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Dinsdale Pirannha

Pirannha Corp

Likes received: 3,519

#101 - 2012-11-15 14:50:43 UTC

Vincent Athena wrote:

Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:

......
3. True, there is no way to profit directly from bounties placed on me, but who knows what mechanisms will be derived by the players. If one thing has been clear over the past iterations of this game, the dev's have little clue how the players will co-opt the dev's vision of the game.

Here is what you do.
Whenever someone with a big bounty and an expansive ship in your fleet is called primary, your fleet tries to get in the kill shot. That way at least you get the bounty on a ship that is going to die in any event.

I'm not convinced this results in your fleet getting more isk than it would get by shooting high bounty ships on the other side.

Is this new bounty mechanic going to drive fleet doctrine to cheaper fits to deny bounty payouts to the other side?

For guys like me, who several cowards have already promised they plan to bounty grief from the game, it will definitely impact my ship choice. A fully fit Mach is around 2 billion, given that a hull is around 1.2 B these days.

I am not sure anymore if the bounty is just for the hull, or includes modules. That part was lost to me in all the spam about this new bounty system. That being said, assuming just the hull, a 240 M payout will cover the costs of 3 Tornado's.
3 Tornado's if the pilots are competent, will get off 2 shots before Concorded, even in 1.0 space.
That will bring down almost any ratting ship, since very few are omni-tanked over 84K.

So yeah, guys like me will definitely be limited in ship choices, assuming we are not stupid and/or rich.
There will be some players with bounties so high on them that they will be griefed out of the game.
A 10 billion ISK bounty means someone has to lose 50 billion in ships to clear that bounty, and sociopaths like the goons throw around 10 billion like tip money, if it means wiping out someone they hate.

Soundwave said he wanted a lot more ships blown up. He is going to get his wish.
Between the bounty system and the new AI, space, mostly high sec space, is going to be riddled with wrecks, at least in the short term. At which point CCP will realize what a disaster they have created when the exodus of subs starts, and then in CCP fashion they will scale back the damage they did.

Ranger 1

Ranger Corp

Vae. Victis.

Likes received: 6,345

#102 - 2012-11-15 14:55:13 UTC | Edited by: Ranger 1

First Main wrote:

Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:

First Main wrote:

Awesome response by CCP Punkturis, i would love to see how many other post feature pilots complaining about features that we must have that are already in the game.

I was never complaining about the bounty indicator on the overview, just making a statement that if it existed people with bounties on them will be primaried. I have never tried to open up my overview to add bounties, nor have I tested the new system on Duality nor Buckingham. ( I have tested the new AI on Duality, and when CCP finally closes the loophole that saves drone users on Dec 4th, watch the rage).

But thanks for your comment.
I could have been hurt by it, if not for the fact that your opinion means nothing to me.

meant in a lighthearted manner, glad no offence was taken. Dreading the new AI/drone changes though

Well, lighthearted in that "proving once again that Dinsdales grasp of basic game mechanics that have been around for years is tenuous at best" sort of way.

By the way Dinsdale the existence of bounties does not now, nor is it ever likely to, affect the calling of primaries in a null sec fleet flight... for a number of reasons.

1: The bounty will be split between all members of the fleet, and in most null sec fleets that means it will be a miniscule amount.

2: An FC has a lot more important things to prioritize in his target calling than whether a bounty is present. Otherwise he does not remain an FC for long.

3: Most null sec bounties are going to be placed on entire corporations or alliances as an incentive, not on individuals.

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.

Dinsdale Pirannha

Pirannha Corp

Likes received: 3,519

#103 - 2012-11-15 15:16:11 UTC

Ranger 1 wrote:

First Main wrote:

Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:

First Main wrote:

Awesome response by CCP Punkturis, i would love to see how many other post feature pilots complaining about features that we must have that are already in the game.

meant in a lighthearted manner, glad no offence was taken. Dreading the new AI/drone changes though

Well, lighthearted in that "proving once again that Dinsdales grasp of basic game mechanics that have been around for years is tenuous at best" sort of way.

By the way Dinsdale the existance of bounties does not now, nor is it ever likely to, affect the calling of primaries in a null sec fleet flight... for a number of reasons.

1: The bounty will be split between all members of the fleet, and in most null sec fleets that means it will be a miniscule amount.

