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Dev Blog: Back to the balancing future!

First post First post
Author
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#861 - 2012-11-13 03:17:35 UTC
Milton Middleson wrote:
Start at page one.

Take a drink every time some illiterate asks what is going to happen to their battlecruisers skill.

Take a shot every time Fozzie repeats himself with regard to how the skill changeover is going to work.

I'm not sure I'd survive that.
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#862 - 2012-11-13 03:23:46 UTC
Grenn Putubi wrote:
By lowering the training time modifier on Battlecruisers you'll be reducing both the amount of free skill points that older players will be getting...

I'm not seeing the focus on the high SP count people would get from this. In all reality why are so many touting the increased clone costs like it's some sort of benefit to older players? No one is getting any extra capabilities out of this so it's just clone bloat pure and simple.
Matalino
#863 - 2012-11-13 04:54:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Matalino
Lheticus Vox wrote:
First off, apologies if these have been asked before but I am NOT looking through 40+ pages of forum thread. I am horrifically confused by the new skill requirements and have a number of questions.
These questions were answered in the first few pages of the discussion, but I will answer them again.


Lheticus Vox wrote:
1. The blog says if I could fly it before, I can after the patch, but it also says that the skill requirements for racial Cruisers are being changed to racial destroyers. I went straight from frigates to cruisers without even injecting the Destroyers skill, so what will happen? Will I really be able to fly the cruisers still?
Flying a cruisers does not and will not require the Frigate/Destroyers skill. (Training the cruiser skill, not flying the ship requires the lower rank skills.) If you can fly the ship now you will be able to fly the ship after the change.

After the change, training a cruiser skill will require you to have the racial destroyers skill. If you already have the cruisers skill, you can continue to use it to fly cruisers regardless of your destroyer skill level. You will not be able to continue training cruisers until you get the racial destoyer skill to level 4.

Lheticus Vox wrote:
2. I recently started training a second race of ships. In terms of cruisers, does this mean I will get racial skills for both racial cruisers I have skills for?

3. Come to think of it, currently battlecruisers have no skill requirement other than Spaceship Command 4, and the dev blog did not mention changing this. Does this mean I will get racial BC skills for ALL races at level 3, which is my current Battlecruisers skill level?
You will get the destroyer skills for each race that you have Frigates 3, and you will get the battlecruisers skill for each race that you have cruiser level 3. The level of the destroyer/battleship skills will depend on your current destroyer/battleship skill. The racial frigate/cruiser skills are simply checked to see if they are at level 3 or higher.

Just train all the cruiser skills to level 3 or better and train Destroyers and Battlecruisers to level 5 and you automatically get the new skills at level 5.
D0main
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#864 - 2012-11-13 09:17:46 UTC
First off, apologies if these have been asked before can you tell me when this changes come and do i have time to do 40 day learning plan?
Drahcir Sirrap
W0LF Acquisitions
#865 - 2012-11-13 09:32:05 UTC
Overall I think that the balancing changes look very promising, and as a Gallente pilot I can't wait for drones to be viable outside of hisec and PvE.

May I also suggest an aesthetic change to the command ship models in order to bring them more in line with other T2 ships like HACs? The demios/ishtar use the thorax/vexor hulls as they are gunship/droneship respectively. Therefor would it not make sense that the Eos would use the Myrmidon hull as opposed to the Brutix? Surely it would be easier (in terms of lore) to imagine that a Myrm was upgraded with the Warfare Links rather than trying to cram a larger dronebay/control.systems and the warfare links onto a Brutix hull? The same concept could also be applied to the Caldari and Amarr CS, although I am unsure how the Minie CS would work with this idea.

Guess I've always figured that the hulls should align with the primary weapons' systems of the craft in question.

Thoughts, criticism and ideas?
Herbitarah
Huge Logistical Network
#866 - 2012-11-13 09:40:52 UTC
If someone is training the bc skill to level 5, but is not quite there on launch day, then what happens? Do they get all 4 racial bc skills at the same SP level as the original bc skill, or do you get them all at level 4 and lose SP?
Harvey James
The Sengoku Legacy
#867 - 2012-11-13 09:44:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Harvey James
Harvey James wrote:
Sgt Napalm wrote:
Marlona Sky wrote:
[quote=Sgt Napalm]
No. I like the ability to fit gang links on T1 battle cruisers. Gang bonus should not be privy to the rich while the younger and not as wealthy players are shut out of options.


