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Separate the four empires with low security space.

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Mike Voidstar
Voidstar Free Flight Foundation
#141 - 2012-11-27 19:36:28 UTC
Commander Ted wrote:
Mike Voidstar wrote:



Exactly. Those who enjoy the cat and mouse games already have ample opportunity and incentive to join you in lowsec. Forcing others there won't make it fun for them, they will just find something else to do, to the point of leaving the game entirely when all the fun has been sucked from the game due to this sort of change.

Lowsec is similar to the crime depressed areas of large inner cities. Lack of security for business and visitors have created economic wastelands where only those who cause the situation fare well. Everyone else just avoids the area unless they have no choice. The only way to get more targets into lowsec is to stop hunting your prey to extinction.


Sorry but I already do exploration sites in lowsec and its very safe. Occasionally I get driven out of my site but I keep my ishtar.
I really don't care if you live in lowsec or not. I just want someone to go for reasons of economic necessity which would be better than the pirate on pirate assgrabbing fest it is.



The point being YOU enjoy that kind of playstyle. When you bear you don't mind being driven off, its part of the sort of challenge you enjoy. Go you!

Others want to be able to do their thing, and don't like having to push a dscan button every few seconds, and don't enjoy the satisfaction of safely making it to a dock instead of completing their chosen activity (which in no way included being someone elses prey). That style of pvp is boring, annoying, and unenjoyable by pretty much every bear everywhere. Since there is no way to satisfactorily dealing with that unpleasantness, most choose to simply avoid it.
Commander Ted
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#142 - 2012-11-27 19:39:06 UTC
Mike Voidstar wrote:



The point being YOU enjoy that kind of playstyle. When you bear you don't mind being driven off, its part of the sort of challenge you enjoy. Go you!

Others want to be able to do their thing, and don't like having to push a dscan button every few seconds, and don't enjoy the satisfaction of safely making it to a dock instead of completing their chosen activity (which in no way included being someone elses prey). That style of pvp is boring, annoying, and unenjoyable by pretty much every bear everywhere. Since there is no way to satisfactorily dealing with that unpleasantness, most choose to simply avoid it.


Fine go me, I don't care if you don't go to low sec, I know you won't. When you wanna move your ships find a wormhole or pay someone else to do it. Your play style will change little, I will have a new opportunity for fun that won't effect you.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
Mike Voidstar
Voidstar Free Flight Foundation
#143 - 2012-11-27 20:18:01 UTC
Or, there can be no change, my playstyle and that of the biggest part of Eve remains unchanged.


If it makes you feel better I will let you buy me a big stack of haulers and I'll try and run them through the gate of your choice for 10 million a pod. I hate being podded, I promise to cry about it real good. Just be sure the isk clears my wallet first.

The problem is that you are not asking people who enjoy pvp to come pvp you, you are asking for people to be forced into being your victim for economic reasons. You want CCP to be your pimp, and provide fresh meat for your pleasure with economic pressure. People who enjoy that pvp are already there, stacked up waiting for victims and apparently playing grabass with eachother. You like it so much grab a hauler and give them something else to grab.

It isn't that the economic reasons aren't there, its that the reward isn't high enough to be victimized repeatedly. You want a service, pay for it. Find someone who likes to be hit to come scream for you.
Commander Ted
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#144 - 2012-11-27 20:31:40 UTC
Mike Voidstar wrote:
Or, there can be no change, my playstyle and that of the biggest part of Eve remains unchanged.


If it makes you feel better I will let you buy me a big stack of haulers and I'll try and run them through the gate of your choice for 10 million a pod. I hate being podded, I promise to cry about it real good. Just be sure the isk clears my wallet first.

The problem is that you are not asking people who enjoy pvp to come pvp you, you are asking for people to be forced into being your victim for economic reasons. You want CCP to be your pimp, and provide fresh meat for your pleasure with economic pressure. People who enjoy that pvp are already there, stacked up waiting for victims and apparently playing grabass with eachother. You like it so much grab a hauler and give them something else to grab.