2: An FC has a lot more important things to prioritize in his target calling than whether a bounty is present. Otherwise he does not remain an FC for long.

3: Most null sec bounties are going to be placed on entire corporations or alliances as an incentive, not on individuals.

Spoken like one that assumes all null sec fights are blobs...oh wait, is that what null has devolved to?

Hate to tell you, but I have spent my share of time in null sec. How about you take 10 minutes out of your busy, busy day and look at my kills/losses on Battleclinic?

So yeah, I know my way around a null sec fight. And yes, no competent FC in a large fight cares one whit about bounties, but rather prime tactical targets.

But in a small scale fight, with two targets of equal value, the bountied player will be primary.

Ranger 1

Ranger Corp

Vae. Victis.

Likes received: 6,345

#104 - 2012-11-15 15:44:09 UTC

Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:

Ranger 1 wrote:

First Main wrote:

Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:

First Main wrote:

Awesome response by CCP Punkturis, i would love to see how many other post feature pilots complaining about features that we must have that are already in the game.

meant in a lighthearted manner, glad no offence was taken. Dreading the new AI/drone changes though

Well, lighthearted in that "proving once again that Dinsdales grasp of basic game mechanics that have been around for years is tenuous at best" sort of way.

By the way Dinsdale the existance of bounties does not now, nor is it ever likely to, affect the calling of primaries in a null sec fleet flight... for a number of reasons.

1: The bounty will be split between all members of the fleet, and in most null sec fleets that means it will be a miniscule amount.

2: An FC has a lot more important things to prioritize in his target calling than whether a bounty is present. Otherwise he does not remain an FC for long.

3: Most null sec bounties are going to be placed on entire corporations or alliances as an incentive, not on individuals.

Being a member of a null sec battle on occasion does not mean you have any insight what so ever in how an FC decides who to call primaries.

A typical small roam in null includes at least 10 to 15 ships (usually more). This means that a typical target is going to net a few million isk at best for each fleet member. Hardly a major incentive to prioritize him over other targets.

Even under the current system where the pilot who pods the target would pull in the entire bounty amount this has little to no effect on primary calling. Your suppositions have little or nothing to back them up.

I'm not even going to comment on your insight into the potential perils of blue on blue bounty killings. Big smile

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.

Spurty

Likes received: 1,687

#105 - 2012-11-15 17:55:41 UTC

Vincent Athena wrote:

Spurty wrote:

Will the following scenario will be valid with these changes?

- group roams to mission hub
- waits for bling to undock
- scans out bling in mission while synchronized placement and acceptance of 100k bounty on player
- warp in, scramble, pop ship, take billions in loot (and your 100k ISK back)

If it high sec, its going to be a suicide gank as placing a bounty does not change rights to shoot. That is valid now, and will still be valid with the change.

Confused massively here.

Why would it be a suicide gank?

Isn't the point of the change to make it 'SHIPS' and NOT pods?!?!?!?!?!

How are you supposed to get your 1/5 of 100mill from pod mails?

Er .. doesn't compute

hence question.

There are good ships,

And wood ships,

And ships that sail the sea

But the best ships are Spaceships

Built by CCP

Steve Ronuken

Fuzzwork Enterprises

Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM

Likes received: 6,759

#106 - 2012-11-15 18:23:35 UTC

Spurty wrote:

Vincent Athena wrote:

Spurty wrote:

If it high sec, its going to be a suicide gank as placing a bounty does not change rights to shoot. That is valid now, and will still be valid with the change.

It's a suicide gank, because bounties don't turn off concord.

Woo! CSM XI!

Fuzzwork Enterprises

Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter

Vincent Athena

Photosynth

Likes received: 4,043

#107 - 2012-11-15 18:34:06 UTC

Steve Ronuken wrote:

Spurty wrote:

Vincent Athena wrote:

Spurty wrote:

If it high sec, its going to be a suicide gank as placing a bounty does not change rights to shoot. That is valid now, and will still be valid with the change.

It's a suicide gank, because bounties don't turn off concord.

Correct. Someone with a bounty on them in high sec still gets full concord protection, both while flying a ship or just the pod. To turn off concord you need to declare war. Or: find someone with a buyable killright on them as well as a bounty. Then you buy the killright, kill the target, receive the bounty. Or find them in low sec or null sec.

Also, bounty payouts are based on both ship value plus all destroyed modules and cargo. For pod kills, implant values are used.

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