I agree. I've parked my CS hulls many months ago in favor of gang fit BC's. Oh the flip side I do find it removes some of the uniqueness around the CS hull. It is a tough sell to fly a CS when a proper (currently) fit leadership BC covers 80%+ of the gang link role.


Perhaps the CS should have the 5% bonus to links and they could reduce some of the bonus out of the skills like 100% per lv after lv2 on skirmish link skill etc.
So more the bonus comes from the CS which would also increase their effectiveness over T3 hulls.

So many skills do look a little outdated and need to be looked at including some of the missile skills and leadership skills.


mm.. after further thinking perhaps a ship bonusing only 15% for what is meant to be its specialist role is still a bit low as you could still use a T1 bc to do much of the same thing for a lot cheaper i think if you want to make these the go to ship for links for a major strength bonus over a little more versatility.. T3..
perhaps a 15% a lv might the the right area.... T3 8%and just redo the link skills as they are a little complicated really to understand perhaps a simpler system of adds 1 points to link strength per lv. the link gives 5points and then the ship bonus adds its bonus to find the overall strength then convert that to a %.
I forgot about the other skill that adds 10% a lv aswell

Also the skirmish link boosting the range of webs/scramblers/disruptors is 3.75 instead of 2.5 which ends up at 37.5% on a loki atm ... shockingly high. and even 32.5% on claymore please change this to 2.5% like the rest its far too easy to get 100km out of a rapier.
Although i think 60% a lv bonus is far too high anyway with the prevalence of faction webs being value for money.

T3's need to be versatile so no rigs are necessary ... they should not have OP dps and tank

ABC's should be T2, remove drone assist, separate HAM's and Torps range, -3 HS for droneboats

Nerf web strength, Make the blaster Eagle worth using

Maximus Andendare
Stimulus
Rote Kapelle
#868 - 2012-11-13 10:07:20 UTC
Herbitarah wrote:
If someone is training the bc skill to level 5, but is not quite there on launch day, then what happens? Do they get all 4 racial bc skills at the same SP level as the original bc skill, or do you get them all at level 4 and lose SP?

Fozzie has stated it's only the whole number levels that you get. So you'd need to have it at V to receive any skills past IV.

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Aesil Maril
Destructive Brothers
#869 - 2012-11-13 14:39:40 UTC
Since I'm in the process of training for a carrier, I would appreciate an answer with regards to when the new capital skill rebalance (lvl4 BS skill for racial capital ship) is going o take place. With Retribution on 4th of december? In the next summer expansion? At the end of next year? It would be really nice to know also which will be the new prerequisites for racial capital skills, if they've been decided of course.
Roldanis
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#870 - 2012-11-13 18:14:47 UTC
Not sure if this has already been posted here but.... Please please PLEASE give the Rokh an extra 25m of drone bay space. It is the only BS that has a 50m drone bay. I don' tneed extra bandwidth, I just want to be able to carry more than just one flight of mediums or two flights of smalls.
Ristlin Wakefield
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#871 - 2012-11-13 18:22:29 UTC
As long as they don't make beautiful Legion useless I'll be happy.

I have a lover, her name is EVE. I see her every night and all she asks in return is that I have a pilot's license.

Harvey James
The Sengoku Legacy
#872 - 2012-11-13 18:46:56 UTC
Ristlin Wakefield wrote:
As long as they don't make beautiful Legion useless I'll be happy.


it can't get much worse than now Evil

T3's need to be versatile so no rigs are necessary ... they should not have OP dps and tank

ABC's should be T2, remove drone assist, separate HAM's and Torps range, -3 HS for droneboats

Nerf web strength, Make the blaster Eagle worth using

Nemesis Bosseret
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#873 - 2012-11-13 18:47:07 UTC
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
Milton Middleson wrote:
Start at page one.

Take a drink every time some illiterate asks what is going to happen to their battlecruisers skill.

Take a shot every time Fozzie repeats himself with regard to how the skill changeover is going to work.

I'm not sure I'd survive that.


