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Dev blog: Stay on Target!

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Soden Rah
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#661 - 2012-10-13 11:05:32 UTC
CCP karkur wrote:
Bubanni wrote:

I think you guys are doing a good job with taking in feedback, like I am sure you will take in my 1 decimal in countdowns under 10 sec (9.9 and down)
Thank you Smile
I'm taking it in but I might not do itP I think I actually changed the string so it only has 1 decimal and I think it's probably best to keep it that way for all times.... but we'll see Smile



Just seconding/thirding the sentiment that this is a great idea (with a couple of tweaks ;-) ) and that your work is very much apreciated.
CCP Sisyphus
C C P
C C P Alliance
#662 - 2012-10-13 11:18:54 UTC
As Karkur said - we're taking this stuff in, but that doesn't mean we're actually going to do it all.. (that would be very confusing.)

Please be nice, as unhappy Karkur makes everyone unhappy :(

But on the plus side, there are some real gold nuggets of feedback here! Which makes me feel like coming to you more often at the concept stage :)

CCP Sisyphus | Team TriLambda | Team Klang | @CCP_Sisyphus
Soden Rah
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#663 - 2012-10-13 11:37:21 UTC
CCP Sisyphus wrote:
As Karkur said - we're taking this stuff in, but that doesn't mean we're actually going to do it all.. (that would be very confusing.)

Please be nice, as unhappy Karkur makes everyone unhappy :(

But on the plus side, there are some real gold nuggets of feedback here! Which makes me feel like coming to you more often at the concept stage :)


One thought, And I don't know if this would be too much work to implement, But if there was a post at the top of the thread which you updated with a list of the ideas that you (collectively) thought were good that might be nice as we could see what suggestions made the grade as it were.

However I agree that niceness is the order of the day.
Soden Rah
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#664 - 2012-10-13 11:43:10 UTC
Salpun wrote:
When will the damage notification be movableTwisted
And the log be easier to read?


On the easier to read log front...

How about allowing seperate columns for incomming and outgoing damage as well as notifications.
That way you can easily sort out what damage you are doing and is being done to you.
Flyin' Hawaiian
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#665 - 2012-10-13 12:10:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Flyin' Hawaiian
Probably been said already (not gonna look through all the pages P)

But you guys could try making the health bars in a semi-circle on the top. Like a health bar rainbow! \o/

The "bars" could be stacked like our current setup for seeing our own shield/armor/struct above our capacitor in our hud. Or following each other like in the pictures posed in the OP. But have the bars read left to right.

Of course the health rainbow could be placed wherever along the circumference of the circle, just take a piece out so we know where the beginning and end are.

Also, intuitive for me is to read things left to right, top to bottom. So I hope whatever you do, incorporates that.
Kenpachi Viktor
Perkone
Caldari State
#666 - 2012-10-13 12:14:42 UTC
CCP karkur wrote:

We come here to talk to you guys but it's like your damned if you do and damned if you don't.... and the more people that act like that, the more likely is that we will just not bother and just go watch TV or something.


I for one am awed at how much the fine folk at CCP are coming to the forums, posting early and often.
Use to be only moderators posted with any frequency, and even with Dev blog comment threads, you would rarely get a dev post after the first 5 pages.

To every dev who has braved these forums, you are all heroes with massive balls Blink

A war that would’ve involved 20,000 players, 75% of nullsec space, and hundreds of supercapitals was halted not by diplomacy, but by a game mechanic so dreadful that those who have experienced it previously have no desire to do so again. - Fix POS & SOV
Bubanni
Corus Aerospace
#667 - 2012-10-13 12:21:35 UTC
Soden Rah wrote:
CCP Sisyphus wrote:
As Karkur said - we're taking this stuff in, but that doesn't mean we're actually going to do it all.. (that would be very confusing.)

Please be nice, as unhappy Karkur makes everyone unhappy :(

But on the plus side, there are some real gold nuggets of feedback here! Which makes me feel like coming to you more often at the concept stage :)


One thought, And I don't know if this would be too much work to implement, But if there was a post at the top of the thread which you updated with a list of the ideas that you (collectively) thought were good that might be nice as we could see what suggestions made the grade as it were.