It isn't that the economic reasons aren't there, its that the reward isn't high enough to be victimized repeatedly. You want a service, pay for it. Find someone who likes to be hit to come scream for you.


No im not. Stop assuming things. Maybe I want a fight that matters? I like how you also assume most of eve run missions and doesn't pvp just like you. I don't want to hurt your carebearing and this won't, your asking for something not to change because it would put a minor and easily counterable rain on your parade. How much time do you spend moving all those ships anyway? Seems like a lot of isk/hr lost moving all of your missioning boats. Maybe you would be better off paying someone with a static highsec wormhole and a freighter to do it for you. Maybe you can bring just your tengu and pack it in a crane then be done with it. The only people who will be hurt are people who haul without even being at their keyboard. YOUR PLAY STYLE WONT CHANGE. Really I think you have all sorts of misconceptions about how us "evil" pvpers only want to make the little carebears cry. Things that make you more isk for risk are fun. Maybe not to you but to me it is great fun. Low risk low isk trading will still be their. Low risk transporting of your assets will still be their.


https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
Mike Voidstar
Voidstar Free Flight Foundation
#145 - 2012-11-27 21:04:38 UTC
Attacking haulers isn't a "fight that matters". He is all but defenseless, and if he was properly escorted to provide some challenge in a fight would not be engaged.

I don't assume that i am typical, just that most of Eve is carebearish to some degree. The fact that there are fewer people in low and null sec by a few orders of magnitude seem to bear that out.

You asked how I would be affected, I told you. I can't help it if you don't like my reasons or find them pointless and easily circumventable.

The solution is easy. Pay me 10% and give me the ship to haul it in and Ill try to get any cargo you choose past any gate you choose. I will be your victim, or you will lose your high value cargo when I sell it at the local station. There is a fight that matters, as you must stop me and grab the ass of whoever else is around. I will even sob in local for you at the loss. You even get a second shot at my pod when I try to leave. It don't get better than that.
Nahkep Narmelion
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#146 - 2012-11-27 21:50:12 UTC
Quote:
If you have a better alternative to minmatar space you are likely to trade their.


How about mission running. About as boring (imo) and probably makes ok isk and little to no risk. Mining, same thing once you get decent skills and the appropriate barge for your play style/ore you want to mine.

Quote:
If everyone's space has obstacles in getting their the risk will be evenly spread and that problem would not exist.


You know what your problem is, you say these things as if they are 100% certain. However we are dealing with people who will go to great lengths to avoid things they don't like, or find short cuts, or even something else entirely neither you nor I have thought of. Look at my posts, I use words like:

likely,
maybe,
might,
possible.

You use words/phrases like,

will,
absolutely,
totally,
would not exist.

Players have demonstrated time and again that in general they don't like low sec. Low sec is sparsely populated and alot of resources are largely untapped. They just don't want to go there. So, if you are going to come up with a strategy to get more people into low sec, make things happen there, sit down and think about how any idea you come up with can be circumvented up to and including people just going, "Welp, so much for that, and just not doing what you think they should and doing something else entirely."

Quote:
Also the number of low sec systems does not matter as long as you have one path with high sec. It's not like your physically going to clog it.


One path makes ganking much easier. Having a higher concentration of 0.5 and even 0.6 systems makes ganking that much easier. So yes, the overall security level of a region matters. This concept is implicit in your very proposal....low sec is more dangerous. 0.5 is more risk than 1.0. Try to gank in 1.0 and Concord is on pretty damn close to instantly, in 0.5 you'll have a number of seconds, with good skills 5 guys in Tier 3 BCs will gank a freighter.
Nahkep Narmelion
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#147 - 2012-11-27 21:50:42 UTC
Quote:
So their are enough factory slots, ice belts full of new order slaves,moons, asteroid belts, exploration sites, and wormholes for everyone?


