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New Dev Blog: Time Dilation Video Demo

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Endeavour Starfleet
#221 - 2011-10-10 06:27:58 UTC
Tiger's Spirit... U mad brah?


You go from talking about what you think may happen with Tidi (Which is silly in my opinion) to talking about the size of alliances.

So instead of Tidi you want to change the very idea of nullsec? U mad? Big smile
CCP Spitfire
C C P
C C P Alliance
#222 - 2011-10-11 08:15:23 UTC
Imigo Montoya wrote:

I would sure like to see this - making the UI seem glitchy probably isn't the ideal way to convey the message that time is behaving differently, certainly not camera control.

I'm seriously impressed though, really liking what I'm seeing.

At the same time I'm somewhat confused by the people hating on this. It seems to be coming from a place of ignorance so I wrote an article on EN24 that explains the fundamentals of what TiDi is actually trying to achieve in a way that I think is accessible to anyone (ie no Computer Science degree needed).

I'd really appreciate your feedback Veritas, especially if my generalisation conflicts with how the specifics in this case actually work.


Hello,

CCP Veritas had some problems logging into the forums when I showed him this post, but he asked me to pass along that your summary is quite correct. Thank you for that article!

CCP Spitfire | Marketing & Sales Team @ccp_spitfire
X3k5
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#223 - 2011-10-12 01:44:23 UTC  |  Edited by: X3k5
I have just one word for TiDi: GENIUS!

As a 0.0 player, I have to say this is one awesome feature and massive props to CCP Veritas & co. for coming up with it.

To all the idiots who do not understand the mechanics of TiDi and are ignorantly criticizing it or saying stuff like "TiDi is just packaged lag": Go read the Time Dilation blog - http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=900
then go watch GeeShizzle MacCloud's video - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qgXp0S0-wPA.
If you still do not understand the difference between TiDi and lag, go back to nursery school.

The Time Dilation video is misleading because the system Veritas ran it on isnt great. The GeeShizzle MacCloud video does it justice and I absolutely love it, even the camera pan albeit that might get a little annoying at 10%.

The people crying about advantages and disadvantages are also incorrect. Since both sides are still at the same time speed, there are no advantages or disadvantages to either side. The only thing that changes is that FCs will now get more time to plan their moves based on what they see. That can mean less tactical mistakes but also second guessing.

There is no nerf to small fast ships. The game mechanics are exactly the same still. In TiDi, if a small ship goes in to tackle, it still takes the same amount of time(relatively speaking) to target and shoot it down as if the ship is immediately detected in full time-speed.
Endeavour Starfleet
#224 - 2011-10-12 06:24:47 UTC
That sisi testing video shows the Camera does NOT need changing. Please keep it the way it is in that video or add the option to keep it that way. I love it!

TiDi is really going to make large fleet fights and absolute JOY to go to! This ought to seriously help EVE in the long run.

Thanks!
Archetype 66
Perkone
Caldari State
#225 - 2011-10-12 23:04:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Archetype 66
Awesome Job, but please, don't touch the camera :p

One question :

For now, when a system is laggy, you're hampered for all kinds of actions : navigation, pvp/e etc...but also market orders, contracts, even chatting and everything else.

With TiDi on, you'll get more time to do other stuff while fighting = more requests for the node. Are you planing to counter that ? If not, this will sadly becoming a vicious circle...

Dont' get me wrong, I like the idea, but I hope you get my point (even if my english is so poor)

Why do not dilate spaming delay in channels, orders by minutes etc...?
Endeavour Starfleet
#226 - 2011-10-12 23:53:33 UTC
They have already stated they will monitor the situation as it is tested and deployed. There will be more requests but not in a linear fashion. If I order my missiles to fire. I do not have to spam the command anymore even at high Tidi.
irishbros Kanjus
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#227 - 2011-10-13 18:16:20 UTC  |  Edited by: irishbros Kanjus
Hi i updated my os to windows 7. Ok so before the update the games was running fine since ive got W7 as soon as i start the game i get little lag spikes/suttering it not anything going on on the screen it even happens when im sitting in empty space nothing around it still happen. #its so annoying that i cant stand it and cant play the game. If any one has any info on a fix i would be glad to hear it . Oh also ive updated all my drivers to newest so cant see it being drivers

Oh btw this lag spike/stuttering only happens for a second or two then stops runs smoth again then will happen around every 10/15 seconds lasting for 1 or 2 seconds after
neur0zen
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#228 - 2011-10-14 05:24:37 UTC
Instead of having 'lag' we gonna have a slower gameplay ? ( lol ? )

Ok it's look like a lot more playable, we will not have to wait 30min to perform a basic action in those kind of fight. (So amazing for a game of spaceships battle...)