However I agree that niceness is the order of the day.


What if devs could "like" posts and everyone could see which devs liked it, (blue stamp)
By simply having this stamp on everyone knows if devs liked an idea or not :)

(That way devs don't have to comment on every single good or bad idea)

Supercap nerf - change ewar immunity https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=194759 Module activation delay! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1180934
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
#668 - 2012-10-13 12:21:45 UTC
This whole feature is an utter waste of development time.
Why alter the targeting UI at all?

You could have spent the time on things like, I dunno...the inventory UI abomination, thinking through and making changes to the broken moon goo mechanic....you know, trivial things like that.

But no, you have to create pretty baubles to distract the players from what is really wrong with the game.
Bubanni
Corus Aerospace
#669 - 2012-10-13 12:30:58 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
This whole feature is an utter waste of development time.
Why alter the targeting UI at all?

You could have spent the time on things like, I dunno...the inventory UI abomination, thinking through and making changes to the broken moon goo mechanic....you know, trivial things like that.

But no, you have to create pretty baubles to distract the players from what is really wrong with the game.


Shut up, the devs working on uni-invi are already working on it and doing a good job... plus this stuff makes the game feel better and more up to date

Supercap nerf - change ewar immunity https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=194759 Module activation delay! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1180934
Soden Rah
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#670 - 2012-10-13 12:34:18 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
This whole feature is an utter waste of development time.
Why alter the targeting UI at all?

You could have spent the time on things like, I dunno...the inventory UI abomination, thinking through and making changes to the broken moon goo mechanic....you know, trivial things like that.

But no, you have to create pretty baubles to distract the players from what is really wrong with the game.


There is no dislike button for me to press... but if there were I would currently be pressing it.
Flyin' Hawaiian
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#671 - 2012-10-13 12:36:26 UTC
Also, if you could, I would like it if we got to keep the %health we can get by mousing over the health bars of the targeted items in our current setup. Doesn't mean much for a normal fight. But when you're shooting something w/ tons of HP, like pos bashing, it makes it ever so less soul crushing when you can actually see the % tick downward.
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
#672 - 2012-10-13 12:41:58 UTC
Bubanni wrote:
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
This whole feature is an utter waste of development time.
Why alter the targeting UI at all?

You could have spent the time on things like, I dunno...the inventory UI abomination, thinking through and making changes to the broken moon goo mechanic....you know, trivial things like that.

But no, you have to create pretty baubles to distract the players from what is really wrong with the game.


Shut up, the devs working on uni-invi are already working on it and doing a good job... plus this stuff makes the game feel better and more up to date


Well, it is certainly important that Eve do things to make you and the other fan-boi's feel better.
Soden Rah
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#673 - 2012-10-13 12:50:19 UTC
CCP karkur wrote:
Just a little update in case you are interested... yesterday there was a lot of discussion on my team about this project (I was sickish so I was working from home and missed it all) and it continued today.
I've put the lock counter back, but will be removing the decimals (unless I find out that people find them VERY important).
We talked a lot about the health bars and will most likely be making them counterclockwise and that it's obvious where the circle starts and ends.
And the work just continues, we still have almost 2 months until we release Smile
(of course we can't update you on every step we take, but I just wanted to share this with youSmile)


Any chance that the bars could optionally go clockwise or counterclockwise?

Clockwise makes much more sense to me, (whereas for others the opposite seems to apply).
Having the option to have it go around either way would allow both sets of people to be happy, and shouldn't (hopes) be
too hard to program.
Bubanni
Corus Aerospace
#674 - 2012-10-13 12:58:14 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
Bubanni wrote:
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
This whole feature is an utter waste of development time.
Why alter the targeting UI at all?

You could have spent the time on things like, I dunno...the inventory UI abomination, thinking through and making changes to the broken moon goo mechanic....you know, trivial things like that.

But no, you have to create pretty baubles to distract the players from what is really wrong with the game.


