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Warfare & Tactics

 
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Faction Warfare - Same As It Ever Was

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Juan Rayo
Justified Chaos
#221 - 2012-11-04 16:10:43 UTC
chatgris wrote:
You know, while you sit there and complain about the current state of fw (which is the best it's ever been) and alleged gallente/minmatar bias, other Caldari like Happy Endings are taking system after system. The amarr are much stronger now than they ever were pre-inferno.

The only thing I think you are sore about is you've lost the farming army and ability to offensively capture any size plex with a noob alt in a frigate.


I expect the warzone will stabilize in t3 for all after a while, and honestly the squids will have Happy Endings and a few others to thank for that. Maybe that´s why the bitter vets are mad?
Bad Messenger
Rehabilitation Clinic
#222 - 2012-11-04 17:23:51 UTC
Juan Rayo wrote:
chatgris wrote:
You know, while you sit there and complain about the current state of fw (which is the best it's ever been) and alleged gallente/minmatar bias, other Caldari like Happy Endings are taking system after system. The amarr are much stronger now than they ever were pre-inferno.

The only thing I think you are sore about is you've lost the farming army and ability to offensively capture any size plex with a noob alt in a frigate.


I expect the warzone will stabilize in t3 for all after a while, and honestly the squids will have Happy Endings and a few others to thank for that. Maybe that´s why the bitter vets are mad?


No one is mad about current situation really, we already adapted, but personally i did not like time frame how ccp implemented changes because it clearly favored some sides and **** up those who had long term plans. After all change was good because if caldari would had all systems when nerf came, FW would be totally over, now systems are pretty much even.

Changes to nerf LP store was needed, but sad thing is that FW is same than it was before inferno, only with boosted LP gain for mission runners.
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#223 - 2012-11-04 21:00:53 UTC
X Gallentius wrote:
Cearain wrote:
Unlimited ships pre inferno? Are you refering to the rookie ships you get when you enter a station in a pod?
What part about 90-105k LP/hour at 3k isk/lp profit for about 250 million isk/hour don't you understand? Just asking.




Omens at 65 mill for 45k lp. Slicers at 17 mill for 10k lp. Pretty much every other worthwhile fw item in the store is accessible by out enemy that makes 2.5xs as much isk. (whcih assumes we can even access agents which for many of our main ones we cant)

But whatever if you think we can make 90-105k lp per hour and 3k isk/lp the minmatar militia will be making over 600 mill isk per hour. If you have to carebear would you rather make 250 mill per hour or 600 mill?

You just sort of dropped my main point that there isn't just some magical number of "plenty" of isk to fight a war. How much you need is dependant on who you are fighting and the numbers and resources they have.

But anyway,keep thinking people will choose less money instead of more money. You are just obviously ignoring the problems with your irrational views.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#224 - 2012-11-04 21:11:19 UTC
Abyssum Invocat wrote:
Cearain wrote:
Dan Carter Murray wrote:
Vordak Kallager wrote:
major hurdle for the Amarr-- they don't give a **** about the system and refuse to partake; however, they still feel entitled to complain about how unfair this system they are not interested in using is.

Interesting.


it's a few ******* people. not all of ******* amarr.



Well I admit I am not going to participate in a system where for every plex I take I get X isk and allow them to take it back for 2xX isk.

I can do the math in my head. I don't need to actually give the enemy the isk before I realize it's not a smart strategy. IMO Its better to let them just take all the systems and stop the bleeding.

You keep repeating the same argument here. You refuse to defend your space because it indirectly aids your enemy. If you do not want to participate in FW, right click your name and quit corporation. If you truly give a solitary **** about this, then log on, grind your isk whichever way you ******* want and go pvp. You are accomplishing nothing with this stubborn conscientious objector mentality. If you really gave a modicum of **** you would use half the time you spend on the forums instead fighting for your space and have perpetual tier 5.

I'm sorry, but there is dissenting and then there is whining. This thread is a tome of excuses as to why you refuse to help your side and yourself, for the pettiest and most ridiculous reasons.



Heads I pay you $250 tails you pay me $100. Thats not far from the game amarr are playing. No thanks. I have a hunch many minmatar are laughing at them. There are certainly enough posts from minmatar cheering the amarr on to keep playing.

The war zone is holding steady because the minmatar farmers were hamstrung by changes requiring all rats to be killed - and yes we should all be very thankful to Hans for that because that was something he successfully pushed with ccp. The minmatar really seemed to believe that there success wasn't based on the alt farmers and are now finding it was.



Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
Of Essence
#225 - 2012-11-04 22:15:09 UTC
Cearain wrote:
But whatever if you think we can make 90-105k lp per hour and 3k isk/lp the minmatar militia will be making over 600 mill isk per hour. If you have to carebear would you rather make 250 mill per hour or 600 mill?


But at this point, it doesn't matter. The minmatar militia is winning - great they get more money.

The amarr still get a fantastic amount of money that can be made while pvping, unlike pre-inferno where the ISK multiplier made it very difficult for the losing side.
kraiklyn Asatru
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#226 - 2012-11-04 22:23:29 UTC  |  Edited by: kraiklyn Asatru
[rant]

Cearain has a weird sense of entitlement. He wants ISK, he wants it for free. He doesnt want to do all those things the minmatar do to gain that isk. He doesnt want to defend or have to run plexes. We have spend a lot of LP upgrading, night and nights plexing and defending, running after your isk farmers. What do you do? You make an alt and farm yourself, then you start complaining about minmatar plexing. If you remove all your damn alts ww would be losing a lot of numbers haha. Or are you forgetting about your alt corp Tribal Outlaws??? You know the corp whos POSes you use to hide your Amarr main PVP ships in.

Suck it up, stop being a whiny baby. Grow a bloody spine and take responsibility. Be a ******* MAN for a change.

[/rant]
Abyssum Invocat
Yet Another Tax Haven
#227 - 2012-11-04 22:54:09 UTC
Cearain wrote:
Abyssum Invocat wrote:
Cearain wrote:
Dan Carter Murray wrote:
Vordak Kallager wrote:
major hurdle for the Amarr-- they don't give a **** about the system and refuse to partake; however, they still feel entitled to complain about how unfair this system they are not interested in using is.

Interesting.


it's a few ******* people. not all of ******* amarr.



Well I admit I am not going to participate in a system where for every plex I take I get X isk and allow them to take it back for 2xX isk.

I can do the math in my head. I don't need to actually give the enemy the isk before I realize it's not a smart strategy. IMO Its better to let them just take all the systems and stop the bleeding.

You keep repeating the same argument here. You refuse to defend your space because it indirectly aids your enemy. If you do not want to participate in FW, right click your name and quit corporation. If you truly give a solitary **** about this, then log on, grind your isk whichever way you ******* want and go pvp. You are accomplishing nothing with this stubborn conscientious objector mentality. If you really gave a modicum of **** you would use half the time you spend on the forums instead fighting for your space and have perpetual tier 5.

I'm sorry, but there is dissenting and then there is whining. This thread is a tome of excuses as to why you refuse to help your side and yourself, for the pettiest and most ridiculous reasons.



Heads I pay you $250 tails you pay me $100. Thats not far from the game amarr are playing. No thanks. I have a hunch many minmatar are laughing at them. There are certainly enough posts from minmatar cheering the amarr on to keep playing.

The war zone is holding steady because the minmatar farmers were hamstrung by changes requiring all rats to be killed - and yes we should all be very thankful to Hans for that because that was something he successfully pushed with ccp. The minmatar really seemed to believe that there success wasn't based on the alt farmers and are now finding it was.




That is a gross over-simplification which portrays the only point of FW participation as isk.
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#228 - 2012-11-04 23:25:21 UTC
Dan Carter Murray wrote:
X Gallentius wrote:
Quote:
First of all, you cannot offensively plex a minor in 10 minutes. More like 20 minutes now.
Aside from all the BS you've posted so far, why does it take you 20 minutes to cap a minor when it takes everybody else 12 minutes? What are you doing that is so fail?


I JUST TIMED ONE I DID IT IN 11. BOOYAH X GAL.

But you aren't accounting for warping to the next system and running the next one. That take EIGHTEEN MINUTES!!!! - according to one poster here.
Poetic Stanziel
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#229 - 2012-11-04 23:31:37 UTC
X Gallentius wrote:
Dan Carter Murray wrote:
X Gallentius wrote:
Quote:
First of all, you cannot offensively plex a minor in 10 minutes. More like 20 minutes now.
Aside from all the BS you've posted so far, why does it take you 20 minutes to cap a minor when it takes everybody else 12 minutes? What are you doing that is so fail?


I JUST TIMED ONE I DID IT IN 11. BOOYAH X GAL.

