These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

How to Boil a Frog

First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
NEONOVUS
Mindstar Technology
Goonswarm Federation
#181 - 2012-10-10 23:04:26 UTC
No I was unaware and asking a legit question.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#182 - 2012-10-10 23:11:24 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:
NEONOVUS wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
T3 BC ganking costs more than tempests used to.

Yes but is that value adjusted for the price increase in everything else?
If everything has risen in proportion, then ganks are cheaper now.

The cost of ganking in a T3 was increased over ganking in a tempest the instant the insurance nerf went through, i.e. before the prices of minerals etc increased.

Try another strawman.

All these "questions" just another alt trying to act as though there's a great need to nerf ganking.

Look, it's already happening, there's no need to be all excited about it and egg CCP on.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Spurty
#183 - 2012-10-10 23:12:21 UTC
Poasting on page 10 of this years winter expansion wah-wah-waaaaaah dickers getting upset about change thread rage

Go to null

Let me kill you over and over please (no wah-wah-wailing)

There are good ships,

And wood ships,

And ships that sail the sea

But the best ships are Spaceships

Built by CCP
Lyrrashae
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
#184 - 2012-10-11 00:45:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Lyrrashae
Spurty wrote:
Poasting on page 10 of this years winter expansion wah-wah-waaaaaah dickers getting upset about change thread rage

Go to null

Let me kill you over and over please (no wah-wah-wailing)


No, no, no!

Bad troll! Bad! No soup for you, one month year!

You can't use the same weakfailtroll twice, unless you are an open forum-troll alt. (I'm assuming you think you aren't, at least? Who's your main, then?)

Jesus, what are they teaching kids these days...Panache please, people, panacheRoll!

Ni.
Surfin's PlunderBunny
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#185 - 2012-10-11 00:51:47 UTC
Ok, back to the thread title... why are we cooking french people?

"Little ginger moron" ~David Hasselhoff 

Want to see what Surf is training or how little isk Surf has?  http://eveboard.com/pilot/Surfin%27s_PlunderBunny
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#186 - 2012-10-11 00:53:12 UTC
Spurty wrote:
Go to null

Let me kill you over and over please (no wah-wah-wailing)

If you want to kill me over and over you should be able to come to highsec and do it there. I shouldn't have to go no null for you to kill me over and over and that is our entire complaint.
Nyancat Audeles
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#187 - 2012-10-11 01:10:58 UTC
Poetic Stanziel wrote:
from http://poeticstanziel.blogspot.ca/2012/10/how-to-boil-frog.html
And then thesummer of 2011 came, the **** hit the fan, the players were unhappy, subscriptions were cancelled. CCP was faced with the realization that what they did might not be appreciated. The goose might not lay golden eggs in perpetuity. CCP discovered fear.


I'm a bit new here. I've seen people here refer to some sort of apocalyptic event that happened in 2011. What exactly happened here? I joined after Incursion released so don't really know what this reference is to... can someone please explain?
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#188 - 2012-10-11 01:16:33 UTC
It was the expansion that must not be named.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#189 - 2012-10-11 01:17:29 UTC
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
It was the expansion that must not be named.

The INCARNAtion of doom itself.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#190 - 2012-10-11 01:35:04 UTC
DarthNefarius wrote:
Poetic Stanziel wrote:

Historically, the most whining, the most threats of ending subscriptions, have come from the carebear segment of the playerbase.


Malarky most whines on EVENEWS24, THEMITTANI.COM, & EVE forum posts/blogs are NULL seccerz bleating about how to move HI SECerz into NULL so they have more EZ prey. Your post is yet another whine that everybody's sandbox shouldbe the way you want it.


since you're against a risky hisec, i guess you're for removing incursions and other high-reward activities from hisec

oh wait, no you're not lmao

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#191 - 2012-10-11 02:05:44 UTC
Andski wrote:
DarthNefarius wrote:
Poetic Stanziel wrote:
Historically, the most whining, the most threats of ending subscriptions, have come from the carebear segment of the playerbase.

Malarky most whines on EVENEWS24, THEMITTANI.COM, & EVE forum posts/blogs are NULL seccerz bleating about how to move HI SECerz into NULL so they have more EZ prey. Your post is yet another whine that everybody's sandbox shouldbe the way you want it.

since you're against a risky hisec, i guess you're for removing incursions and other high-reward activities from hisec

oh wait, no you're not lmao

Rewards aren't risky, why do they have to be removed along with risk. They're the antithesis of risk.