Shut up, the devs working on uni-invi are already working on it and doing a good job... plus this stuff makes the game feel better and more up to date


Well, it is certainly important that Eve do things to make you and the other fan-boi's feel better.


Yes.

Supercap nerf - change ewar immunity https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=194759 Module activation delay! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1180934
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#675 - 2012-10-13 13:29:48 UTC
A hard concept for newer players to figure out is transversal...
And even after you get a basic understanding of it you still have to manipulate your overview settings and stare at numbers to make sure you get max dps...

how about you have some sort of graphic for a target that when thier transversal is low it then displays graphic A (being the max dps graphic)
which would be an easy intuitive way to know that you should start shooting.

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Oberine Noriepa
#676 - 2012-10-13 13:43:23 UTC
MeBiatch wrote:
A hard concept for newer players to figure out is transversal...
And even after you get a basic understanding of it you still have to manipulate your overview settings and stare at numbers to make sure you get max dps...

how about you have some sort of graphic for a target that when thier transversal is low it then displays graphic A (being the max dps graphic)
which would be an easy intuitive way to know that you should start shooting.

During the Q&A part of the art presentation at Fanfest, someone suggested the implementation of a line tracing from your ship's turrets to your target that could change color to indicate ideal transversal velocities. Perhaps a line isn't the best mechanism to use here. Regardless, I think it would be great if the HUD used something that looks nice and is easy to read for such information. Less reliance on the overview menu is a good thing here.

∃
Kabaos
Fulgur lumene
#677 - 2012-10-13 13:50:17 UTC
Cool. I think this is good innovation. Invent something new moreBig smile
Gibbo3771
AQUILA INC
Verge of Collapse
#678 - 2012-10-13 13:51:45 UTC
it is going to be SUPER ANNOYING having a big red blinky ******* bracket for every drones and ship on the field, like literally even in a 1 vs 5 fight, thats 25 drones.

The idea of having it blink corresponding to there weapons is just plain not required, its pretty damn easy to identify wtf is hitting you and how hard as long as you are not massively overwhelmed.

In my honest opinion the 3 parallel horizontal bar set-up that we have the now is perfectly fine, i see no reason to change a working game mechanic that does not even look that bad.....
Soden Rah
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#679 - 2012-10-13 13:56:55 UTC
Oberine Noriepa wrote:
MeBiatch wrote:
A hard concept for newer players to figure out is transversal...
And even after you get a basic understanding of it you still have to manipulate your overview settings and stare at numbers to make sure you get max dps...

how about you have some sort of graphic for a target that when thier transversal is low it then displays graphic A (being the max dps graphic)
which would be an easy intuitive way to know that you should start shooting.

During the Q&A part of the art presentation at Fanfest, someone suggested the implementation of a line tracing from your ship's turrets to your target that could change color to indicate ideal transversal velocities. Perhaps a line isn't the best mechanism to use here. Regardless, I think it would be great if the HUD used something that looks nice and is easy to read for such information. Less reliance on the overview menu is a good thing here.




However a very quick and simple update to the overview would be to colour angualr velocity readouts based on the percent damage reduction due to tracking.

So a target with an angular velocity which results in less than 10% reduction in damage would be green.
A target with an angualr velocity which results in more than 90% reduction in damage would be deep red.
Inbetween it would go from green to red (via yellow and orange) and objects with 0 tracking penulty they would be blue.

This requires no extra server load as it already tells the client the angualr velocity and your tracking speed.

You could do something similar with range for reductions due to falloff, and even sig radius.

Then you could imediately tell from the overview which ships are best to shoot at based on tracking speeds and range.
Crexa
Ion Industrials
#680 - 2012-10-13 14:16:20 UTC
That looks pretty and all but a couple of questions:

Whats the hit to bandwidth performance if any? And will it have a function key toggle either to turn it off or switch back to original? Screenies don't look so good with all that stuff going on.

Whatever you do, please add options.

"F=ma, so obviously they're putting mouths against arses to produce a force." "...its breakfast time and i am very hungry. may i have some of your paint chips?"