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Breaking the Blob - Discussion / Ideas

Author
Snot Shot
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1 - 2012-11-07 21:50:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Snot Shot
Going to edit this with the new ideas since it seems a combination of a few could help the Null Sec situation:

1 - Cap the size of an Alliance to 1,000 pilots.

2- Allow access to stations, jump bridges, and POS's by only the controlling Alliance.

3 - Remove standings from the game so only your Alliance or Fleet show as friendly.

4 - Remove "SOV" entirely.............let the sand box flow again as intended. Only thing you need to shoot is the station to take it.



------------------------------------------------- Original Post Below -----------------------------------------------------------------
Has CCP ever looked at removing “Standings” as a way to break things up a bit in null sec?

Just throwing it out there since you need standings to dock in null sec stations, use jump bridges, and not get shot by other Alliances POS’s.

With the above items being owned by one but allowed use by any with standings, if this was restricted making the logistics tougher (living out of individual POS’s, Stations many jumps apart etc) would it slow down the herding we see by many of the null sec coalitions today?

From an overview point they would need to fight as single fleets as the other fleets would show as neutral and create friendly fire situations etc.

Just a thought, didn’t know if this was discussed somewhere before that I missed and what were the down sides to doing this?
.

Twitter = @Snot_Shot  - “If you don't stand for something, you'll fall for anything"

evesnotshot.blogspot.com

Val'Dore
PlanetCorp InterStellar
#2 - 2012-11-07 22:25:45 UTC
I don't think Alliances should be able to set standings amongst each other. To my mind it just furthers the never ending cycle:

Players formed corps that formed unofficial alliances. Alliances are official and now they form unofficial coalitions. If CCP makes Coalitions official, they will come up with something even more ******** to do.

Alliances shouldn't be able to set standings with other alliances or corporations. If you want to be friends and share a treehouse, merge.

Star Jump Drive A new way to traverse the galaxy.

I invented Tiericide

Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#3 - 2012-11-08 00:14:05 UTC
Yeah! No-one should be allowed to have friends in an MMO!


Roll
Joe Risalo
State War Academy
Caldari State
#4 - 2012-11-08 01:48:51 UTC
Danika Princip wrote:
Yeah! No-one should be allowed to have friends in an MMO!


Roll


You can have friends, but in order to make your lifes easier, you'd need to be in the same alliance.


I like this idea because it breaks the stranglehold in null sec.

I mean, how many alliances are teamed up with Goons?

Perhaps they should either be forced to completely merge, or fight it out.


To further this, I also feel that player should not be allowed to fleet together unless they're in the same corp/alliance.

This would also help to break out of corp logistics and bonuses..
Sean Parisi
Blackrise Vanguard
#5 - 2012-11-08 02:24:13 UTC
Standings add the dynamic of "Non-Pew-Pew" game play styles. Such as using diplomacy as a tool between people. It facilitates this, why should they remove a perfectly good system in order to cause chaos and have people slaughter each-other on mass?

I use standings for people who I have flown with, to mark 'dangerous' people and to provide intelligence on a greater scale to the battlefield.

How about building diplomatic relations throughout your own friends, corps and alliances in order to build an army and fight these nullseccers? How about trying to infiltrate their corps and AWOX them, steal from them. There are plenty of ways to bring chaos to null sec that doesn't involve removing a good mechanic.
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#6 - 2012-11-08 02:35:23 UTC
Joe Risalo wrote:
Danika Princip wrote:
Yeah! No-one should be allowed to have friends in an MMO!


Roll


You can have friends, but in order to make your lifes easier, you'd need to be in the same alliance.


I like this idea because it breaks the stranglehold in null sec.

I mean, how many alliances are teamed up with Goons?

Perhaps they should either be forced to completely merge, or fight it out.


To further this, I also feel that player should not be allowed to fleet together unless they're in the same corp/alliance.

This would also help to break out of corp logistics and bonuses..