Do you know what ceteris paribus means? Your reasoning is fine IF we simply shift the demand curve. Then yes, prices will go down. But that isn't the only thing that happens. Long run supply and demand can change and likely will. So doing a short run analysis assuming just demand changes and nothing else is too simplistic.

In the long run case consider an exogenous increase in demand (suppose there is a patch where mission runners get a boost in income). In this case in the short run, producers will see an increase in prices. This will result in more profits. However, other players will see that increase in profits and enter into manufacturing. This will basically be a shift in the supply function meaning that prices will come back down. Will they come back to the original level? Maybe, maybe not. They could come down but still be above the original level or even below the previous level. Which of these three possibilities obtains depends on the underlying production costs. For example, if the production costs are constant at all levels of production then the price will eventually return to its original level. If it is a decreasing cost then the price will drop below its original level, and if it is an increasing cost it will be above its original level.

Quote:
Like trade? Hell if I use a blockade runner it would be better than the snooze fest of flying a freighter.


Look, you find it boring so what? This is a sandbox and there is plenty to do. Find something else. Other people seem to like doing freighter jobs. Yeah, weird I know not my thing either. But then neither are missions or ratting. Mining bores the hell out of me too. But I have found some ways to make isk and while boring I don't have to grind at it.

And making having a freighter full of (your) loot blown up is almost surely never going to be fun except for the people blowing up said freighter.

Quote:
Yes, I am bad at eve. I don't care for most of its pvp, and pretty much just like to hang with friends and bear it up wherever the whim strikes tonight. Sometimes this means we all just drop into pods and jump 18 gates and buy new ships for the night. Sometimes we decide to max out faction with a corp or agent and hump one station for a month. Who cares? That's our playstyle and its as valid as any other. We should not be forced into the role of your prey solely because you prefer to pvp with people that don't like, and can't defend themselves from, being shot.


Look at what this guy wrote. This is what many hi sec dwellers think, or variants of it. Avoiding ganks in low sec is not their cup of tea. For those who might actually like a fight we aren't going to do it in a freighter (I challenge you to show me an awesome PvP freighter fit). Until somebody shows up in this thread saying, "OMG, I'd so love to play cat and mouse with a gang of low sec pirates in a charon. Bring it!" This idea strikes me as still born.
Nahkep Narmelion
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#148 - 2012-11-27 22:07:07 UTC
Commander Ted wrote:
Mike Voidstar wrote:



Exactly. Those who enjoy the cat and mouse games already have ample opportunity and incentive to join you in lowsec. Forcing others there won't make it fun for them, they will just find something else to do, to the point of leaving the game entirely when all the fun has been sucked from the game due to this sort of change.

Lowsec is similar to the crime depressed areas of large inner cities. Lack of security for business and visitors have created economic wastelands where only those who cause the situation fare well. Everyone else just avoids the area unless they have no choice. The only way to get more targets into lowsec is to stop hunting your prey to extinction.


Sorry but I already do exploration sites in lowsec and its very safe.


Wow...his point appears to have gone right over your head. It isn't that you are willing to go into low sec, but that he'd probably unsub if that was what he had to do to keep playing the game.

Quote:
I just want someone to go for reasons of economic necessity which would be better than the pirate on pirate assgrabbing fest it is.


They might go, but only in a blockade runner and even then only when they deem it worthwhile. Sorry I don't see the big improvement other than you think the guys currently using freighters will find this much more fun (never mind that one can currently make the Dodixie-Jita run in 12 parsecs...wait no I meant through low sec and use a blockade runner) . This option is already in game...and most people simply don't use it. Precluding the high sec option does not mean people are simply going to switch to the low sec option. Some might, but others will bugger off to do other things.
Lord Battlestar
CALIMA COLLABORATIVE
Atrox Urbanis Respublique Abundatia
#149 - 2012-11-27 22:34:54 UTC
works for me, more profit for jump feighters or transports.