But you aren't accounting for warping to the next system and running the next one. That take EIGHTEEN MINUTES!!!! - according to one poster here.
You can't knock down twenty rats in sixty seconds. Not solo.
Corporate Management
Apocalypse Reign
#230 - 2012-11-04 23:57:07 UTC
chatgris wrote:
Cearain wrote:
But whatever if you think we can make 90-105k lp per hour and 3k isk/lp the minmatar militia will be making over 600 mill isk per hour. If you have to carebear would you rather make 250 mill per hour or 600 mill?


But at this point, it doesn't matter. The minmatar militia is winning - great they get more money.

The amarr still get a fantastic amount of money that can be made while pvping, unlike pre-inferno where the ISK multiplier made it very difficult for the losing side.


There was an ISK multiplier pre-inferno?
Corporate Management
Apocalypse Reign
#231 - 2012-11-05 00:05:51 UTC
kraiklyn Asatru wrote:
[rant]

Cearain has a weird sense of entitlement. He wants ISK, he wants it for free. He doesnt want to do all those things the minmatar do to gain that isk. He doesnt want to defend or have to run plexes. We have spend a lot of LP upgrading, night and nights plexing and defending, running after your isk farmers. What do you do? You make an alt and farm yourself, then you start complaining about minmatar plexing. If you remove all your damn alts ww would be losing a lot of numbers haha. Or are you forgetting about your alt corp Tribal Outlaws??? You know the corp whos POSes you use to hide your Amarr main PVP ships in.

Suck it up, stop being a whiny baby. Grow a bloody spine and take responsibility. Be a ******* MAN for a change.

[/rant]
That's funny because your militia was propped up by goons exploiting then rode the wave of 1 day old alt farmers
cashing in on tier 5. And you are going to call him using out for using alts to pos your space so he has a chance to fight you?

So how about you suck it up and admit the system is broken and go back into your hole.
Milton Middleson
Rifterlings
#232 - 2012-11-05 00:27:23 UTC
Poetic Stanziel wrote:
You can't knock down twenty rats in sixty seconds. Not solo.


Beam coercer.
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#233 - 2012-11-05 00:35:32 UTC
Poetic Stanziel wrote:
X Gallentius wrote:
Dan Carter Murray wrote:
X Gallentius wrote:
Quote:
First of all, you cannot offensively plex a minor in 10 minutes. More like 20 minutes now.
Aside from all the BS you've posted so far, why does it take you 20 minutes to cap a minor when it takes everybody else 12 minutes? What are you doing that is so fail?


I JUST TIMED ONE I DID IT IN 11. BOOYAH X GAL.

But you aren't accounting for warping to the next system and running the next one. That take EIGHTEEN MINUTES!!!! - according to one poster here.
You can't knock down twenty rats in sixty seconds. Not solo.
I can't, but Dan Carter Murray can. I can do it in 120 seconds.
Vordak Kallager
Descendance.
GoonSwarm.
#234 - 2012-11-05 00:40:25 UTC
Corporate Management wrote:
kraiklyn Asatru wrote:
[rant]

Cearain has a weird sense of entitlement. He wants ISK, he wants it for free. He doesnt want to do all those things the minmatar do to gain that isk. He doesnt want to defend or have to run plexes. We have spend a lot of LP upgrading, night and nights plexing and defending, running after your isk farmers. What do you do? You make an alt and farm yourself, then you start complaining about minmatar plexing. If you remove all your damn alts ww would be losing a lot of numbers haha. Or are you forgetting about your alt corp Tribal Outlaws??? You know the corp whos POSes you use to hide your Amarr main PVP ships in.

Suck it up, stop being a whiny baby. Grow a bloody spine and take responsibility. Be a ******* MAN for a change.

[/rant]
That's funny because your militia was propped up by goons exploiting then rode the wave of 1 day old alt farmers
cashing in on tier 5. And you are going to call him using out for using alts to pos your space so he has a chance to fight you?

So how about you suck it up and admit the system is broken and go back into your hole.


The only thing Goons did was save us a few hundred million ISK by using their own LP to push for the first few T5 instead of us having to use our own. Thanks Goons...

Sa souvraya niende misain ye.
Braitai
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#235 - 2012-11-05 00:49:57 UTC
Cearain wrote:
I have a hunch many minmatar are laughing at them.


Farmers might prefer you guys to offensively plex, but I'd make more ISK if the Amarr gave up on sov and let us get t5. Thankfully a lot of Amarr are still playing, from the perspective of the game and not my wallet anyway.
IbanezLaney
The Church of Awesome
#236 - 2012-11-05 01:04:27 UTC
Sniper cormo. Sit there. No need to move or chase any rats. Saves a lot of time. If you are moving to chase stuff/get range - you are wasting time.