Im irish and i might, but my horrible grammer and spelling would be even worse than it already is. Personally i dont give two S$%$s about the skill change over considering in a few days ill be able to fly every sub cap in the game, but i can hear the mice squeaking about this slight difficulty ... but whatever ill hear the $$$$$ and complaints in corp chat and the tears pouring from new players but again not too concerned, Newer players should learn how to fly one race well first anyways before even thinking of going multi racial and this skill change reinforces this idea which makes my life so much easier because i wont have to explain to noobs why u dont fit hybrids to laser boat, or lasers to a projectile boat (freak fits excluded from this odviously cuz some work very well but way too advanced for newer players) so thank god and thank you CCP for that... but again ill add this revamp rebalance stuff.... there going way to overboard on. Tech 3 crusers, sure nerf there ability to give fleet boosts so command ships actually have purpose, is the drake over tanked... yes i think it should be a tough SOB but maybe not as much as it currently is, Noobs should not be able to run lvl 4s 3 months after they start the game in a battlecruser... thats just not right. Prophacy as drone boat.... some one should really go look in a mirror and smack the crap outta themself for even thinking about putting that on paper when they are going to re do the AI in missions so they are like sleepers and drones are usless and making the one good mission ship battlecruser for amarr completely friken useless.... Myrm.. whatever.. hurricane.. meh whatever id say dont touch it but id be asking too much because someone will complain cuz they fly amarr and getting double neuted is sooooo unfair... .(fyi i fly amarr) all the other stuff... whatever.. i cant B$$$$ and rant all day cuz ill pass out at the key board again and lose something shinny again to belt rats Lastly 17 slots WTF... CCP again.... NO TOUCHY NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HORRIFIC IDEA! DONT GO SCREWING WITH WHATS NOT BROKEN...... Ok going to go pass out in a ditch now for a few days and maybe ill check the status of the random continues rants about repeats of the begining of this post..... Nite all
wolftin21
#874 - 2012-11-13 18:51:08 UTC
Tbh, I think skipping t2 battle ships to get into capitals is a little lame. I believe that getting into a t2 bs its better for thos that dont want get into capitals but, want into t2 bs. Or make it to where needing lvl 4 racial bs to get into a racial t2 bs with a little extra skills set for t2 bs's.

P.S

BUFF UP BLACK OPS!!!

that is all.
Loki Vice
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#875 - 2012-11-13 19:33:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Loki Vice
Love the changes, and i would LOVE THE HELL out of the dominix if it wasn't a flying space potato =(
Ristlin Wakefield
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#876 - 2012-11-13 20:04:24 UTC
Loki Vice wrote:
Love the changes, and i would LOVE THE HELL out of the dominix if it was a flying space potato =(


You mean if it wasn't? Lol

I have a lover, her name is EVE. I see her every night and all she asks in return is that I have a pilot's license.

Ubiquitous Presence
Blazing Eye of Hate
#877 - 2012-11-14 00:10:55 UTC
Now that we are getting racial BC's and Destroyers does this mean we will eventually get factional versions of these ships?
DeltaWav
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#878 - 2012-11-14 00:45:25 UTC
Aesil Maril wrote:
Since I'm in the process of training for a carrier, I would appreciate an answer with regards to when the new capital skill rebalance (lvl4 BS skill for racial capital ship) is going o take place. With Retribution on 4th of december? In the next summer expansion? At the end of next year? It would be really nice to know also which will be the new prerequisites for racial capital skills, if they've been decided of course.


The only for sure thing is that it will not be December 4.

Quote:
"Want to make this clear to everyone, the stuff in this blog is not coming on the 4th with Retribution. This blog covers some of what we are going to be working on in the beginning of next year."
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#879 - 2012-11-14 01:01:54 UTC
Quote:
the Talos keeps a kiting advantage


Are we really ok with the current state of tracking enhancers and T2 ammo?
Harvey James
The Sengoku Legacy
#880 - 2012-11-14 01:35:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Harvey James
TrouserDeagle wrote:
Quote:
the Talos keeps a kiting advantage


Are we really ok with the current state of tracking enhancers and T2 ammo?


TE's are too good particularly to the benefit of minmatar. but also they are better than TC's in a less valuable slot.
on T2 ammo well they all have the same bonus and i think its down to the guns rather than the ammo.
in particular lasers are OP for range when scorch is put in the omen is the only attack cruiser that isn't bonused for range or tracking guess why..... its odd because it allows the harbinger to have the same range and tracking which won't be the case for the rest of the attack cruisers.
I think blasters should have a higher base falloff and missiles are certainly OP for range and this is before TE/TC's will improve their range further.

T3's need to be versatile so no rigs are necessary ... they should not have OP dps and tank

ABC's should be T2, remove drone assist, separate HAM's and Torps range, -3 HS for droneboats

Nerf web strength, Make the blaster Eagle worth using