I once podded myself by blowing a huge fart.
Commander Ted
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#150 - 2012-11-28 00:22:57 UTC
Nahkep Narmelion wrote:


Do you know what ceteris paribus means? Your reasoning is fine IF we simply shift the demand curve. Then yes, prices will go down. But that isn't the only thing that happens. Long run supply and demand can change and likely will. So doing a short run analysis assuming just demand changes and nothing else is too simplistic.

In the long run case consider an exogenous increase in demand (suppose there is a patch where mission runners get a boost in income). In this case in the short run, producers will see an increase in prices. This will result in more profits. However, other players will see that increase in profits and enter into manufacturing. This will basically be a shift in the supply function meaning that prices will come back down. Will they come back to the original level? Maybe, maybe not. They could come down but still be above the original level or even below the previous level. Which of these three possibilities obtains depends on the underlying production costs. For example, if the production costs are constant at all levels of production then the price will eventually return to its original level. If it is a decreasing cost then the price will drop below its original level, and if it is an increasing cost it will be above its original level.


If imports from other places stop or are reduced the supply in jita will see a sharp drop. So prices increase. Prices being higher in jita than elsewhere makes people choose to move. Their aren't enough belts and moons to supply jita in caldari space alone. In the long run obviously people will be forced to leave. Their are a limited number of places you can harvest from and a limited number of places you can build from, the potential number of factory orders in the caldari state are limited and all of eve can't live in one spot.

Another thing is the null sec alliances that buy in bulk from jita would instead go to the hub that is closest.


Quote:
Look, you find it boring so what? This is a sandbox and there is plenty to do. Find something else. Other people seem to like doing freighter jobs. Yeah, weird I know not my thing either. But then neither are missions or ratting. Mining bores the hell out of me too. But I have found some ways to make isk and while boring I don't have to grind at it.
And making having a freighter full of (your) loot blown up is almost surely never going to be fun except for the people blowing up said freighter.

I have a easy fix to make something not boring, I also am preserving the ability of the people who like boring to do boring. Their are plenty of people without a freighter alt who need a POS moved to a system, people who are moving somewhere else and need to transport things to another hub quickly with a WORMHOLE, quick opportunities to make isk by supplying a mission hub with ammo, moving ships from your industry pos to the local hub, supplying minor hubs like tash-murkon with products to sell, etc. Profits for boring traders would likely increase along with profits for risk taking traders.

If your moving a freighter through a high sec choke point crammed with expensive loot your dumb. If you go solo in lowsec with a freighter, your dumb. If you have a scout and a alt to web your freighter, your not as dumb still kinda dumb though (back to my idea of adding a new freighter class). Having your freighter survive when you make it through a obstacle is gratifying.



Quote:
Yes, I am bad at eve. I don't care for most of its pvp, and pretty much just like to hang with friends and bear it up wherever the whim strikes tonight. Sometimes this means we all just drop into pods and jump 18 gates and buy new ships for the night. Sometimes we decide to max out faction with a corp or agent and hump one station for a month. Who cares? That's our playstyle and its as valid as any other. We should not be forced into the role of your prey solely because you prefer to pvp with people that don't like, and can't defend themselves from, being shot.



Quote:
Look at what this guy wrote. This is what many hi sec dwellers think, or variants of it. Avoiding ganks in low sec is not their cup of tea. For those who might actually like a fight we aren't going to do it in a freighter (I challenge you to show me an awesome PvP freighter fit). Until somebody shows up in this thread saying, "OMG, I'd so love to play cat and mouse with a gang of low sec pirates in a charon. Bring it!" This idea strikes me as still born.

He doesn't fly a freighter and he doesnt have to go into low sec. Thus this change is irrelevant to him.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
Commander Ted
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#151 - 2012-11-28 00:25:30 UTC
Mike Voidstar wrote:
Attacking haulers isn't a "fight that matters". He is all but defenseless, and if he was properly escorted to provide some challenge in a fight would not be engaged.

