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Faction Frigates but no Destroyers in Novice Plexes?

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Dan Carter Murray
#41 - 2012-12-04 14:17:46 UTC
Hidden Snake wrote:
I am fascinated by usual bullshit of overpowered ships in eve .... huh .... AC thrasher can be killed one way .... 10mn ab cormy other one .... that how this game works. Unfortunately some CCP thinks that tears polishing is the way to design the game Roll

and BTW Xgal ... some of the thrashers u posted are arty .... very easy to kill in ur usual blaster comet.


he never flew blaster comet :( always TD rail :(

http://mfi.re/?j7ldoco 50GB free space @ MediaFire.com
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#42 - 2012-12-04 14:24:19 UTC
Dan Carter Murray wrote:
Hidden Snake wrote:
I am fascinated by usual bullshit of overpowered ships in eve .... huh .... AC thrasher can be killed one way .... 10mn ab cormy other one .... that how this game works. Unfortunately some CCP thinks that tears polishing is the way to design the game Roll
and BTW Xgal ... some of the thrashers u posted are arty .... very easy to kill in ur usual blaster comet.

he never flew blaster comet :( always TD rail :(
Either way, the point was that Thrashers aren't "all that".
Zarnak Wulf
Task Force 641
Empyrean Edict
#43 - 2012-12-04 15:07:23 UTC
The Thrasher is the new rifter. It just doesn't realize it yet. Do you want a sniper? The new Corm can put 388 DPS out to 23km optimal. Within 5 seconds it can switch to 212 DPS at 83km. The new Beam Coercer tracks 30% better then an arty thrasher, switches ammo instantly, and ranges from 416 DPS at 14km to 241 DPS at 53 km. Firing every two seconds for both ships make them much more flexible. You don't have to wait until 'you see the whites of their eyes.'

Maybe a brawler is more your speed? The Algos puts out similar DPS to an armor thrasher and has 40%-45% more EHP. The new Catalyst has more gank, better projection, and is now faster then the Thrasher. The age of Winmatar is over.
Hidden Snake
Inglorious-Basterds
#44 - 2012-12-04 15:17:58 UTC
Dan Carter Murray wrote:
Hidden Snake wrote:
I am fascinated by usual bullshit of overpowered ships in eve .... huh .... AC thrasher can be killed one way .... 10mn ab cormy other one .... that how this game works. Unfortunately some CCP thinks that tears polishing is the way to design the game Roll

and BTW Xgal ... some of the thrashers u posted are arty .... very easy to kill in ur usual blaster comet.


he never flew blaster comet :( always TD rail :(



yesterday I was chasing him and I thing i saw blaster fit ... anyway ... will rip him apart later and we will find out.

and yesh rail comet is good. :)
Hidden Snake
Inglorious-Basterds
#45 - 2012-12-04 15:20:39 UTC
Zarnak Wulf wrote:
The Thrasher is the new rifter. It just doesn't realize it yet. Do you want a sniper? The new Corm can put 388 DPS out to 23km optimal. Within 5 seconds it can switch to 212 DPS at 83km. The new Beam Coercer tracks 30% better then an arty thrasher, switches ammo instantly, and ranges from 416 DPS at 14km to 241 DPS at 53 km. Firing every two seconds for both ships make them much more flexible. You don't have to wait until 'you see the whites of their eyes.'

Maybe a brawler is more your speed? The Algos puts out similar DPS to an armor thrasher and has 40%-45% more EHP. The new Catalyst has more gank, better projection, and is now faster then the Thrasher. The age of Winmatar is over.


Day of destroyers ... even new cruisers will be pretty ****** up ...

well anyway life of EVE .... in one cycle CCP buffs in another nerfs ....
Princess Nexxala
Zero Syndicate
#46 - 2012-12-04 15:39:17 UTC
Armor fit standard? Ok, it's bad but I will buy that. Anything 250 fit without a 10mn ab is just horrible, as is anything with a 1mn ab.
So yeah agree to disagreeBig smile


ShahFluffers wrote:
Princess Nexxala wrote:
Well, when you want to wave your epeen, I recommend finding ones that are not 100% **** fit, solo would help as well. Blink
Otherwise your point is irrelevant.

X Gallentius wrote:
Gunship wrote:
Getting rid of the over powered Trasher can only be good for the game play.
Yes, Thrashers are overpowered. Nobody can kill them. They are too tough. They ruin the game for every frigate pilot. There is no counter to them.

I cannot tellyou how many times I have lost my ship to them in solo situations. Ban them. Ban them all to hell!

Who wants to do the sniper cormorant post?


Most of those Thrasher fits are actually pretty standard. Many of them are solo too. What?

nom nom
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#47 - 2012-12-04 16:50:28 UTC  |  Edited by: X Gallentius
Zarnak Wulf wrote:
The Thrasher is the new rifter. It just doesn't realize it yet.
you want sensor boosted omgwtfpwn alpha? Use a thrasher or two. Which is how it ought to be btw. Thrasher alpha is OP and the other ships should have an advantage over it in other areas.
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#48 - 2012-12-04 18:01:18 UTC
Zarnak Wulf wrote:
Th The Algos puts out similar DPS to an armor thrasher and has 40%-45% more EHP.