Low-risk high-reward in highsec ERYYDAYYYYY

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
NEONOVUS
Mindstar Technology
Goonswarm Federation
#192 - 2012-10-11 03:08:04 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:

All these "questions" just another alt trying to act as though there's a great need to nerf ganking.

Look, it's already happening, there's no need to be all excited about it and egg CCP on.

Actually this is my main and only.
War dec me if you want for committing the sin of posting on main.

As for ganking I make most of my money stealing from the wrecks outside Jita.
Nerfing ganking is bad for me
Pipa Porto
#193 - 2012-10-11 04:59:17 UTC
Nyancat Audeles wrote:
Poetic Stanziel wrote:
from http://poeticstanziel.blogspot.ca/2012/10/how-to-boil-frog.html
And then thesummer of 2011 came, the **** hit the fan, the players were unhappy, subscriptions were cancelled. CCP was faced with the realization that what they did might not be appreciated. The goose might not lay golden eggs in perpetuity. CCP discovered fear.


I'm a bit new here. I've seen people here refer to some sort of apocalyptic event that happened in 2011. What exactly happened here? I joined after Incursion released so don't really know what this reference is to... can someone please explain?


Incarna was released with it's microtransaction store ($70 Monocles, and nothing under ~$10 IIRC) and anemic CQ, with little FIS content. A horrendously damaging internal newsletter was released (it could easily be read as "Microtransaction Everything"). There was a revelation about that anemic CQ being responsible for the relatively anemic expansions of the previous months. There was an emergency CSM summit (with a bungled and delayed release of minutes).

All of that resulted in giant protests and cost CCP ~25k Subs. That was CCP's summer 2011.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
#194 - 2012-10-11 10:24:47 UTC
Poetic Stanziel wrote:
Every player meet, every fanfest, CCP Soundwave trots out the same tired vision, how one day he would like to turn off CONCORD and leave policing in the players hands.


Poetic Stanziel wrote:
Increasing the costs of wardecs. Buffing mining ships to an obscene, nearly ungankable level. Removing insurance if killed by CONCORD. The so-called idiot switch to protect players from their own stupidity. The removal of can-flipping. Buffing CONCORD response. A change here, a change there. Control the message of those changes ("this behaviour was never intended," even when those behaviours have existed for years and never classified as exploits.)


Poetic Stanziel wrote:
Toss a frog into some boiling water, it's going to freak the hell out and immediately try to escape. But, put a frog in some cool water, very slowly increase the temperature of the water over time and the frog will not perceive the danger, eventually boiling to death. Or so the hypothesis goes. Turns out it is complete bunk, the frog will hop out of the water when it becomes uncomfortably warm. As a metaphor, though, the boiling frog anecdote is instructive.


Interesting post in general - while I might disagree about some of the specifics of focus I do see where you are going with it. For my part I guess this frog jumped out of the water over the inferno 1.1 wardec changes. That was the point where I personally believed that Soundwave (aided and abetted by the CSM) had jumped the shark on sandbox balance and introduced an easy mode for the largest and richest alliances in the game by protecting them from affordable wardecs offensive and defensive ally consequence. It was a clumsy knee-jerk that broke more than it fixed and left a nearly unusable wardec system that most players appear to already have opted out of. (Speaking as a player who's considered the wardec system a core focus of my Eve gameplay since 2003 you can understand perhaps why losing that functionality initially stings then mutates into a disappointed sigh and feeling of "meh")

Ultimately I guess we all have our personal view of when changes go too far and ruin our view of what the sandbox should be and when that time comes we get to vote with our feet (and credit cards).

I'm still (and probably always will be) quite interested in Eve Online and where it ends up going - but for the immediate future I don't have much faith in Soundwave's vision or direction and I'm opting to take one of those plex-fueled can't be bothered to play breaks while there are so many other games and RL stuff to concentrate on.

Perhaps things would be different if I had any faith in the CSM actually understanding the problems mind ... but such faith is long fled. Its a shame but things change and Eve is a very old game now. At this point I think it needs a general reinvention and mass injection of time and lavish focus coupled with renewed direction from a chief designer who actually "gets" how the varied ecosystem of the single server sandbox should interact and counter-balance itself to keep the game rich, vibrant and genuinely varied in population and opportunity.