I don't assume that i am typical, just that most of Eve is carebearish to some degree. The fact that there are fewer people in low and null sec by a few orders of magnitude seem to bear that out.

You asked how I would be affected, I told you. I can't help it if you don't like my reasons or find them pointless and easily circumventable.

The solution is easy. Pay me 10% and give me the ship to haul it in and Ill try to get any cargo you choose past any gate you choose. I will be your victim, or you will lose your high value cargo when I sell it at the local station. There is a fight that matters, as you must stop me and grab the ass of whoever else is around. I will even sob in local for you at the loss. You even get a second shot at my pod when I try to leave. It don't get better than that.

If he is moving his badger alone then he is an idiot.

Everyone carebears to some degree because they have to. If I could make a proper living doing nothing but pvp that is exactly what I would do.

If your reasons are easily circumvented then they are not good reasons. If you have any other reasons against this please post them and I will argue with you.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
Commander Ted
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#152 - 2012-11-28 00:36:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Commander Ted
Nahkep Narmelion wrote:


Wow...his point appears to have gone right over your head. It isn't that you are willing to go into low sec, but that he'd probably unsub if that was what he had to do to keep playing the game.


He doesnt have to go into lowsec. K problem solved.

Quote:
They might go, but only in a blockade runner and even then only when they deem it worthwhile. Sorry I don't see the big improvement other than you think the guys currently using freighters will find this much more fun (never mind that one can currently make the Dodixie-Jita run in 12 parsecs...wait no I meant through low sec and use a blockade runner) . This option is already in game...and most people simply don't use it. Precluding the high sec option does not mean people are simply going to switch to the low sec option. Some might, but others will bugger off to do other things.


Freighter pilots who don't like to risk will use wormholes and make more per trip and less afk.

People who like risk and think it is worth it should have the ability to make more per trip by taking a faster and constantly open route through low sec. Current freighters are to slow to do this, (nimbler less alpha friendly freighter class?). However say a corporation say a opportunistic price gap between a t2 module of some type then it may want to bring a couple iteron v's through low security space with a scout frigate, and a number of ships capable of neutralizing any smaller lighter group of pirates would make the trip. The reason nobody currently uses the jita-dodixie route is because their is one system that you must pass through for the route to be worth it, Rancer, which is currently a inescapable hell camp that those not already briefed die in often. My proposal would not have such a problem because it would have more than one route worth flying.

Then a corporation capable of setting up a safe pos will have the option to constantly move jump freighters back and forth making a safe pos like theirs a desirable target for attack by another low sec entity.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
Commander Ted
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#153 - 2012-11-28 00:47:11 UTC
Nahkep Narmelion wrote:


You know what your problem is, you say these things as if they are 100% certain. However we are dealing with people who will go to great lengths to avoid things they don't like, or find short cuts, or even something else entirely neither you nor I have thought of. Look at my posts, I use words like:

likely,
maybe,
might,
possible.

You use words/phrases like,

will,
absolutely,
totally,
would not exist.[/quote[
commander ted wrote:
If you have a better alternative to minmatar space you are likely to trade their.

Relevant point next time?


Quote:
Also the number of low sec systems does not matter as long as you have one path with high sec. It's not like your physically going to clog it.


[quote]One path makes ganking much easier. Having a higher concentration of 0.5 and even 0.6 systems makes ganking that much easier. So yes, the overall security level of a region matters. This concept is implicit in your very proposal....low sec is more dangerous. 0.5 is more risk than 1.0. Try to gank in 1.0 and Concord is on pretty damn close to instantly, in 0.5 you'll have a number of seconds, with good skills 5 guys in Tier 3 BCs will gank a freighter.

I looked at the map, it is 100% impossible to get from amarr to jita without crossing .5 space. It is also impossible to get from jita to dodixie without crossing .5 space. Hmmmmm so maybe it doesn't matter?