But still in an lag feeling ?Ugh
Where is the difference in a player point of view ?

ps : Please try using your modules next time, like shooting your locked target ? or try to warp in/out for example, so we can see if 'our' gunz is working in lag. Not just the fleet in front of you.
GeeShizzle MacCloud
#229 - 2011-10-14 12:17:10 UTC
in the video i wanted to see how bombs and bombers would perform in a high TiDi situation as theyre the ships that suffer the most from dropped requests, but also have the most to gain from TiDi's rebalancing of the battlefield. i had probes fitted (albeit i didnt use em - my bad!) so i didnt fit any torp launchers purely because of fitting restrictions.

the difference in a players perspective is at most something taking you 10 seconds to do in game normally will take you at max 1min 40 seconds to do in the highest TiDi situations, not half an hour or more in a biiiig battle when the server is experiencing "soul crushing lag"

i had been activating my MWD periodically tho, to check its response time.
Cybele Lanier
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#230 - 2011-10-14 14:29:04 UTC
neur0zen wrote:
Instead of having 'lag' we gonna have a slower gameplay ? ( lol ? )

Ok it's look like a lot more playable, we will not have to wait 30min to perform a basic action in those kind of fight. (So amazing for a game of spaceships battle...)

But still in an lag feeling ?Ugh
Where is the difference in a player point of view ?


Again, the difference is that the playing field is level, and everything that you command to happen will happen, though with a bit of a delay. As opposed to how it works now, when battles can often be decided by who gets hit with the most lag or when a node crashes, or when a gun can jam for twenty minutes on some guy who warped out or died half an hour earlier.

"You don't need luck. You need theft things and run."
IIIsun trackerIII
Perkone
Caldari State
#231 - 2011-10-17 09:48:07 UTC
Thumbs up for the effort made so far.
Please leave the camera alone and do not slow it down or intentionally stutter it. The new RGB/pie icon and slower targeting/ship animations indicate how slow things are getting just fine.
Keep it up!
Claire Raynor
NovaGear
#232 - 2011-10-17 16:29:57 UTC
CCP Veritas wrote:
GeeShizzle MacCloud wrote:
not sure if veritas will enjoy this bit of test server tomfoolery but frapsed some stuff done tonight that was interesting and fun when it comes to Time Dilation... hope u guys like btw!

http://youtu.be/qgXp0S0-wPA

I enjoy it enough to quote it up again so more people see it ;)


Well done CCP Veritas!! I bet you are really thrilled with what you've achieved. You and your team! It is a really nice solution. Elegant design is something of beauty. I love the videos people have posted of this new function. It looks really slick! I think it is going to be something other companies will want to copy! Nice. Really nice.

:)
Ranka Mei
TANoshii Incorporated
#233 - 2011-10-22 01:20:30 UTC
The idea is not without merit. Vid seems a bit jittery, though: time not only slows down, but motion appears to be staggering. I hope that's just some odd youtube thingy, and not part of the deal.

-- "All your monies AUR belong to us!" -- CCP
Rasz Lin
#234 - 2011-11-02 17:06:41 UTC
I like how even one of the main game devs computer is STRUGGLING to render couple of hundred dots on a screen.
Rasz Lin
#235 - 2011-11-02 17:10:15 UTC
wicked cheese wrote:
as a long time eve player and having 3-4 years of 0.0 fleet battle lagfests history this is undoubtedly the best solution to lag


Easiest, not best.
Best would be finally implementing MULTITHREADING and abandon 'one sol one node' straight from the 1980s setup.
Chi Ftele
Doomheim
#236 - 2011-11-03 17:20:27 UTC
Rasz Lin wrote:
Best would be finally implementing MULTITHREADING and abandon 'one sol one node' straight from the 1980s setup.


you gotta cut CCP some slack, they're climbing up what is already a mountain of work

you could be all "get a move on ya jerks!", but this slowdown-so-the-server-can-keep-up measure is good in the interim, before multithreading can be put on a realistic schedule

I could have used it back in 2005, back when your ship was fine one minute and gone the next, without nothing apparently happening, or the node just died in 10 seconds hehe

That is all.
Lee Anderson
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#237 - 2011-11-04 10:05:38 UTC
Very Nice video, can't wait to see this go live!! Keep up the good work CCP :)

Welcome to EVE were _fake _ISK and ships rule space! If you care about your "fake" killboard or ships, then please consult your doctor for medications.
Tiger's Spirit
Templars of the Shadows
#238 - 2012-01-15 10:13:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Tiger's Spirit
Yesterday was Tidi activated on Tranquility.
Single 1 system route (gate to gate) was 10 minute long and the lag was present there. Emergency warp, no server response, after log off, i cant log on. 5 minute later i could log in, after 3 minute long black screen. Dont forget, there was just a traveling fleet without fight.
Nothing changed, but every act got ridicuolus long periods.
john roe
BearingPoint
#239 - 2012-01-18 18:27:34 UTC
so... LAG is now called time dilatation?
we had that feature implemented since early beta.
thank you very much.

o/
Zayn Longson
Perkone
Caldari State
#240 - 2012-01-18 19:11:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Zayn Longson
So lets get this straight; the developers spent time developing a "little flashing light" which shows when their server is lagging??

This may be insane, but wouldnt it have been a better idea to spend this time and money on:

1. Adding more servers to the server farm to actually REDUCE the lag, or,

2. Look at sharing out the computational load by using smart coding to have client machines do some of the calculations and return the results, which would ALSO reduce the lag in the first place? Just to give one really simple example - if only one person is in vissible range of the event, why not have THEIR machine, rather than the server, do all the calculations??

The "little light" solution is like finding somone has cut their wrist and rather than trying to fix the problem, put a big neon light above them saying "there is a problem!"