1-2 shots everything. Plexes take about 60-90 sec extra over the old system. Then a one min warp to next system.

Including travel and scanning time - maybe 13min tops.

DCM can always do it in 60sec cause the NPC's self destruct due to his harsh language. They can't take over 60 seconds of him chatting in local. lol.

https://soundcloud.com/ibanezlaney
Andiedeath
We Aim To MisBehave
Wild Geese.
#237 - 2012-11-05 01:05:25 UTC
Are people really still QQing? The Amarr are earning twice as much as they use to, bringing loads of 1v1 and small gang fights which is great for many of us Winmatar that are honestly quite noobish in this regards. I for one and our alliance are greatful that the Amarr/Caldari have brought the fight to Metro as well as the rest of the warzone.

Well done to the Amarr/Caldari for bringing a fight (yes I realise most of the people fighting for the enemy in the AU timezone are Caldari :P) and to CCP for the changes thus far.

The only issue we have currently is that due to so many rats spawning in offensive plexes, offensives are heavily weighted towards the defensive side due to them not needing to do anything other orbit a button. Although this is the case we are enjoying the challenge and the requirement to work better with other Minmatar Alliances in other timezones. That being said I'm still looking forward to the rat changes and bonuses for system control come December. At least all our hard work holding systems will then start to pay off. (Yes we are still able to farm missions and make lots of isk, although we could do this from high sec if we just wanted to preserve our own interests).

Fight Hard, Die Honorably!

Director

Sefem Velox

INGAME CHANNEL: Sefem Public
Dan Carter Murray
#238 - 2012-11-05 01:50:19 UTC
X Gallentius wrote:
Dan Carter Murray wrote:
X Gallentius wrote:
Quote:
First of all, you cannot offensively plex a minor in 10 minutes. More like 20 minutes now.
Aside from all the BS you've posted so far, why does it take you 20 minutes to cap a minor when it takes everybody else 12 minutes? What are you doing that is so fail?


I JUST TIMED ONE I DID IT IN 11. BOOYAH X GAL.

But you aren't accounting for warping to the next system and running the next one. That take EIGHTEEN MINUTES!!!! - according to one poster here.


I DID ACCOUNT FOR THAT BECAUSE I PUT HYPERSPATIAL WHATEVER THE **** RIGS TO MAKE ME WARP FASTER

http://mfi.re/?j7ldoco 50GB free space @ MediaFire.com
Dan Carter Murray
#239 - 2012-11-05 01:55:00 UTC
IbanezLaney wrote:
Sniper cormo. Sit there. No need to move or chase any rats. Saves a lot of time. If you are moving to chase stuff/get range - you are wasting time.

1-2 shots everything. Plexes take about 60-90 sec extra over the old system. Then a one min warp to next system.

Including travel and scanning time - maybe 13min tops.

DCM can always do it in 60sec cause the NPC's self destruct due to his harsh language. They can't take over 60 seconds of him chatting in local. lol.


******* PIECE OF **** RATS WHAT THE **** AR...despawned...interesting...

Poetic Stanziel wrote:

You can't knock down twenty rats in sixty seconds. Not solo.

you have to fit your ship with something other than meta 0 modules...mediums take a little longer though...maybe 20 minutes for me.

http://mfi.re/?j7ldoco 50GB free space @ MediaFire.com
Vordak Kallager
Descendance.
GoonSwarm.
#240 - 2012-11-05 02:01:36 UTC
Dan Carter Murray wrote:
X Gallentius wrote:
Dan Carter Murray wrote:
X Gallentius wrote:
Quote:
First of all, you cannot offensively plex a minor in 10 minutes. More like 20 minutes now.
Aside from all the BS you've posted so far, why does it take you 20 minutes to cap a minor when it takes everybody else 12 minutes? What are you doing that is so fail?


I JUST TIMED ONE I DID IT IN 11. BOOYAH X GAL.

But you aren't accounting for warping to the next system and running the next one. That take EIGHTEEN MINUTES!!!! - according to one poster here.


I DID ACCOUNT FOR THAT BECAUSE I PUT HYPERSPATIAL WHATEVER THE **** RIGS TO MAKE ME WARP FASTER


I can't ******* decide whether I like you or not. Cry

Sa souvraya niende misain ye.