The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom
Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#195 - 2012-10-11 10:57:25 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:
Nyancat Audeles wrote:
Poetic Stanziel wrote:
from http://poeticstanziel.blogspot.ca/2012/10/how-to-boil-frog.html
And then thesummer of 2011 came, the **** hit the fan, the players were unhappy, subscriptions were cancelled. CCP was faced with the realization that what they did might not be appreciated. The goose might not lay golden eggs in perpetuity. CCP discovered fear.


I'm a bit new here. I've seen people here refer to some sort of apocalyptic event that happened in 2011. What exactly happened here? I joined after Incursion released so don't really know what this reference is to... can someone please explain?


Incarna was released with it's microtransaction store ($70 Monocles, and nothing under ~$10 IIRC) and anemic CQ, with little FIS content. A horrendously damaging internal newsletter was released (it could easily be read as "Microtransaction Everything"). There was a revelation about that anemic CQ being responsible for the relatively anemic expansions of the previous months. There was an emergency CSM summit (with a bungled and delayed release of minutes).

All of that resulted in giant protests and cost CCP ~25k Subs. That was CCP's summer 2011.

You forgot a big part.
They removed ship spinning !

Can't tell me that didn't contribute to the disaster !
Skippermonkey
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#196 - 2012-10-11 13:33:01 UTC
Two step wrote:
You seem to be forgetting all the stuff CCP did that helped suicide gankers, like Tier 3 BCs, the destroyer buffs, etc.
Which they totally undid and then some with the latest changes.

It seems that CCP likes to talk the talk about EVE being a cold harsh 'anything goes' universe, but in plain sight of everyone they are slowly changing that fact.

COME AT ME BRO

I'LL JUST BE DOCKED IN THIS STATION
Markku Laaksonen
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#197 - 2012-10-11 13:38:57 UTC
Genuinely thought I would be learning how to cook up some tasty frog legs. Halfway through the OP I said to myself, I said "Self, that's no recipe! You've been bamboozled!"

p.s. "Bamboozled" passes the red squiggly line spell check.

DUST 514 Recruit Code - https://dust514.com/recruit/zluCyb/

EVE Buddy Invite - https://secure.eveonline.com/trial/?invc=047203f1-4124-42a1-b36f-39ca8ae5d6e2&action=buddy
Poetic Stanziel
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#198 - 2012-10-11 19:07:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Poetic Stanziel
I don't see how the new Kill Rights system does anything but discourage PvP in highsec. As Rotosequence describes the new system, it is engage highsec gangbang functionality.

Previous system, the kill rights were one-to-one. I admit that I like the idea of being able to sell a kill right, but the system should still remain one-to-one.

Not the case though. As soon as a kill right is activated, the target receives a suspect flag, opening them to aggression from EVERYONE.

Some people will continue to give no shits if they can be free-for-alled, but this will definitely cause many people to think twice before grabbing a criminal flag in highsec, because it means they can be dogpiled at anytime in highsec and without warning.

More evidence of CCP's ongoing development criteria of safening up highsec space.
Tenebrae Syrennis
Abattoir Research and Development
#199 - 2012-10-12 01:25:54 UTC
Ohaidere, Soundwave!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lNm5Hqow78I&feature=related

You monumental hypocrite.

I have come to eat all your brains.
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#200 - 2012-10-12 01:35:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Herzog Wolfhammer
Andski wrote:
DarthNefarius wrote:
Poetic Stanziel wrote:

Historically, the most whining, the most threats of ending subscriptions, have come from the carebear segment of the playerbase.


Malarky most whines on EVENEWS24, THEMITTANI.COM, & EVE forum posts/blogs are NULL seccerz bleating about how to move HI SECerz into NULL so they have more EZ prey. Your post is yet another whine that everybody's sandbox shouldbe the way you want it.


since you're against a risky hisec, i guess you're for removing incursions and other high-reward activities from hisec

oh wait, no you're not lmao




When tech moons can be depleted perhaps those incursions should leave high sec.

Or maybe remove local in 0.0.



Just saying...

Bring back DEEEEP Space!