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Miners Unite to Fight the New Order!

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Anslo
Scope Works
#521 - 2012-10-30 16:45:12 UTC
Andski wrote:
yeah I remember that scene in 300 where King Leonidas whined to the devs about the Persians unfairly extorting him and griefing him

Nice twist. But really, Leonidas was free to kick the Persian's arse without getting Concordokkened, with all of them in the same corp, same place, and ready to go. We need to give miners the same 'kick' ability Blink (THIS IS VELDSPAR!)

TheGunslinger42 wrote:
Except you're not really resisting the Order, you're just begging CCP to introduce mechanics that would artificially protect you. If you actually resist, without whining to mommy and daddy devs to simply fix it for you, that'd be admirable. However you would still lose, as the New Order is invincible.


I don't really see my discussing the issue as "begging," but I suppose everyone has a definition. And you even said it yourself, your extortionists are "invincible," so why should that not be addressed in game mechanics?

baltec1 wrote:
Yet when they try this on my battleship they miss...

The reason why it is so effective on miners is because of the same reason ganking them was so easy. They take zero steps to protect themselves.

Dude, the mass of a battleship/carrier is not the same situation as a mining barge. Save for the skiff idea, try orbiting a roid in another barge/exhumer, and mine. Then try to get yourself bumped and see if the orbit mechanic fully works as you say. I tried. It didn't. Same with the web idea, just bump the webber out of range.

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
Kainotomiu Ronuken
koahisquad
#522 - 2012-10-30 16:45:51 UTC
Andski wrote:
yeah I remember that scene in 300 where King Leonidas whined to the devs about the Persians unfairly extorting him and griefing him

Hey stop it. It's good that miners have a positive self image, and you're actively ruining that.
Kainotomiu Ronuken
koahisquad
#523 - 2012-10-30 16:47:33 UTC
Anslo wrote:
Andski wrote:
yeah I remember that scene in 300 where King Leonidas whined to the devs about the Persians unfairly extorting him and griefing him

Nice twist. But really, Leonidas was free to kick the Persian's arse without getting Concordokkened, with all of them in the same corp, same place, and ready to go. We need to give miners the same 'kick' ability Blink (THIS IS VELDSPAR!)

I don't know if you remember, but the Spartans at Thermopylae actually all died. That seems pretty similar to CONCORD to me.
TheGunslinger42
All Web Investigations
#524 - 2012-10-30 16:48:48 UTC
Anslo wrote:
Nice twist. But really, Leonidas was free to kick the Persian's arse without getting Concordokkened, with all of them in the same corp, same place, and ready to go. We need to give miners the same 'kick' ability Blink (THIS IS VELDSPAR!)


So again this is a case of "there is yet another mechanic that lets me counter them, but I don't want to deal with the consequences or effort of that mechanic, a bloo bloo"
Anslo
Scope Works
#525 - 2012-10-30 16:49:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Anslo
Kainotomiu Ronuken wrote:
I don't know if you remember, but the Spartans at Thermopylae actually all died. That seems pretty similar to CONCORD to me.


Yet they came back and continued to dominate afterwards.

Quote:
So again this is a case of "there is yet another mechanic that lets me counter them, but I don't want to deal with the consequences or effort of that mechanic, a bloo bloo"


No, I'm pointing out that, as you said you are so "invincible," then there should be an anchoring mechanic to balance out your invincibility that has balanced draw backs. Smile

Riot Girl wrote:
Anslo wrote:
We need to give miners the same 'kick' ability Blink (THIS IS VELDSPAR!)

And suddenly war decs were invented.

If all the bumpers were in one corp, then yes, this really wouldn't be an issue worth of a thread of the miners tears.

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
#526 - 2012-10-30 16:49:05 UTC
Anslo wrote:
We need to give miners the same 'kick' ability Blink (THIS IS VELDSPAR!)

And suddenly war decs were invented.

Oh god.
TheGunslinger42
All Web Investigations
#527 - 2012-10-30 16:50:40 UTC
Anslo wrote:
Kainotomiu Ronuken wrote:
Anslo wrote:
Andski wrote:
yeah I remember that scene in 300 where King Leonidas whined to the devs about the Persians unfairly extorting him and griefing him

Nice twist. But really, Leonidas was free to kick the Persian's arse without getting Concordokkened, with all of them in the same corp, same place, and ready to go. We need to give miners the same 'kick' ability Blink (THIS IS VELDSPAR!)

