EVE General Discussion

We took down a single POS earlier today after about 25% of one cycle. That's less than 1.5 minutes. Do you honestly and seriously believe that your idea of making POSes destroyable in one sitting is going to make people actually bother with putting them up?


Distribution of moongoo is all well and good, but evolving and variable supply, as in "the moongoo types randomly move about every 3 months" is a ******** idea.


We have refineries where we get 100% return as it is.


What I remember was you harping on about "having to defend your POSes or they will get blown up".


You'll notice that he's not saying "remove reinforcement timers", he's saying "shooting them today is a terrible usage of time since you don't really inflict a lot of damage". The POS revamp might change things, but if I were you I wouldn't hope for being able to shoot a POS to death in one go (unless the owner has forgotten to stront it), because again, we shot one to death in less than 2 minutes just a few hours ago. 2 minutes. You're barely able to respond to that even if you've got a fleet in the system, let alone if you have to form up a defense fleet and roll out, and when two alliances in a vastly different timezone go at eachother, that'd quickly lead to both alliances' space being completely empty of structures, with nothing anyone could really do about it. That's not good gameplay.

Although an idea thread in GD is usually off-railed (ahem the Touval dude) this made me curious.

Can I ask why would you view null-sec as the mass-production area of EVE? I am not advocating against or pro it ,but as far as I understand, it makes more sense to establish mass-production in a relatively safer and Empire-Controlled space. Well...For the typical industrial reasons that is. You don't wanna build your factory in the middle of a warzone now do you? No matter how much this is tweaked, I think high security space will still attract more production lines regardless of costs,plus it makes more sense to outsource production for the same reasons.

PS: I am not a null resident so I can't comment on specific changes but logic is logic.

i have to give credit to a lot of you guys for actually keeping the discussion running.

Touval Lysander is either especially stupid or an especially good troll, my bounty still stands, 500m to the man who gives me proof of his real ingame characters, so we can see.

You've skipped the bit about non-production towers NOT being so easy.


Why? First thing that happens is the moons aren't the REASON for sov. It creates a need to perhaps abandon space and/or go get some.


Which is exactly what I said. But they're not POS refineries. Why would you?


Correct. What a beautiful thing it would be.


He's pointing out the same point I made about timers (as he did with POCOS). For my measly 200m I get you tied up for 8 hours and then you have to COME BACK. Fleet time, travel time etc. 2 minutes might be the kill - betcha it took longer than that to get organised.

Again Zim. You've ignored my counter where towers that are NOT producing will NOT be able to be taken down in "2 minutes".

In fact, if I flick "the switch" as you called it, your force is going to get HURT and hurt big. You're "2 minutes" might end up costing you millions if we make towers a serious, serious threat when they are not producing.

If you insist on keeping it producing WHILE I'm attacking or about to attack, then lose it and lost it fast. A bit like TANK YOUR MACK to defend it, STOP yield fitting.

You just need to stop being so bloody-minded about what obviosuly DOESN'T and CONSIDER things that MIGHT.

I'd rather put forward an idea and have it killed than sit here and presume all is well because you said so.

All of Fade is SBU'd because everywhere is the front line.

Wrong, wrong, wrong and wrong.

When VFK was being invaded, being 5 jumps further up the region chute meant I was well away from the frontline. "Away from the frontline" means "away from where fighting occurs".

This shouldn't be a hard concept to grasp. Except:

Sigh, no. "Behind the frontline" is "behind the frontline", not some new definition you've invented.


Tippia is not using RL as the example. Hope this helps.

Ah yes, the "increase moongoo costs by 1/3rd to 2/3rds because all towers have to be shut down outside of the alliance's main TZ" clause, because we can easily burn down POSes and POCOs in 2 minutes flat.


Have you scanned a whole region's moons before?


Which wouldn't incentivize anyone to inhabit "less space", it would just disincentivize mining the less valuable moongoo or run reactions. I'd love to see how much of an effect that would have on T2 prices.


What he's pointing out is that there's no point in burning down the POSes or POCOs, because they represent a comparatively low investment compared to, say, a ratting carrier.


Yes, yes, the whole "let's dramatically increase the costs of all things T2" switch which would have to be toggled outside of your alliance's main TZs precisely because we can burn them down in 2 minutes flat. We get it, you want T2 to be pricier.

Ofc we're ignoring that in "taking the capital" there is simply no loss of C&C and if I killed or captured "The government" he/they just pop up somewhere else.

There is NO frontline per se. The ONLY way to win sov is by attrition - where you are is almost irrelevant.

Having your indy in highsec is completely and totally safe. It's not just behind the lines, it's not even in the equation.

Dare I ask how many of the Goons highsec industry alts are actually "Goons"? Why would this be so?

I can't speak for Natsett, but what he actually said was that nullsec is "the place were you need the most production, it's actually set up so that mass production isn't as worthwhile.", not the view that "null-sec as the mass-production area " as you put it. Your conclusion, that it is simply more sensible for a number of reasons to build your factory in empire-controlled space, is one that has been shared universally by all successful nullsec alliance leaders and logistics directors regardless of affiliation, size, nationality or allegiance. So I'd say it's fairly accurate.

What I would disagree with however is that this is an unavoidable situation, or that it's appropriate or accurate that 50% of all the k-space in EVE should be written off as a "the middle of a warzone" or "frontlines" (it simply doesn't reflect reality). There are a number of ways this can be corrected, many of which I posted on the first page,, but the strongest way of going about this is simply limiting highsec manufacturing capacity to being roughly limited towards replenishing and supplying its current rate of resource consumption and buffing nullsec industry so that it has the capacity of replenishing and supply its own rate of resource consumption (as well as adding incentives for low-level resource extraction in 0.0).

None of which has anything to do with the suggestion of yours which I think is awful, which is the whole "let a POS be shot to pieces in one go or keep it essentially offline for 2/3rds of a day" bit.