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Moon Gold - Tech Moons Specifically - I dont get your strategy CCP!

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Hemmo Paskiainen
#21 - 2012-10-10 11:35:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Hemmo Paskiainen
The issue back in prom and dyspro days was that bob has devs. Now goon has devs so there you go...

Back in the days bob was used to create confict. As devs were able to influence politic directly by simply being in key positions in the alliance (blah blah you can say its not but i know from personal experiance it was...). Kinda the same now with goons. The differance from than and now is that the income from tech and all the power gotten around it is much more worth/higher than holding all the prom or dyspro moons back in 04-07. Add on top the stuff you can buy with 10 trill a month (pl, test, any merc your want ect) and there you go, horrilbe 0.0 politocal and militairy disbalancement for the next 2 years... oh.. almost forgot the ffa capital builing gotten out the above, thats kinda big iskies and power aswell!. Next to that nothing serieuse... just that eve will die in about 2-3 years if nothing changes (butterfly boredom affect or chineze server situations).

hf trolling

If relativity equals time plus momentum, what equals relativity, if the momentum is minus to the time?
Lin-Young Borovskova
Doomheim
#22 - 2012-10-10 11:37:36 UTC
Holy One wrote:
I lack a degree in geopolitics but I would have thought a scarcity of resources drives conflict not a limitless supply.
Just sayin.



The game and number of players evolved but the base player mindset about eve didn't changed that much, it's even not ready to change for a long while as long as this game will be at first market on line instead space ships on line.

brb
Inquisitor Kitchner
The Executives
#23 - 2012-10-10 11:46:39 UTC
baltec1 wrote:

You cant prove we killed JFK so we cold fake the moon landings on the grassy knoll to fool people into thinking moons were nothing but useless dustballs orbiiting a flat earth.



I don't need to, Glenn Beck told me you're a front for the CIA

"If an injury has to be done to a man it should be so severe that his vengeance need not be feared." - Niccolo Machiavelli
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#24 - 2012-10-10 13:02:04 UTC
Inquisitor Kitchner wrote:
baltec1 wrote:

You cant prove we killed JFK so we cold fake the moon landings on the grassy knoll to fool people into thinking moons were nothing but useless dustballs orbiiting a flat earth.



I don't need to, Glenn Beck told me you're a front for the CIA

I must inform my KGB masters...
Xolve
State War Academy
Caldari State
#25 - 2012-10-11 03:30:31 UTC
I like how everyone cries tech is laughable broken and favors a single alliance, but nobody mentions the sheer amount of boring and laborious tasks you have to do on a daily basis to maintain any semblance of infrastructure, support and then after all the basics are finished, create an environment that actually ENCOURAGES people to come live out in Null Sec.

Jump bridges don't fuel themselves.
POSes don't fuel themselves.
Markets don't seed themselves.
Systems don't upgrade themselves.
Ships don't reimburse themselves.
Sov doesn't pay for itself.

If only everyone who cried 'Nerf Tech' understood exactly how much it cost to maintain a alliance/coalition strong enough to hold tech.
Caviar Liberta
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#26 - 2012-10-11 04:17:11 UTC
Xolve wrote:
I like how everyone cries tech is laughable broken and favors a single alliance, but nobody mentions the sheer amount of boring and laborious tasks you have to do on a daily basis to maintain any semblance of infrastructure, support and then after all the basics are finished, create an environment that actually ENCOURAGES people to come live out in Null Sec.

Jump bridges don't fuel themselves.
POSes don't fuel themselves.
Markets don't seed themselves.
Systems don't upgrade themselves.
Ships don't reimburse themselves.
Sov doesn't pay for itself.

If only everyone who cried 'Nerf Tech' understood exactly how much it cost to maintain a alliance/coalition strong enough to hold tech.