So, TNT merges into one corp, which joins goonswarm, like WIdot did. So does FCON, FA, SMA and the rest. Why is this considered to be a better idea than the current status quo? This isn't going to break up anything, you'd just make life awkward for a few weeks.

Fighting it out would only end with us smaller guys getting steamrolled, and even less of nullsec actually being populated.
Quesa
Macabre Votum
Northern Coalition.
#7 - 2012-11-08 02:42:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Quesa
Standings aren't the problem.

The horribly thought out Dominion Sov changes and absurdly low amount of ISK made in 0.0 belts/anoms compared to other avenues (save plexes) are why people glob up into massive coalitions.

Essentially, Dominion did the exact opposite of what they said it would do, allow for smaller alliances to hold sov. It actually makes it harder now that it's hilariously easy for a large coalition to hold vast swaths of space due to the asinine timing system all while being able to rent those systems out to generate ISk while milking Tech.

Being a slumlord is the best and easiest way to make ISK in this game and Dominion made it easier for larger coalitions to hold the space so do the math.
GizzyBoy
I N E X T R E M I S
Tactical Narcotics Team
#8 - 2012-11-08 06:14:56 UTC
im quite a fan of aharm and r&k's style, comparatively smaller much harder hitting corps, both offensively and defensively, and most of this is because of wh's, and the much more random way wh's operate, sadly this wont work in in normal space. and so vast coalitions form up.

ultimately the mittani might "accidentally" the alliance, for profit or pleasure
Snot Shot
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2012-11-08 13:20:53 UTC
Quesa wrote:
Standings aren't the problem.

The horribly thought out Dominion Sov changes and absurdly low amount of ISK made in 0.0 belts/anoms compared to other avenues (save plexes) are why people glob up into massive coalitions.

Essentially, Dominion did the exact opposite of what they said it would do, allow for smaller alliances to hold sov. It actually makes it harder now that it's hilariously easy for a large coalition to hold vast swaths of space due to the asinine timing system all while being able to rent those systems out to generate ISk while milking Tech.

Being a slumlord is the best and easiest way to make ISK in this game and Dominion made it easier for larger coalitions to hold the space so do the math.

So cap the size of Alliances, how many stations they can hold in conjunction with removal of standings.

I’m sure CCP didn’t expect so many stations to be dropped in Null Sec at this point or the fact that Out-of-Game Communities would congregate inside EVE to take over large portions of the game play. So they have the right to make drastic adjustments such as this to balance the ability for null sec to blossom again.

Removing standings, cap Alliance sizes, and cap how many stations an Alliance can hold. This would also introduce another layer of diplomacy/politics as you would now have many more “Alliance Leaders” who may not be as eager to be puppets etc.

As for the SOV issue……….why not do away with SOV entirely? Since it’s the “excuse” everyone uses these days for herding together, why not do away with it and bring Null Sec back to being the sandbox it was supposed to be before SOV turned it into a few concrete blocks.

Thoughts?

Twitter = @Snot_Shot  - “If you don't stand for something, you'll fall for anything"

evesnotshot.blogspot.com

Zishy
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#10 - 2012-11-08 13:28:15 UTC
pubbies and their silly ideas.
Val'Dore
PlanetCorp InterStellar
#11 - 2012-11-08 13:54:48 UTC
Add a new corp managment skill:

Faction Control

Each level adds five corp capacity to an alliance. Alliances should have five by default, so max of thirty at lvl V

Star Jump Drive A new way to traverse the galaxy.

I invented Tiericide

Plexas Aideron
Enlightened Industries
Goonswarm Federation
#12 - 2012-11-08 14:13:10 UTC
Snot Shot wrote:
Quesa wrote:
Standings aren't the problem.

The horribly thought out Dominion Sov changes and absurdly low amount of ISK made in 0.0 belts/anoms compared to other avenues (save plexes) are why people glob up into massive coalitions.

Essentially, Dominion did the exact opposite of what they said it would do, allow for smaller alliances to hold sov. It actually makes it harder now that it's hilariously easy for a large coalition to hold vast swaths of space due to the asinine timing system all while being able to rent those systems out to generate ISk while milking Tech.