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
Commander Ted
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#154 - 2012-11-28 01:00:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Commander Ted
Was exiting providence in my rupture and in the 4 jumps out in domain empire low I saw a badger, iteron V, and a bestower pass me by. No camps excluding the one at the entrance to null.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
Blastil
Aideron Robotics
Aideron Robotics.
#155 - 2012-11-28 01:00:55 UTC
This would effect zero change on anything, least of all pirate traffic. Most serious trade goes on through jump logistics, and via local harvesting and trading. What rare times it becomes more efficient to sell something in Amarr rather than Jita, those markets are quickly taken over and equalized by Jump logistics. Hell, in the time it took you to travel in your blockade runner from Jita to Amarr, somone has already taken the market you were about to fill, and you're left holding the bag. Making it more dangerous to jump would be a drain on the economy, and cause horrible price gouging in every place more than 4 jumps out from Jita.

What needs to happen is a need for local traffic to open up in lowsec, rather than encouraging high-sec traffic to pass through there.

In a universe of jump logistics and rapid manufacturing, simply changing geography makes almost no difference (unless you're Solitude, then that makes a hell of a difference). Actually speaking of Solitude, if what you're proposing happens, EVE will look like a giant version of Solitude. Having actually lived there for several months, I can assure you, this is NOT what you want. Most every thing there costs 2X what it costs in Jita, and its spread out across 6-8 jumps. Just assembling a t1 cruiser costs double what it costs in Jita, and it takes you an hour to fit. This isn't a recipe to fix eve, its a recipe to kill it.

TL;DR: There are better solutions to promote what you want.
Commander Ted
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#156 - 2012-11-28 01:08:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Commander Ted
Blastil wrote:
This would effect zero change on anything, least of all pirate traffic. Most serious trade goes on through jump logistics, and via local harvesting and trading. What rare times it becomes more efficient to sell something in Amarr rather than Jita, those markets are quickly taken over and equalized by Jump logistics. Hell, in the time it took you to travel in your blockade runner from Jita to Amarr, somone has already taken the market you were about to fill, and you're left holding the bag. Making it more dangerous to jump would be a drain on the economy, and cause horrible price gouging in every place more than 4 jumps out from Jita.

What needs to happen is a need for local traffic to open up in lowsec, rather than encouraging high-sec traffic to pass through there.

In a universe of jump logistics and rapid manufacturing, simply changing geography makes almost no difference (unless you're Solitude, then that makes a hell of a difference). Actually speaking of Solitude, if what you're proposing happens, EVE will look like a giant version of Solitude. Having actually lived there for several months, I can assure you, this is NOT what you want. Most every thing there costs 2X what it costs in Jita, and its spread out across 6-8 jumps. Just assembling a t1 cruiser costs double what it costs in Jita, and it takes you an hour to fit. This isn't a recipe to fix eve, its a recipe to kill it.

TL;DR: There are better solutions to promote what you want.


Fuel costs money, everything in eve is not going to be moved by jump freighter, that is just silly. I can make 20 jumps in my blockade runner before you can even get your jump freighter to lowsec, beating you to any lower volume item. While the jump freighter will be good at higher volume trades it will still loose to blockade runners. Sudden opportunity trades won't be for them, they will likely be preferred because they can keep moving things that are always in demand like ice and ore over and over. People with less isk and resources will then be able to use wormhole freighters. Null sec alliances who move their ships and modules into their space either sell them at a loss of impart costs onto the consumers. Also solitude blows for a number of reasons, mainly because it has no advantage to it over gallente space. Their are no special missions, no special ores, no anything. The other four empires already have people living in them while solitude never had anything.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
Rendiff
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#157 - 2012-11-28 01:42:13 UTC
I support this Idea. Completely separating the enemy factions would give more weight to the lore of the game. Also reduce the amount of control Jita has over the games whole market.

I would suggest keeping high sec links between Amarr-Caldari and Gallente-Minmatar space though. Since they're allies it makes sense that they would be closely connected.
Commander Ted
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#158 - 2012-11-28 01:43:50 UTC
Rendiff wrote:
I support this Idea. Completely separating the enemy factions would give more weight to the lore of the game. Also reduce the amount of control Jita has over the games whole market.