Building 5 Algos hulls now. Need good fit. Any suggestions?
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#49 - 2012-12-04 18:36:02 UTC
X Gallentius wrote:
Zarnak Wulf wrote:
Th The Algos puts out similar DPS to an armor thrasher and has 40%-45% more EHP.

Building 5 Algos hulls now. Need good fit. Any suggestions?


I'm no good at fitting, so don't take this without a pinch of salt, but at a guess...

5x Light Ion Blaster II (pack Void, Null and CalNav Antimatter)

1x 1MN Afterburner II
1x Warp Disruptor II/Warp Scrambler II as neccessary
1x Small Cap Booster II (Navy 200)

1x Small Armour Repairer II
1x Damage Control Unit II
1x EANM II / 1x MagStab II

Rigs as neccessary

5x Hob II
5x Warrior II

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Zarnak Wulf
Task Force 641
Empyrean Edict
#50 - 2012-12-04 18:42:57 UTC
X Gallentius wrote:
Zarnak Wulf wrote:
Th The Algos puts out similar DPS to an armor thrasher and has 40%-45% more EHP.

Building 5 Algos hulls now. Need good fit. Any suggestions?


I used this on one of the test servers and got quite a few compliments:

High:
75mm Rail II x 5
Small unstable power fluctuator
Mid:
Limited MWD
Faint Epsilon warp scrambler
Fleeting propulsion Inhhibitor
Low:
DC II
EANM II
400mm rolled tungsten
Rigs:
Trimarks x 3

Depending on drone choices you'll get 250 - 300 DPS. It has over 13k EHP. I have a genolution set and can squeeze on a T2 plate. It gives me 13.6k EHP. If you throw slaves, legion boosts, etc you can get up to 27.7k EHP.
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#51 - 2012-12-04 19:18:06 UTC  |  Edited by: X Gallentius
Edit: So far it seems the first three levels can be omgwtfpwn'd by any T1 frig. So I expect farmers to have a field day once again. We'll be able to test out whether or not the limit on "over-contesting" systems helps or not.
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#52 - 2012-12-04 19:57:17 UTC
X Gallentius wrote:
So far it seems L1 and L2 can be omgwtfpwn'd by any T1 frig. So I expect farmers to have a field day once again. We'll be able to test out whether or not the limit on "over-contesting" systems helps or not.




If no one shows up to pvp its all farming.

Farming in a t2 cruiser instead of a frigate, is still farming.

Plus some people may want to fight destroyers or t2 frigates in t1 frigates. Why have the rats make this impossible?

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
marketjacker
Mr. Clean Corp..
#53 - 2012-12-05 03:16:38 UTC
Hidden Snake wrote:
Zarnak Wulf wrote:
The Thrasher is the new rifter. It just doesn't realize it yet. Do you want a sniper? The new Corm can put 388 DPS out to 23km optimal. Within 5 seconds it can switch to 212 DPS at 83km. The new Beam Coercer tracks 30% better then an arty thrasher, switches ammo instantly, and ranges from 416 DPS at 14km to 241 DPS at 53 km. Firing every two seconds for both ships make them much more flexible. You don't have to wait until 'you see the whites of their eyes.'

Maybe a brawler is more your speed? The Algos puts out similar DPS to an armor thrasher and has 40%-45% more EHP. The new Catalyst has more gank, better projection, and is now faster then the Thrasher. The age of Winmatar is over.


Day of destroyers ... even new cruisers will be pretty ****** up ...

well anyway life of EVE .... in one cycle CCP buffs in another nerfs ....


You are a whiny f'ing *****.
Mich Farmer
24th Imperial Crusade
Amarr Empire
#54 - 2012-12-05 08:27:17 UTC
X Gallentius wrote:
So far it seems the first three levels can be omgwtfpwn'd by any T1 frig. So I expect farmers to have a field day once again.


And you seem to be complaining? We all know CCP didnt introduce timer rollback yet because Hans and frogs probably screamed it to CCP. They only want to have such things up when they have had proper time to entrench on that high-tier.
Colt Blackhawk
Doomheim
#55 - 2012-12-05 15:36:25 UTC
Don´t understand the whining here about the Hookbill.
As experienced Hook pilot I can tell it is really easy to counter because Hook really lacks dps in comparison to other faction frigs. Double repped Incursus can probably tank it infinitely.
The same issue like with all other caldari boats: Good tank but lame dps. Although lame dps at good range.

[09:04:53] Ashira Twilight > Plant the f****** amarr flag and s*** on their smoking wrecks.
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#56 - 2012-12-05 19:11:40 UTC
Mich Farmer wrote:
X Gallentius wrote:
So far it seems the first three levels can be omgwtfpwn'd by any T1 frig. So I expect farmers to have a field day once again.


And you seem to be complaining? We all know CCP didnt introduce timer rollback yet because Hans and frogs probably screamed it to CCP. They only want to have such things up when they have had proper time to entrench on that high-tier.