Being a slumlord is the best and easiest way to make ISK in this game and Dominion made it easier for larger coalitions to hold the space so do the math.

So cap the size of Alliances, how many stations they can hold in conjunction with removal of standings.

I’m sure CCP didn’t expect so many stations to be dropped in Null Sec at this point or the fact that Out-of-Game Communities would congregate inside EVE to take over large portions of the game play. So they have the right to make drastic adjustments such as this to balance the ability for null sec to blossom again.

Removing standings, cap Alliance sizes, and cap how many stations an Alliance can hold. This would also introduce another layer of diplomacy/politics as you would now have many more “Alliance Leaders” who may not be as eager to be puppets etc.

As for the SOV issue……….why not do away with SOV entirely? Since it’s the “excuse” everyone uses these days for herding together, why not do away with it and bring Null Sec back to being the sandbox it was supposed to be before SOV turned it into a few concrete blocks.

Thoughts?



EVE is a sandbox and as such it shouldnt be limited by CCP, either adapt, rise up to the power blocs and do something about them or continue doing what you do and awox ratters for some tears.

on that note, maybe ccp should disable firing on players from the same alliance and/or standings above 5?








yes, its about as absurd.
Blastil
Aideron Robotics
Aideron Robotics.
#13 - 2012-11-08 14:27:08 UTC
this is not going to do what you hope it will do.

large alliances will simply enable the stations to free-dock, or create mega sized alliances. There's practically no real limit on how many people you can have in an alliance, since teh corperate management skill can support more people in one corp, than most alliances have. I was in a corp once which could support over 1000 members.

People keep crying about the big null-sec blocs, but nullsec blocs have a lifespan of maybe MAYBE 4 years. No one thought that BoB would EVER go away, but now new players never hear about BoB now do they? No one remembers NORAD or Pheonix allaince. Why? because nullsec is more volitile than you think it is. At the time those alliances were around, no one thought they'd disappear ever. They're now so obscure, the only people who know and talk about them are the bitter vets.

One day Gooonswarm and CFC will disband too. Please stop looking at them as if they were some kind of immovable object. They're still a pretty young alliance relative to the history of the game. One day there will be an alliance (or a coalition of alliances) that will defeat them.
Snot Shot
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#14 - 2012-11-08 14:39:24 UTC
But removing SOV, standings so only the controlling Alliance can dock, and capping Alliance sizes, would bring Null Sec back to the roots of what it was always supposed to be, a sand box, instead of a handful of concrete blocks which takes years to fall apart because of boredom in most cases.

It would allow for many to step forward and lead capped Alliances instead of falling under the wheels of the existing herds of Null Sec sheep controlled by a handful of people. It would intensify the political and diplomatic scene beyond the control of a few and would rely on many to lead etc.

Then CCP would never have to listen to the excuses players make for why Null Sec is broken again as the players would be jockeying for position every day in the law less space of Null Sec instead of it being the safest place in the game..
.

Twitter = @Snot_Shot  - “If you don't stand for something, you'll fall for anything"

evesnotshot.blogspot.com

Montolio
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#15 - 2012-11-08 14:44:18 UTC
I agree with this, remove standings.

I could use another 15,000 people in my alliance. Plus it'd be amazing for my ego, having my space warriors stretch across the entire map.
Rordan D'Kherr
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#16 - 2012-11-08 14:48:02 UTC
Snot Shot wrote:
Has CCP ever looked at removing “Standings” as a way to break things up a bit in null sec?

Just throwing it out there since you need standings to dock in null sec stations, use jump bridges, and not get shot by other Alliances POS’s.

With the above items being owned by one but allowed use by any with standings, if this was restricted making the logistics tougher (living out of individual POS’s, Stations many jumps apart etc) would it slow down the herding we see by many of the null sec coalitions today?

From an overview point they would need to fight as single fleets as the other fleets would show as neutral and create friendly fire situations etc.

