the level of security the more of the games content becomes open to the players. You have the choice to play at the level of security you feel you are ready for or the areas of the game which hold the content you wish to access.
Quote:


Looks like CCP Soundwave forgot that basic isk making mechanic.. the lower the security the better the ore, rat drops, complex's and so on..
There is no disputing the lower the sec level of a system the better game content gets, if it wasn't there would be no need for big alliances to be fighting over sectors of null space that have the best resources They wold just be fighting in Jita. So if its now a defunct set of mechanics that plays no part in deciding how safe a system is to play in then why should high sec systems still be limited to crappy ores, and crappy loot drops? surely if we have to have a greater risk of PVP we should also get a greater portion of the game content to play with too?

I think CCP Soundwave has missed the concept of running a business, you cannot just put 1 item on the menu and expect every customer to like it, some will simply go to a better restaurant with more choice.. I guess that's ok if most of your patrons are to dumb to complain and just put up with it.

If you continue to try to force feed players something they don't want they will leave.. most business's I know of actually have a much lower profit margin than most people realize.. how large a % of Eve players (most with multiple accounts supported with PLEX bought with isk) need to quit before it hampers new game development or the ability to keep the very complex program (as repeatedly stressed by Dev's) working bug free?

There is more than enough ways to get into a dog fight or small fleet engagement or even large scale fleet battles.. so with all these ways of fighting why are players still avoiding direct conflict also known as PVP?

Maybe instead of trying to force regulated change to a game claimed to be an 'unscripted sandbox' you might try returning to a larger menu to appeal to the larger clientèle base that you actually have...

One last thing for all players who think everything in Eve is PVP...
PVP is player on player 'combat'.. The game has lots of content that does not include the need to open fire on another player.. Take fleets for instance if the only way to play is in constant conflict with all other players as the term 'everything is pvp' would suggest then there is no place for fleets because fleets are about co operation its PLAYERS V PLAYERS not player v player .. same with corps and alliances too if you participate in these things you are 'Interacting' not 'PVPing' ergo not everything is PVP
Yonis Kador
KADORCORP
#1640 - 2012-12-16 02:48:09 UTC
Wigster,

This is the point in the conversation where, after explaning why the sky is blue, and being granted a response of, "No. It is yellow," one is left with repeating himself or walking away. As my intention wasn't to derail the feedback thread - only to respond to claims of cyberbullying - I give up.

When two players are competing for the same resources, whether those resources are in rocks, modules, or flying around in packs that is pvp. Players are competing against one another. That you cannot disassociate the term pvp from bullets has absolutely no bearing on its definition.

Have a great day.

YK