I don't talk to Hans anymore. I told CCP's chatgris, Yttr, and Fozzie exactly that though. Hopefully it'll get implemented when we get to Tier 5.
Seraph Castillon
Death Metal Frogs
Ribbit.
#57 - 2012-12-05 19:27:34 UTC
Colt Blackhawk wrote:
Don´t understand the whining here about the Hookbill.
As experienced Hook pilot I can tell it is really easy to counter because Hook really lacks dps in comparison to other faction frigs. Double repped Incursus can probably tank it infinitely.
The same issue like with all other caldari boats: Good tank but lame dps. Although lame dps at good range.


The thing with the Hookbill is not the tank and it's DPS is irrelevant. It has "enough" of it. It has 5 mids and that gives it the ability to both mitigate damage and completely dictate range at the same time. It makes it very hard to counter.
Yes, the Incursus will tank it forever. The Incursus will tank a lot of frigates forever. However, there is no way an Incursus with that fit can kill a hookbill, unless the pilot messes up severely.


Also: is it me or do the new destroyers have similar DPS to the old ones but with about twice the EHP?
Zarnak Wulf
Task Force 641
Empyrean Edict
#58 - 2012-12-05 19:52:13 UTC
The new destroyers are different. The drone boats have delayed DPS. They need more tank to survive while it is applied. They are also very slow and slightly larger then their older cousins. The missile boats have consistent DPS across a large range. They are also larger and they can't hit the DPS extremes that the other destroyers can.
Colt Blackhawk
Doomheim
#59 - 2012-12-06 12:27:29 UTC
Quote:
The thing with the Hookbill is not the tank and it's DPS is irrelevant. It has "enough" of it. It has 5 mids and that gives it the ability to both mitigate damage and completely dictate range at the same time. It makes it very hard to counter.
Yes, the Incursus will tank it forever. The Incursus will tank a lot of frigates forever. However, there is no way an Incursus with that fit can kill a hookbill, unless the pilot messes up severely.


Also: is it me or do the new destroyers have similar DPS to the old ones but with about twice the EHP?


Have you ever flown a hook? Because the brawler fits s....completely in fw. It has the same problem all caldari missile boats have: Low dps. You can get very good hook fits, yes.
But don´t tell me that ?&%$§=? about mid slots and so on.
When an Incursus enters I can´t do nothing in a hook. Okay.... the brawler Hook will die to Incursus. Slasher and breacher is problematic too bur that depends very much on the fit. So first try and then write something. Hookbill is a great ship but you need hellish much experience with it to fly and fit it properly and you still be very helpless vs many targets.
Actually all tech 1 and non pirate faction frigs with exception of Punisher (because it s....) and Tormentor (see Punisher) are really good balanced. Okay executioner is also not as good like atron, slasher, condor.
What we really need on the frig sector is a rebalance of pirate faction frigs and tech2 stuff.
After some days of Retribution I can really say that CCP has done a great job with the new plexes.
I feared "plexorama2" but the new rats are great, rookie plex is super and although I had doubts, almost all improvements and changes to fw seem to be really good.

[09:04:53] Ashira Twilight > Plant the f****** amarr flag and s*** on their smoking wrecks.
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#60 - 2012-12-06 12:45:10 UTC
Colt Blackhawk wrote:
Quote:
The thing with the Hookbill is not the tank and it's DPS is irrelevant. It has "enough" of it. It has 5 mids and that gives it the ability to both mitigate damage and completely dictate range at the same time. It makes it very hard to counter.
Yes, the Incursus will tank it forever. The Incursus will tank a lot of frigates forever. However, there is no way an Incursus with that fit can kill a hookbill, unless the pilot messes up severely.


Also: is it me or do the new destroyers have similar DPS to the old ones but with about twice the EHP?


Have you ever flown a hook? Because the brawler fits s....completely in fw. It has the same problem all caldari missile boats have: Low dps. You can get very good hook fits, yes.
But don´t tell me that ?&%$§=? about mid slots and so on.
When an Incursus enters I can´t do nothing in a hook. Okay.... the brawler Hook will die to Incursus. Slasher and breacher is problematic too bur that depends very much on the fit. So first try and then write something. Hookbill is a great ship but you need hellish much experience with it to fly and fit it properly and you still be very helpless vs many targets.
Actually all tech 1 and non pirate faction frigs with exception of Punisher (because it s....) and Tormentor (see Punisher) are really good balanced. Okay executioner is also not as good like atron, slasher, condor.
What we really need on the frig sector is a rebalance of pirate faction frigs and tech2 stuff.
After some days of Retribution I can really say that CCP has done a great job with the new plexes.
I feared "plexorama2" but the new rats are great, rookie plex is super and although I had doubts, almost all improvements and changes to fw seem to be really good.



Not sure why you are having trouble with the hookbill. I often fly the armor tank ab td double web scram fit and i will have my chances against any pirate frigate. I have had good luck against most of the old dessies. And other faction frigates and t1 frigates (other than perhaps a kiting kestrel or condor) stand no chance of killing me.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815