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So when is early too early

Author
Boughan Maroon
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1 - 2012-11-22 11:41:53 UTC
So I am looking to possibly move into a WH (C5) with a new corp. This is a big step (for me at least), as I have never been to a WH before (as a resident at least). I have spent the last couple months in null with a training corp (great group of people btw.) and there are some who have advised me against WH life. Main has a bit over 10 mil SP, can fly battleships reasonably well. I have good exploration skills also.

What can the WH collective advise? When is early (10 mil sp) too early? Are there any activities that can be done solo in a C5 (given my skillpoints)?

I want to make the right move, but after talking to some corpies about it I am just not sure anymore.

All advise is welcome.

B.
Aducat Ragnarson
Blootered Bastards
#2 - 2012-11-22 11:55:28 UTC
Just hop right in! Your lack of skillpoints can easily be compensated by using faction, or even better pirate BS instead of regular BS. I would also strongly suggest a faction Pos filled with Faction guns, to scare of potential attackers. Having a lot of carriers and dreadnaughts floating in the shields, even if you cannot fly them, will usually also scare away most people who might be otherwise inclined to attack you.
The sites in a C5 can be easily done solo in machariels or vindicators, just be sure to faction fit, or even officer fit these to maximise your income and decrease the time that it takes to run the side. Remember: The longer you are in the site, the better you can be attacked. Therefore, always faction fit your pirate BS for maximum damage.
Fly safe, and good luck in your wormhole endevours.
Hathrul
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#3 - 2012-11-22 11:56:55 UTC
im not entirely sure if you want to move into a new corp, or move a corp into c5 wh space....

anyway.
10 million sp is very low, but it can be done. sites can be run with battleships or tengu's with a nice RR setup. its done a lot still. As for solo.....no. Even with 100m sp you cant solo c5 wormholes. A carrier might be able to solo some thing, but it would take hours. other then that you need fleets. or many many alts
Borlag Crendraven
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2012-11-22 12:08:59 UTC
Outside scanning, puffing gas/mining in already cleared ladar/grav sites, clearing the low end ladars and gravs, there's not much you can do solo in a C5 wormhole. As in all the actual combat sites will be much more than you can handle solo.

In terms of PvP, you have to be prepared to fend off opponents in HAC fleets, T3 fleets and occasionally against either of the former fleets reinforced with a capital or two. In short, 10M SP tends to be a bit short on the options unless you're highly specialized into doing just that.

Also, battleships are generally avoided in wormholes simply because they're not worth their mass. If you look at the highest dps subcap boat for example, which is the Vindicator. It can boast a massive 2000dps all the while webbing the opponents with 90% webs, essentially forcing them to stay there. With every single vindicator passing through a wormhole, you could instead bring 20 Proteuses for 1000dps each, that is how big the mass difference is.

All in all, I'd highly recommend trying to join an already existing wormhole corp if you really must start with wormholes that have capital capable holes, or making your home in a smaller class wormhole instead for that new corp such as a C3.
Boughan Maroon
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#5 - 2012-11-22 12:16:25 UTC
Aducat Ragnarson wrote:
Just hop right in! Your lack of skillpoints can easily be compensated by using faction, or even better pirate BS instead of regular BS. I would also strongly suggest a faction Pos filled with Faction guns, to scare of potential attackers. Having a lot of carriers and dreadnaughts floating in the shields, even if you cannot fly them, will usually also scare away most people who might be otherwise inclined to attack you.
The sites in a C5 can be easily done solo in machariels or vindicators, just be sure to faction fit, or even officer fit these to maximise your income and decrease the time that it takes to run the side. Remember: The longer you are in the site, the better you can be attacked. Therefore, always faction fit your pirate BS for maximum damage.
Fly safe, and good luck in your wormhole endevours.



hehe, somehow my sarcasm detector has a bent needle now...


Boughan Maroon
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#6 - 2012-11-22 12:18:19 UTC
Just to clarify. I would move in with an already established WH corp. The question about solo is just that I sometimes play at odd hours and thus not too many corpies might be online..

Keep the replies coming
chris elliot
Lazerhawks
L A Z E R H A W K S
#7 - 2012-11-22 12:29:39 UTC
In that case there is plenty you can do to make isk.

And if you are already set for isk and few people are online you can easily find yourself a nullsec exit and go on a roam until either people get back online, or you die. Either way you did something and had fun.
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#8 - 2012-11-22 12:33:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Jack Miton
how many active pilots in your corp and are they all low sp like you?
i would highly suggest having at least a few people with good skills and good Wh experience in corp before moving to a C5.
you also want at least 20 active pilots id say.

it also depends on your static a lot.
if you move to a c5 with c2 static then sp isnt really an issue since you can for the c2 sites with a drake if you want.
if you want to run the c5 sites in your system tho, you really want capital pilots, dreads and carriers. at the very least you need 2-3 triage capable carrier pilots so they can run logi for your pve fleets (you only need 1 at a time).