Welcome to logistics online? You are right. Null started out empty. No stations to work out of other than NPC space. It took people, time and resources to even start to develop the ground work to get to the point to put up the list of items you posted. Its a long logistics train to maintain that.
Mortimer Civeri
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#27 - 2012-10-11 04:33:09 UTC
Veschenko wrote:
If it moves, nerf it.


If it doesn't move, nerf it, just to make sure.

Kinda reminds me of This.

"I don't know which is worse, ...that everyone has his price, or that the price is always so low." Calvin
Securitas Protector
Horde Vanguard.
Pandemic Horde
#28 - 2012-10-11 05:35:58 UTC
Xolve wrote:
I like how everyone cries tech is laughable broken and favors a single alliance, but nobody mentions the sheer amount of boring and laborious tasks you have to do on a daily basis to maintain any semblance of infrastructure, support and then after all the basics are finished, create an environment that actually ENCOURAGES people to come live out in Null Sec.

Jump bridges don't fuel themselves.
POSes don't fuel themselves.
Markets don't seed themselves.
Systems don't upgrade themselves.
Ships don't reimburse themselves.
Sov doesn't pay for itself.

If only everyone who cried 'Nerf Tech' understood exactly how much it cost to maintain a alliance/coalition strong enough to hold tech.

If it's that hard WITH tech, imagine how hard it is without it.

Cry me a river. My alliance has Cobalt.
Aldeb Haraz
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#29 - 2012-10-11 05:39:28 UTC
Xolve wrote:
I like how everyone cries tech is laughable broken and favors a single alliance, but nobody mentions the sheer amount of boring and laborious tasks you have to do on a daily basis to maintain any semblance of infrastructure, support and then after all the basics are finished, create an environment that actually ENCOURAGES people to come live out in Null Sec.



That wasnt the issue that the OP brought up. He was in no way arguing that alliances shouldn't have a source of income which is a whole different issue, he was just pointing out that the way technetium moons are distributed it obviously favors the sort of stagnant coalition level political landscape that we see now.

It's not encouraging for someone to live in nullsec when you are either on the side with tech moons or the side with no such way to make insane amounts of passive income. It favors one group (the largest), which is obviously not a favorable situation for any smaller scale group looking to enter the null scene.
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#30 - 2012-10-11 05:58:18 UTC
Aldeb Haraz wrote:
any smaller scale group looking to enter the null scene.


It's more than just tech moons that discourage new groups from forming in the nullsec scene without existing ties to coalitions. In the past, a group seeking to enter nullsec would venture to NPC 0.0 and proceed to look for opportunities to take space, be it through political maneuvering or simple opportunism when an existing alliance collapses (i.e. the groups that existed in thunderdome-era Delve)

These days, those small, new organizations set up in wormholes. The rewards are much greater, and despite CCP's intention to prevent wormholes from functioning as a permanent residence for any organization, the rewards of living in wormholes, especially when compared with NPC 0.0, are worth the effort. A lot of the talent that would otherwise help a new organization build up in nullsec simply disappears into wormholes.

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Gorn Arming
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#31 - 2012-10-11 06:14:21 UTC
Securitas Protector wrote:
Xolve wrote:
I like how everyone cries tech is laughable broken and favors a single alliance, but nobody mentions the sheer amount of boring and laborious tasks you have to do on a daily basis to maintain any semblance of infrastructure, support and then after all the basics are finished, create an environment that actually ENCOURAGES people to come live out in Null Sec.

Jump bridges don't fuel themselves.
POSes don't fuel themselves.
Markets don't seed themselves.
Systems don't upgrade themselves.
Ships don't reimburse themselves.
Sov doesn't pay for itself.

If only everyone who cried 'Nerf Tech' understood exactly how much it cost to maintain a alliance/coalition strong enough to hold tech.

If it's that hard WITH tech, imagine how hard it is without it.

Cry me a river. My alliance has Cobalt.

And your alliance is irrelevant. Coincidence?
Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#32 - 2012-10-11 06:39:38 UTC
Gorn Arming wrote:
And your alliance is irrelevant. Coincidence?