I don't know if you remember, but the Spartans at Thermopylae actually all died. That seems pretty similar to CONCORD to me.


Yet they came back and continued to dominate afterwards.


Unfortunately, no, the spartans did not come back from the dead. Funnily enough though, that does happen in EVE

So um what was your point again
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#528 - 2012-10-30 16:51:26 UTC
Anslo wrote:

Dude, the mass of a battleship/carrier is not the same situation as a mining barge. Save for the skiff idea, try orbiting a roid in another barge/exhumer, and mine. Then try to get yourself bumped and see if the orbit mechanic fully works as you say. I tried. It didn't. Same with the web idea, just bump the webber out of range.


When the bumping ship is a nano phoon mass means very little. Mass also means squat if they miss you.

As for the webber. Use a frigate and have it orbit the barge?
Anslo
Scope Works
#529 - 2012-10-30 16:51:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Anslo
TheGunslinger42 wrote:
Unfortunately, no, the spartans did not come back from the dead. Funnily enough though, that does happen in EVE. So um what was your point again

If you read history, you'd know that the term Spartan does not only apply to the 300 who died. There were a few more laying about.

baltec1 wrote:

When the bumping ship is a nano phoon mass means very little. Mass also means squat if they miss you.

As for the webber. Use a frigate and have it orbit the barge?

I thought about that and figured it might be an unbeatable method outside of some kind of gank. I need to test it though to be sure, but that could at least be one decent counter. I'll get back to you though!

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
Yuri Wayfare
Suddenly Ninjas
Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
#530 - 2012-10-30 16:54:14 UTC
Anslo wrote:
To me it's not about the money, it's the action. I don't like the idea of people kotowing to extortionists. 300 comes to mind, when Xerxes demanded a jar of water and dirt from the Spartans. It cost really nothing, but the action and symbolism behind it was down right insulting to the Spartans.


Of course, the Spartans then went on to slaughter Xerxes' army in fantastically stylized slo-mo fashion while wearing capes and speedos. You don't need to let yourself be extorted when you're a bloodthirsty madman in a cape and a speedo.

Here's some possible actions you sorry lot might take to oppose the New Order:

Action: Roll up suicide gank alts and blow up the Agents of the New Order.
Cost: Time, ISK, effort.

Action: Hire suicide gankers to blow up the Agents of the New Order.
Cost: ISK.

Action: Train fpr PVP, ship up and wardec the New Order's corps.
Cost: Time, ISK, effort.

Action: Hire mercenaries to wardec the New Order's corps.
Cost: ISK.

Action: Mine in pairs of plated battleships webbing each other.
Cost: Yield, effort.

Action: Pay the 10mil mining fee.
Cost: Your pride and 10mil ISK.

Action: Whine to CCP and ask for a special mod to help you.
Cost: Getting laughed at by all the rest of EVE, developer time that could be spent fixing real problems, introducing a hilariously exploitable new mod to EVE, the New Order declaring a shift of focus to blockading Jita 4-4 with a wall of anchored mining barges and demanding a 10mil ISK fee from any freighter pilot wishing to pass through.

Nothing comes for free.

"Suddenly, trash pickers! HUNDREDS of winos going through your recyclables." -Piugattuk

Be careful what you wish for.
Anslo
Scope Works
#531 - 2012-10-30 16:57:12 UTC
Yuri Wayfare wrote:

Action: Whine to CCP and ask for a special mod to help you.
Cost: Getting laughed at by all the rest of EVE, developer time that could be spent fixing real problems, introducing a hilariously exploitable new mod to EVE, the New Order declaring a shift of focus to blockading Jita 4-4 with a wall of anchored mining barges and demanding a 10mil ISK fee from any freighter pilot wishing to pass through.

Nothing comes for free.


Oh god I lol'd.

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
Kainotomiu Ronuken
koahisquad
#532 - 2012-10-30 17:01:10 UTC
Anslo wrote:
Kainotomiu Ronuken wrote:
I don't know if you remember, but the Spartans at Thermopylae actually all died. That seems pretty similar to CONCORD to me.


Yet they came back and continued to dominate afterwards.

This is the equivalent of the miner coming back in his PVP ship.
Anslo
Scope Works
#533 - 2012-10-30 17:05:45 UTC
Kainotomiu Ronuken wrote:
Anslo wrote:
Kainotomiu Ronuken wrote:
I don't know if you remember, but the Spartans at Thermopylae actually all died. That seems pretty similar to CONCORD to me.