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout

Boughan Maroon
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#9 - 2012-11-22 13:10:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Boughan Maroon
Jack Miton wrote:
how many active pilots in your corp and are they all low sp like you?
i would highly suggest having at least a few people with good skills and good Wh experience in corp before moving to a C5.
you also want at least 20 active pilots id say.

it also depends on your static a lot.
if you move to a c5 with c2 static then sp isnt really an issue since you can for the c2 sites with a drake if you want.
if you want to run the c5 sites in your system tho, you really want capital pilots, dreads and carriers. at the very least you need 2-3 triage capable carrier pilots so they can run logi for your pve fleets (you only need 1 at a time).



An Honor that Mr. WH himself posts here (I read the stickies and guides).

The corp I am looking to join is well established (from what I can tell) and has experienced (cap) pilots.

Really my main concern was that I am just sitting in the WH twiddling my thumbs if no one else is on. That questions has, at least in part been answered. I was / am just also a bit worried about my ability to contribute fully, given my lowish SP. Any particular skills (skillbooks) you would recommend for WH life. Exploration I have down pat.

Thank you all for your replies!

B.
Matt Ellis
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#10 - 2012-11-22 14:39:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Matt Ellis
Contributing in wormholes comes in 3 flavours..

1. Scanning.. and lots of it.
2. Shooting...
3. Salvaging...and yes, there is lots of that.

If you are worried about dragging the corp down, find out where they want you to be at, then possibly ask them about salvaging(for a share of loot of course), while you train up to the desired skills...

However, you will find that wormholes can work with any pilots, as long as you have the right fleet.

Skills to have in a wormhole(from my opinion) as a must:

-Scanning(you already said you have those) Anything Astrometrics, i would train to 4 at the very least. 7 sisters probes are very effective...

-Covert Ops- Fits into the point above, but is a MUST.. Epic bonus to scanning from Cov-ops Frigates or Covert SS on T3..

-Stealth Bombers-Sometimes nothing beats a fleet bombing run to show that enemy who's boss- just be sure to use the same damage type bomb as the fleet... wouldn't want your 1 thermal destroying 10 kinetics before they get their mark now, would we?

-Salvaging-As mentioned above, you never know when you might need to do it.. where it is clearing out Grav/Ladar rats on your own to pocket some potential ISK, you're gonna need to salvage to get the good drops..

-Tanking - Sleepers do Omni damage(if you didnt know already) You need ALL resists at about the same level, as they hit your lowest resist. So having 50/90/97/99 for instance is pointless.. your only going to get 50% resists to sleepers..

-Energy management, if you don't already... Sleepers neut.. alot..be ready.

Now for some other paths- Depending on what you want to do in the wormhole..

-Logistics - Obviously for Logi ops. if you're not going to be logi, don't worry...
+---OR, possibly remote shield or armour repair for a spider fleet op...Spider fit drakes and tengus are often used...

-Heavy Interdicters - This ain't null. you drop into a wormhole within 10km of the sig.. so close combat is gonna happen.. its nice to have a HIC waiting on the other side to catch the polarized enemies..:D

-Mining - If there is nothing happening, and you get the urge to mine, it can be a way to pass the time.. heck, i do it and manufacture parts with the ore from time to time...

-Gas Harvesting - In c5's and c6's there is some really great gas to be got. worth billions! To train Gas Harvesting to V takes about 4 days... its a low end skill. Its worth it... Sometimes, your corp might want to pull in a load of gas to build a new fleet of t3s. You would get on well with them if you helped them, and with every ship doing so, it reduces the time the corp has to be in the site, ergo reducing the time in which you can get ganked... Also, if you find soem lower sites... a cloud of 3000(3000m3 worth) c50 is worth about 30 mil.. takes 10-15 minutes to suck in solo, and can be a nice money spinner to pass time, if thats your thing..:D

I've probably left some stuff out, or not even thought of any.. These skills are based off my residence in 2 c2s and a c4 wormhole.

Oh, and if you didnt know. Expect to go days without seeing empire if you live in a c4+ Sometimes it CAN be a pain to get out, so prepare for it. when you get an exit. always think, "What MIGHT i need from Jita". possibly spare PvE and PvP ships...
Archdaimon
Merchants of the Golden Goose
#11 - 2012-11-22 15:00:18 UTC
We've accepted people on occasion with as little as 10 mil skill points.

Generally what you want to do is:

1) be able to scan at rudimentary level. Everyone loves a guy who scans down chains, even though it takes him a bit longer. (Rudimentary is imo: Covops frigate, 4,3,3,3. with faction stuff scanning thingies).

2) Early on, until you can fly the t3 of your choice, a battlecruiser with t2 equipment.

3) Train for a t3 of the corps choice. Be able to t2 fit it (as min.). Ask them what their doctrine is.

4) Train gassing 5. Just do it. now. It's a great source of income.

5) Train salvaging 5 after you can fly a t3. T3 salvagers are greatly appreciated in sites.

My answer?

- If 1 and 2 is yes, and you are currently training for t3, you're good to go if you're a nice guy.

Wormholes have the best accoustics. It's known. - Sing it for me -

Zara Arran
Overload This
Escalation Theory
#12 - 2012-11-22 16:32:03 UTC
Most of the advise I would have for you, is already given by previous posters.

