These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Remove T2 BPOs

First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
qDoctor Strangelove
Doomheim
#61 - 2012-10-12 18:58:10 UTC
Christy D Floyd wrote:
Is it fair to new players who have joined the game after the lottery.


So...
2012-2003.. About 9 years
9 years x 12 months x 15 usd... That is about 1600 usd.. And I started 3 accounts in 2003, so multiply by 3..

I have earned my T2 BPO's thank you.
Between the 3 of them, I plex one account with the profits.
Arkon Olacar
black.listed
#62 - 2012-10-12 19:00:01 UTC
F'elch wrote:
Kale Eledar wrote:
Funny...I feel like I've seen this thread before
before before before before before before before *smack*
Sorry.
Seriously...just look up Akita T's responses to this issue.


See my above post on self-important forum contributors.

Talking of sel-important forum contributors, I've just read three pages of this garbage and not once have you even attempted to explain why T2BPO's need removing, or why they are bad in any way at all.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#63 - 2012-10-12 19:05:15 UTC
RaTTuS wrote:
S'Way wrote:
This topic comes up every few weeks / months, was wondering when it would appear again.

Most T2 BPO's aren't even in the hands of the original owners anymore, anyone buying one now will take a very long time (years) to re-coup that outlay and start making a decent profit.
Removing them now is kind of pointless, those who got them from the BP lottery era have probably cashed in by selling them on. The majority of owners now have thrown a few billion into one, good luck to them - should CCP see fit to introduce new modules, that costly BPO could be rendered almost worthless. (and if that happens before the break-even time for the holder, they'll actually take a loss overall).

Do they give an advantage over invention ? sure. Are they game breaking ? no.
Even with a T2 BPO sat copying 24/7 you can't supply the markets full demand for items, there's plenty of room for inventors to still make a good income if they know what they're doing.

they take longer to copy than to build - it's always been the case
invention is far more profitable
run the figures
t2 BPo is just easier on the clicking


Invention is NOT far more profitable... that's a LIE.....

T2 BPO's allow for the production of a t2 item without the cost of invention, and without the poor ME & PE levels produced from invention. Any item produced from a t2 BPO will be CHEAPER, and MORE PROFITABLE, than an item produced through invention... So this bullcrap about invention being more profitable is just wrong...

Invention does allow you to "focus" on a single item and mass produce them, whereas a T2 BPO doesnt. That does NOT mean that invention is more profitable... as if you had 10 t2 BPO's for that item (giving you an appropriate comparison), the T2 BPO production would be vastly more profitable...

Now, FYI, I invent, I do not own a t2 BPO... and I do NOT support the removal of t2 BPO's. T2 BPO's are legacy items that have become investment items. They should not be removed or made obsolete... they should be made more vulnerable...

F'elch
Wall Street Trading
#64 - 2012-10-12 19:15:39 UTC
Arkon Olacar wrote:
F'elch wrote:
Kale Eledar wrote:
Funny...I feel like I've seen this thread before
before before before before before before before *smack*
Sorry.
Seriously...just look up Akita T's responses to this issue.


See my above post on self-important forum contributors.

Talking of sel-important forum contributors, I've just read three pages of this garbage and not once have you even attempted to explain why T2BPO's need removing, or why they are bad in any way at all.


"...it never fails, unlike invention. And the supply is unlimited. Everyone defending T2 BPO has one, otherwise you would want to get rid of them too..."

QFT

Also, reduced production costs, as mentioned by others. Also, unethical distribution in the first place.
Othran
Route One
#65 - 2012-10-12 19:15:59 UTC
With a few exceptions a T2 BPO is a fairly dodgy asset - it can be devalued, or appreciate significantly in the course of a single patch.

A good example is the Hulk BPO - license to print money mmm? Such a BPO would go for a few hundred bill - and did.

Mining barge buffs come along and suddenly hulks aren't so attractive for the price.

Loss on BPO? 50bill on one BPO sale that I know of - that was maybe 16% reduction in the BPO value overnight.

I don't have a T2 BPO by the way - if I did I'd pick my time and sell it. I certainly wouldn't bother producing from it as you'd be dead before you amortised the cost.

tl;dr T2 BPOs are mainly hedges against Eve inflation, but they're pretty risky hedges....
Horsus Benj
Millenia Flux
#66 - 2012-10-12 19:32:18 UTC
F'elch wrote:
It is about time this unfair advantage was removed from the game. You've done well, you've had your profit. Now they should be removed. Give the owners some datacores or something instead.

Please explain how investing the cost of a titan for one bpo that makes me 1.5 bill a month is such a huge unfair advantage that it makes it necessary to remove the t2 bpos. If they are so op why dont you just get one?
F'elch
Wall Street Trading
#67 - 2012-10-12 19:32:31 UTC
Why is that that CCP are always so quiet on this subject? There must be some reason that this issue has not been addressed and I would like to know why.
F'elch
Wall Street Trading
#68 - 2012-10-12 19:34:22 UTC
Horsus Benj wrote:
F'elch wrote:
It is about time this unfair advantage was removed from the game. You've done well, you've had your profit. Now they should be removed. Give the owners some datacores or something instead.

Please explain how investing the cost of a titan for one bpo that makes me 1.5 bill a month is such a huge unfair advantage that it makes it necessary to remove the t2 bpos. If they are so op why dont you just get one?