I would suggest keeping high sec links between Amarr-Caldari and Gallente-Minmatar space though. Since they're allies it makes sense that they would be closely connected.

I agree and disagree, I think it would be more fun if they all separated. Also maybe all four sides could be able to shoot each other in FW? I can not think of any lore reasons for it but I would prefer it from a game play point of view.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
Commander Ted
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#159 - 2012-11-28 03:57:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Commander Ted
Lore explanation thought up,
The caldari states new jump gate technology to explore the rest of black rise has caused stargate wormholes to be unstable that are near black rise. This new region is called "Black Void" and has caused the connecting gallente and amarr stargates that are high security space to be severed due to their proximity. The gallente have also lost connection to the minmatar due to this strange event. Black void would be a narrow sparsely filled region filling the void from the serpent's coil to algintal. Many suspect this new jumpgate technology was not discovered by the caldari but purposely given to them by an unknown entity. The Gallente have discovered a new ancient jumpgate network near the myrdian strip, and would be named after the local landmark. The angel cartel and serpentis have began moving in because they feel that their is ancient jovian technology to be had making it very insecure. This region will connect to minmatar and ammatar space with another connection to black void. The ammatar have decided to break all ties with the amarr and destroyed all their stargates in high security space. They wish to ally with the minmatar republic but they are still a sovereign state, at the same time the ammatar have found new gravity wells in divinities edge and began settling their. Divinities edge will be the minmatar's new zone (kinda). Amarr are huge and don't need ****, they just will connect to Black Void and Divinities Edge.

Currently each faction connects to their ally and their historial enemy by high sec while having to cross their allies space in order to get to the enemy of their friends space.

Because I got confused myself writing that here is a simplified form

Divinties edge, black void, and myridian connect to each other so the path would be.
Caldari -> Amarr = Hisec -> Black Void -> hisec
Amarr -> Gallente = Hisec -> Black Void OR Divinity -> Myrdian -> hisec
Amarr -> Minmatar = Hisec -> Divinity -> Hisec
Gallente -> Minmatar = Hisec -> myridian -> hisec
Caldari -> Minmatar = Hisec -> Black Void -> Divinity OR Myrdian -> Hisec

Also Divinities Edge would be difficult to properly place, maybe snuggler underneath ammatar space?


For each race to reach their main enemies area they can still cross the current FW battlegrounds.

All four races can reach the enemy of their friends more quickly by way of the already existing narrow constellations.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
Mike Voidstar
Voidstar Free Flight Foundation
#160 - 2012-11-28 04:27:07 UTC
The point you seem to be missing is that if it was actually fun, someone would already be doing it.

I notice you don't seem keen on giving me a high value target and seeing if I can get it past you to sell at a station of your choice. Put the one sided risk on your back and suddenly it's not such an attractive proposition, and my kill record shows clearly that I absolutely suck at anything resembling PvP. Your cargo would only be at risk if my exploding hull took it with me in the fireball, really.

It's not about the chosen activity. It's about the dynamic of all risk laying with the prey. The pirate does not care about the loss of ship, loss of sec status, loss of time, or anything else that's on the table in this sort of encounter. The bear, in general, cares about all of that, but could care less about being shot down to provide you with a target. Your suggestion is all about getting CCP to provide the pressure on the bear to get them into lowsec where you can shoot at them. It's not about makeing the game more fun for the bears, it's about making it more fun for you at the bear's expense.

Heck, if you want this kind of challenge just put up some buy orders for a maurader or 3 at 1.5 billion ISK and wait for people to try and fill the order for you. You lose if they make it, you win if they don't. If you are a sucessful pirate you will walk away with a few shiny new marauders and a cancelled buy order. Or you will lose your isk. Either way, the risk isn't really one sided at that point, but the hauler won't know that and will still cry for you if you catch him.