I wanted to give you a personal note as I started in WH space (a C4) after only weeks of starting this game, and moved to a C6 at approximately 10M SPs. So.. I know where you are coming from ;) It's definitely not impossible, but a lot resides on your determination and drive.

If you want a list of skills (what to train for first) you are welcome to check out AHARM's forums. We have a list of skills set as prerequisites for applicants (some skills are more improtant than others).

Good luck in W-space!
Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#13 - 2012-11-22 16:54:23 UTC
Depending on your static a C1-C3 will give you plenty of possible things to do (and chances to lose your ship depending on your level of awareness and WH experience) solo.

Within a C5 there is little to do solo other than the easier ladars and/or getting someone to clear the harder ladar spawn so you can bear later.
chris elliot
Lazerhawks
L A Z E R H A W K S
#14 - 2012-11-22 17:11:18 UTC
Matt Ellis wrote:


Oh, and if you didnt know. Expect to go days without seeing empire if you live in a c4+ Sometimes it CAN be a pain to get out, so prepare for it. when you get an exit. always think, "What MIGHT i need from Jita". possibly spare PvE and PvP ships...



Never not buy 3-5 pvp ships at a time when the opportunity presents itself.
Boughan Maroon
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#15 - 2012-11-22 17:47:42 UTC
Archdaimon wrote:
We've accepted people on occasion with as little as 10 mil skill points.

Generally what you want to do is:

1) be able to scan at rudimentary level. Everyone loves a guy who scans down chains, even though it takes him a bit longer. (Rudimentary is imo: Covops frigate, 4,3,3,3. with faction stuff scanning thingies).

2) Early on, until you can fly the t3 of your choice, a battlecruiser with t2 equipment.

3) Train for a t3 of the corps choice. Be able to t2 fit it (as min.). Ask them what their doctrine is.

4) Train gassing 5. Just do it. now. It's a great source of income.

5) Train salvaging 5 after you can fly a t3. T3 salvagers are greatly appreciated in sites.

My answer?

- If 1 and 2 is yes, and you are currently training for t3, you're good to go if you're a nice guy.


Got 1 & 2 down pat (can even fly SBs). Thank you for the great reply!

B.
Boughan Maroon
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#16 - 2012-11-22 17:53:13 UTC
Zara Arran wrote:
Most of the advise I would have for you, is already given by previous posters.

I wanted to give you a personal note as I started in WH space (a C4) after only weeks of starting this game, and moved to a C6 at approximately 10M SPs. So.. I know where you are coming from ;) It's definitely not impossible, but a lot resides on your determination and drive.

If you want a list of skills (what to train for first) you are welcome to check out AHARM's forums. We have a list of skills set as prerequisites for applicants (some skills are more improtant than others).

Good luck in W-space!


Thank you very much for that reply as well. I checked out the list of skills needed for your corp (an impressive list which will give me something to strive for). That tool alone will be of great assistance. Thank you.

B.
Comy 1
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#17 - 2012-11-22 19:10:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Comy 1
Hathrul wrote:
Even with 100m sp you cant solo c5 wormholes. A carrier might be able to solo some thing, but it would take hours. other then that you need fleets. or many many alts


Actually just yesterday some dude sent me a youtube vid of him running an anomaly solo with a Vargur in my c5 magnetar. Our system is small and you can see the entire system on d-scan. He didn't even use a link alt to boost him.

According to him the whole anomaly took him about 40 minutes to clear.

Now this might not be the most effective way of farming, but it is doable.
Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#18 - 2012-11-22 20:15:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Rroff
Once had a go at C5 site solo with carrier out of interest (people use the wrong type of fighters which is why it takes ages) still took around 45 minutes but not the 2-2.5 hours or so it would take with einherji. With links alt and loki alt can bring it down a lot however you still have to be a real sucker for punishment to do it as a regular thing. You need decent skills with carrier/fighters too as some sites the waves can spider rep against ~700dps.

Vargur would probably struggle with most of the sites tho if your selective I guess its possible to do the easier ones paying a lot of attention to triggers and scram ships.

EDIT: You'd probably be getting far better ISK/hour doing C4 sites in a vargur tho and your missing the capital escalation waves which make up the bulk of the extra ISK in C5 systems.
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#19 - 2012-11-22 21:06:45 UTC
Boughan Maroon wrote:
The corp I am looking to join is well established (from what I can tell) and has experienced (cap) pilots.

Really my main concern was that I am just sitting in the WH twiddling my thumbs if no one else is on. That questions has, at least in part been answered. I was / am just also a bit worried about my ability to contribute fully, given my lowish SP. Any particular skills (skillbooks) you would recommend for WH life. Exploration I have down pat..


ah i see, i thought you were moving into a wh with a new corp that is new to WHs.

joining an established corp with 10mil sp wont be an issue.
just make sure you know how they opperate fist and that you can take at least some part in their opperations and are willing to train up for the ships/methods they use

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout

Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery
Sending Thots And Players
#20 - 2012-11-23 00:27:19 UTC
I've seen C5's run by a CNR before. Well, till we podded him.
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