Please read the thread, it should be obvious by now.
Nikodiemus
Ganja Clade
Shadow Cartel
#69 - 2012-10-12 19:42:25 UTC
If T2 bpo are so nearly useless, why pay tens of billions to buy one?

If T2 bpo are so game breaking they need to be removed, why don't you want one?
Cede Forster
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#70 - 2012-10-12 20:14:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Cede Forster
Come on guys, you are overreacting. It is not like CCP members were actually going around and giving these BPO away. It was a fair distribution with proper oversight, nothing shady was going on there.

No reason to be bitter just because you started playing later or just had bad luck back when.



Now if there would be evidence that the system would have been rigged and there was no guerrante that the "lottery" was ever fair or unbiased, that be an argument. But that is not the case so ... shhuu shuuu go away.
Ginger Barbarella
#71 - 2012-10-12 20:51:45 UTC
F'elch wrote:
It is about time this unfair advantage was removed from the game. You've done well, you've had your profit. Now they should be removed. Give the owners some datacores or something instead.


I see Brewery Kuvalopi's alt has come out of hiding. Another poster to block.

"Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." --- Sorlac
Varesk
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#72 - 2012-10-12 20:54:21 UTC
F'elch wrote:
It is about time this unfair advantage was removed from the game. You've done well, you've had your profit. Now they should be removed. Give the owners some datacores or something instead.


Its not CCPs fault or the owners of T2 BPOs fault. The fault lies on you for not playing EVE when the t2 bpo lottery was active.
octahexx Charante
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#73 - 2012-10-12 21:08:15 UTC
from a non indy perspective:

if inventors and collectors like these highpriced items why would you want to take away their endgame goals?

Every profession needs something to strive for.
ISD TYPE40
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#74 - 2012-10-12 21:08:47 UTC
Thread moved from GD to F&I - ISD Type40.

[b]ISD Type40 Lt. Commander Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department[/b]
Luc Chastot
#75 - 2012-10-12 21:49:23 UTC
"Remove T2 BPOs because I say so and everyone knows I am right lalalalalalalalalalalalala I am right"

ISD, please lock this thread.

Make it idiot-proof and someone will make a better idiot.

Mallak Azaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#76 - 2012-10-12 21:54:32 UTC
Considering that a lot of people are complaining about ship prices, I don't think removing T2 BPO's is a good idea at this stage.

This post was lovingly crafted by a member of the Goonwaffe Posting Cabal, proud member of the popular gay hookup site somethingawful.com, Spelling Bee, Grammar Gestapo & #1 Official Gevlon Goblin Fanclub member.
Kale Eledar
Venerated Industries
#77 - 2012-10-13 15:00:19 UTC
F'elch wrote:
Well the fact that this thread has got to three pages shows that there is still interest in this subject and quite a few people are taking my line on this. Thanks to those who are willing to support an unpopular opinion. To those against the removal of T2 BPOs, your arguments that they are useless actually only helps to strengthen the argument that they should be removed.

And to those who seem to think their high post count and number of "likes" makes them some kind of authority (I'm looking at you, Tippia), I would say that your own inflated sense of importance and overconfidence in the so-called "right answer" blinkers you to the overall affect these items have on the game and the attitude of builders and traders as a whole.


A few things:

-"Quite a few" is relative here. This subject has, with little hyperbole, been brought up on these forums almost a hundred times. I get that you feel there is an unfair advantage, but it's not like they're the only thing in Eve players can't acquire easily. Difficulty of acquisition is not really relevant in a capitalistic space market game. Could the original system have been done better? Of course. But nobody has been able to provide a convincing reason why such a massive change should happen NOW or how to go about it the fairest way possible.

-Nobody has implied that post count or 'like count' confer authority except you. Rather, these people TEND to be more experienced, more knowledgeable, and earn their likes (for the most part). This is not to say that there aren't forum whores, but so far, the players we have referenced actually know what they are talking about in this instance. Akita is one of the old guard and has massive industrial experience. The arguments presented by that character were brought up because there is a veritable wealth of educated opinions he has already spent a lot of time on that are out there for you to reference, and which are, for the most part, watertight positions. So no, it has nothing to do with post count. Read his posts, and we won't knee-jerk react to your complaining, which these poasters have gotten used to after seeing the same argument ad-nauseam.

-You can't just propose they are removed without discussing how.

-Most people who bash them tend to ignore the profit potential of invention.

ADDENDUM: I don't own one - bad investment IMHO.

First come smiles, then lies. Last is gunfire.
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#78 - 2012-10-13 16:01:45 UTC
Luc Chastot wrote:
"Remove T2 BPOs because I say so and everyone knows I am right lalalalalalalalalalalalala I am right"

ISD, please lock this thread.

ISD did the next best thing, moved it to features and ideas.

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
Sbrodor
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#79 - 2012-10-19 15:58:23 UTC
my effort to discussion is a my real life friend stated playing eve and paying subscribtion.

he played indy career.

when seen the t2 intie are sold at less the production price with invenction he left 3 account of eve.

he played with passion and time, he will start to making some profit with intelligence and industrial job , like the website said.

http://www.eveonline.com/sandbox/manufacturer/


I played some weeks, after he left , with their toon and as i seen the t2bpo question i understood the t2 market is broken.

i will stop playing the indy and come back to my main pvper....

is not funny playing without the chance to fight in a market where u r in ME -4 aganist ME 100 bpo ;D