Yet they came back and continued to dominate afterwards.

This is the equivalent of the miner coming back in his PVP ship.


Yet the miner can't since one miner war deccing 10+ corps is...not exactly feasible on anyone's budget. Also, please don't use the "oh the miners should unite" reasoning. When was the last time high sec gankers united over anything? Hell when has anyone in Eve ever "united" when they aren't in the same corp or alliance? Should the miners all join one corp or alliance then? Would make deccing them all the much easier wouldn't it?

As you can see, the miners are continually shafted.

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
Kainotomiu Ronuken
koahisquad
#534 - 2012-10-30 17:07:55 UTC
Anslo wrote:
[quote=Kainotomiu Ronuken]
Yet the miner can't since one miner war deccing 10+ corps is...not exactly feasible on anyone's budget. Also, please don't use the "oh the miners should unite" reasoning. When was the last time high sec gankers united over anything? Hell when has anyone in Eve ever "united" when they aren't in the same corp or alliance? Should the miners all join one corp or alliance then? Would make deccing them all the much easier wouldn't it?

As you can see, the miners are continually shafted.

Woah. Who said anything about wardecs? There's nothing stopping you from exacting revenge on your tormentor, you just have to pay the CONCORD fee for it.
Anslo
Scope Works
#535 - 2012-10-30 17:08:54 UTC
Kainotomiu Ronuken wrote:
Woah. Who said anything about wardecs? There's nothing stopping you from exacting revenge on your tormentor, you just have to pay the CONCORD fee for it.


...right...
...as I said, shafted.

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
Alpheias
Tactical Farmers.
Pandemic Horde
#536 - 2012-10-30 17:10:52 UTC
Anslo wrote:
Kainotomiu Ronuken wrote:
Woah. Who said anything about wardecs? There's nothing stopping you from exacting revenge on your tormentor, you just have to pay the CONCORD fee for it.


...right...
...as I said, shafted.


So? Mining is essentially free isk, you get more the longer you mine.

Agent of Chaos, Sower of Discord.

Don't talk to me unless you are IQ verified and certified with three references from non-family members. Please have your certificate of authenticity on hand.
Ghazu
#537 - 2012-10-30 17:10:55 UTC
Anslo wrote:
Kainotomiu Ronuken wrote:
Anslo wrote:
Kainotomiu Ronuken wrote:
I don't know if you remember, but the Spartans at Thermopylae actually all died. That seems pretty similar to CONCORD to me.


Yet they came back and continued to dominate afterwards.

This is the equivalent of the miner coming back in his PVP ship.


Yet the miner can't since one miner war deccing 10+ corps is...not exactly feasible on anyone's budget. Also, please don't use the "oh the miners should unite" reasoning. When was the last time high sec gankers united over anything? Hell when has anyone in Eve ever "united" when they aren't in the same corp or alliance? Should the miners all join one corp or alliance then? Would make deccing them all the much easier wouldn't it?

As you can see, the miners are continually shafted.

Hulkageddon and then the perma-hulkageddon were pretty united. All I see here is gankers want something for nothing, again.

http://www.minerbumping.com/ lol what the christ https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2299984#post2299984
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#538 - 2012-10-30 17:11:30 UTC
Yuri Wayfare wrote:

Action: Whine to CCP and ask for a special mod to help you.
Cost: Getting laughed at by all the rest of EVE, developer time that could be spent fixing real problems, introducing a hilariously exploitable new mod to EVE, the New Order declaring a shift of focus to blockading Jita 4-4 with a wall of anchored mining barges and demanding a 10mil ISK fee from any freighter pilot wishing to pass through.

Nothing comes for free.


You are a deviant mastermind, do you have a white cat and a volcano lair?

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#539 - 2012-10-30 17:12:47 UTC
Anslo wrote:
When was the last time high sec gankers united over anything?


Two ice interdictions, many hulkageddons, burn jita, summer of rage ect.
Anslo
Scope Works
#540 - 2012-10-30 17:14:38 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Anslo wrote:
When was the last time high sec gankers united over anything?


Two ice interdictions, many hulkageddons, burn jita, summer of rage ect.


Which were all aggressor type events. When was the last time they united to defend themselves against something (that didn't have to do with monocolgate. That wasn't just gankers, that was everyone, miners included).

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]