Just a thought, didn’t know if this was discussed somewhere before that I missed and what were the down sides to doing this?
.


For of all I'd like to ask: Why?

Don't be scared, because being afk is not a crime.

Snot Shot
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#17 - 2012-11-08 14:55:54 UTC
Blastil wrote:

People keep crying about the big null-sec blocs, but nullsec blocs have a lifespan of maybe MAYBE 4 years. No one thought that BoB would EVER go away, but now new players never hear about BoB now do they? No one remembers NORAD or Pheonix allaince. Why? because nullsec is more volitile than you think it is. At the time those alliances were around, no one thought they'd disappear ever. They're now so obscure, the only people who know and talk about them are the bitter vets.

One day Gooonswarm and CFC will disband too. Please stop looking at them as if they were some kind of immovable object. They're still a pretty young alliance relative to the history of the game. One day there will be an alliance (or a coalition of alliances) that will defeat them.

BoB, NORAD, and any of the other Alliance which no one thought would die were "In-Game" based groups. As even The Martini himself has mentioned, TEST and Goons are all large "Out-of-Game" based groups who have decided to capitalize on current game mechanics in order to control most of it.

I doubt CCP saw that one coming and with the "Out-of-Game" communities keeping the flow of pilots coming in this is unlikely to "fall apart" any time soon never mind waiting 4 years to see if you're right...
.

Twitter = @Snot_Shot  - “If you don't stand for something, you'll fall for anything"

evesnotshot.blogspot.com

Snot Shot
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#18 - 2012-11-08 15:04:27 UTC
Montolio wrote:
I agree with this, remove standings.

I could use another 15,000 people in my alliance. Plus it'd be amazing for my ego, having my space warriors stretch across the entire map.


I would love to see you do that also! Put a cap on the size Alliances can be and who knows, you could be trying to control 10 different Alliances one day.... Who would you chose to make your Alliance leaders if you could only have 1,000 pilots per Alliance? What space would you give them and what stations would you allow them to have? What would you do with all the left over station that needed an Alliance to control for it to be used? With POS's and Jump Bridges only allowed use for the holding Alliance, would you Titan bridge from safe spots leaving the titan alone each time?
.

Twitter = @Snot_Shot  - “If you don't stand for something, you'll fall for anything"

evesnotshot.blogspot.com

Montolio
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#19 - 2012-11-08 15:06:28 UTC
Snot Shot wrote:
Montolio wrote:
I agree with this, remove standings.

I could use another 15,000 people in my alliance. Plus it'd be amazing for my ego, having my space warriors stretch across the entire map.


I would love to see you do that also! Put a cap on the size Alliances can be and who knows, you could be trying to control 10 different Alliances one day.... Who would you chose to make your Alliance leaders if you could only have 1,000 pilots per Alliance? What space would you give them and what stations would you allow them to have? What would you do with all the left over station that needed an Alliance to control for it to be used? With POS's and Jump Bridges only allowed use for the holding Alliance, would you Titan bridge from safe spots leaving the titan alone each time?
.


I already run three, nbd.
GizzyBoy
I N E X T R E M I S
Tactical Narcotics Team
#20 - 2012-11-09 11:21:20 UTC
Montolio wrote:
Snot Shot wrote:
Montolio wrote:
I agree with this, remove standings.

I could use another 15,000 people in my alliance. Plus it'd be amazing for my ego, having my space warriors stretch across the entire map.


I would love to see you do that also! Put a cap on the size Alliances can be and who knows, you could be trying to control 10 different Alliances one day.... Who would you chose to make your Alliance leaders if you could only have 1,000 pilots per Alliance? What space would you give them and what stations would you allow them to have? What would you do with all the left over station that needed an Alliance to control for it to be used? With POS's and Jump Bridges only allowed use for the holding Alliance, would you Titan bridge from safe spots leaving the titan alone each time?
.


I already run three, nbd.


Wouldn't put it past you to secretly fund and build a 4th one on the quiet just so you had something else to shoot.
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