Exacty the point, in fact.

Future of T3 cruisers - multi-tool they aspired to be instead of sledgehammer they have become
Ocih
Space Mermaids
#33 - 2012-10-11 06:50:40 UTC
I blame Glenn Beck
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#34 - 2012-10-11 06:52:02 UTC
Ocih wrote:
I blame Glenn Beck

I could have SWORN you had a different name.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
No More Heroes
Boomer Humor
Snuffed Out
#35 - 2012-10-11 06:52:03 UTC
Poetic Stanziel wrote:
It was supposed to drive conflict.

And I suppose it has. Goonswarm has so much of it, that they are now taking pretty much all of it.


If only the strongest, most seasoned veteran pvp alliances in Eve would take their capital blobs to Deklein and launch a surprise attack...

.
Shaalira D'arc
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#36 - 2012-10-11 06:59:48 UTC
CCP is aware of the issue.

Expect action sometime in 2014. Or 2013 if you're feeling spunky.
Sisohiv
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#37 - 2012-10-11 07:01:27 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Ocih wrote:
I blame Glenn Beck

I could have SWORN you had a different name.


I do
Skydell
Bad Girl Posse
#38 - 2012-10-11 07:02:57 UTC
Sisohiv wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Ocih wrote:
I blame Glenn Beck

I could have SWORN you had a different name.


I do


15 in total
Hrothgar Nilsson
#39 - 2012-10-11 07:35:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Hrothgar Nilsson
Tech has taken a pretty big hit over the last few months. Right now the income of tech holders is about 50-60% of what the average was during OTEC's heyday. @200k isk per unit, a tech moon was worth about 14.4bil isk per month, at current prices, it's about 7.13bil ISK per month.

With alchemy, there's also enough cobalt available to potentially produce 267% the amount of platinum technite that can be produced from every tech moon in the game. Theoretically, production of platinum technite could be nearly quadrupled.

Not including POS fuel, the market value of the inputs cobalt and platinum are 23,500 ISK per unit produced of platinum technite, compared to 51,000 ISK in Jita.

Also, with the exhumer buffs, ganking them isn't really a viable strategy to artificially inflate the price of tech anymore.

I've... seen things you people wouldn't believe...

Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion...
MilitantMan
Doomheim
#40 - 2012-10-11 09:02:09 UTC
Hrothgar Nilsson wrote:
Tech has taken a pretty big hit over the last few months. Right now the income of tech holders is about 50-60% of what the average was during OTEC's heyday. @200k isk per unit, a tech moon was worth about 14.4bil isk per month, at current prices, it's about 7.13bil ISK per month.

http://s19.postimage.org/tzwioq0nn/techhistory.png

With alchemy, there's also enough cobalt available to potentially produce 267% the amount of platinum technite that can be produced from every tech moon in the game. Theoretically, production of platinum technite could be nearly quadrupled.

Not including POS fuel, the market value of the inputs cobalt and platinum are 23,500 ISK per unit produced of platinum technite, compared to 51,000 ISK in Jita.

Also, with the exhumer buffs, ganking them isn't really a viable strategy to artificially inflate the price of tech anymore.


See this is all fine and dandy, but its STILL 7.13 bill per month for each moon. there are what 70 moons in venal alone mainly controlled by CFC and some PL. thats what still almost 500 BILLION PER MONTH!! in passive income, for doing pretty much nothing. REALLY!!

Goons have what 80% of these moons, then they have deklein, and tribute and what ever else. They must be nearly making 1 trillion isk per month, thats insane for doing absolutley nothing really. Whilst the south has errrr nothing. How can that even be fair at all? Its simply wrong.
The causing of conflict again has backfired now everyone is in massive coalitions. I cant believe CCP just didnt see that.

The problem also is that no normal person will be able to hold one of these moons EVER! has they also have them in lowsec and highsec. Personally remove the whole passive moon mining income, its simply broken. If alliances want all this space and power then bloody work for it!
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