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Which Guns & Ammo for Lvl 4 Mach?
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John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Alliance
#1 - 2012-09-28 18:23:06 UTC
Playing around with a Mach fit in EFT ATM. Going for the 800mm Repeating Artillery.

Can't decide whether to go for T2 guns or Faction guns. Is the T2 ammo better than the Faction ammo? What would be the best ammo type for Guristas?

I have a lot of training in Guns before this even becomes possible, so it's months away, but thought I'd find out what the score is.

TIA.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose
Exploited Engineer
Creatively Applied Violence Inc.
#2 - 2012-09-28 18:38:11 UTC
John Ratcliffe wrote:
Can't decide whether to go for T2 guns or Faction guns. Is the T2 ammo better than the Faction ammo? What would be the best ammo type for Guristas?


Republic Fleet Phased Plasma.

And get T2 guns, unless you're fine with flying an obvious gank magnet.
Gabrielle Lamb
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#3 - 2012-09-28 19:38:40 UTC
Exploited Engineer wrote:
John Ratcliffe wrote:
Can't decide whether to go for T2 guns or Faction guns. Is the T2 ammo better than the Faction ammo? What would be the best ammo type for Guristas?


Republic Fleet Phased Plasma.

And get T2 guns, unless you're fine with flying an obvious gank magnet.


This. unless you're in low / null. There gank magnets are more or less okey cause if you see someone combat probing you just get the **** out of dodge.
Exploited Engineer
Creatively Applied Violence Inc.
#4 - 2012-09-28 20:27:21 UTC
Gabrielle Lamb wrote:
This. unless you're in low / null. There gank magnets are more or less okey cause if you see someone combat probing you just get the **** out of dodge.


Yes, in low/null, you'll be a gank magnet by being in a BS, if not by just being there at all. Smile
Gabrielle Lamb
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#5 - 2012-09-28 21:02:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Gabrielle Lamb
Exploited Engineer wrote:
Gabrielle Lamb wrote:
This. unless you're in low / null. There gank magnets are more or less okey cause if you see someone combat probing you just get the **** out of dodge.


Yes, in low/null, you'll be a gank magnet by being in a BS, if not by just being there at all. Smile


Yeah, but unlike hisec where you have to get used to constantly having massive amounts of people in local (20+ most of the time) as well as having no idea whether someone that is probing is out looking for gank targets or simply a harmless ninja-salvager or explorer. In low on the other hand there's less people in local and as soon as you see combat probes on scanner you simply dock the *BEEP* up and chill out for a while. The increased profits from lowsec LP gains makes up the occasional forced breaks.

And btw, this is said by someone who flies multi billion isk ships, solo in lowsec (and some null as well) on a daily basis. (w/ scout ofc) Personally I always feel more unsafe in hisec then I do in low / null. Ofc in low / null I'm constantly spamming scanner looking for combat probes, and always scouting gate ahead even if the scout is just 20 sec in front of me. But its still an easy solution since if you see a combat probe you more or less always know that you need to get the **** out of dodge. There's no middle ground.

At worst, you loose a scout now and then and very rarely a ship but its still overall worth it.
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy
Caldari State
#6 - 2012-09-28 21:31:35 UTC
John Ratcliffe wrote:
Is the T2 ammo better than the Faction ammo? What would be the best ammo type for Guristas?


With Barrage you only get odd ~30km to your falloff (from 72km to 108km). Like mentioned already use RF PP against Guristas.
Hakaimono
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#7 - 2012-09-29 04:14:18 UTC
Kinetic ammo with Minmatar isn't as good as the others. If a rat is primarily weak against Kinetic, go with the secondary which in the case with Guristas, its Thermal(Phased Plasma).
However, the extra falloff you get with Barrage helps with the lower damage that ammo has and also how Guristas tend to keep range. I use a Vargur and always carry Barrage ammo for anything farther out.

Never get faction guns. T2 or meta if you have fitting issues. Republic Fleet ammo is fantastic, but Machs chew through it at an alarming rate, so if you manage to make enough ISK, go for it.
Verity Sovereign
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#8 - 2012-09-29 17:53:20 UTC
T2 guns... there is simply no reason not to fit them if you have the skills.

Same PG use (sure, they use more CPU, but I don't find my BS fits to be CPU limited)

More damage at weapon spec lvl 3-5.

More ammo flexibility (basically +50% range with Barrage, Barrage is almost as awesome as Scorch)


If we were talking lasers*, then the T2 guns would use 33% more cap than the faction weapons, and there might be a reason to fit them (particularly with tachyon beam fits, where you don't need the long range T2 ammo).
But with projectiles, b going faction you get guns that use just a bit less CPU on a ship that is not CPU limited, at the expense of massive amounts of ISK (making you a gank target), DPS, and ammo flexibility (ie greatly increased damage projection, or close range high damage for autos, or close range, high damage, higher tracking for arty)


*and to some extent hybrids, but the faction blasters are Fubar and have less optimal than T2/ meta 4, unlike every other faction weapon system, and they use as much cap as the meta 4s, unlike lasers, where the faction weapons use even less cap
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#9 - 2012-09-29 20:50:00 UTC
I'd be reluctant to use faction ammo for a PvE Mach, because 7 RoF-bonused Autcannons will guzzle ammo like you wouldn't believe. The Mach works extremely well with T1 ammo. Faction ammo is for 100% damage bonused ships like Marauders and Nightmares. (Or Arty ships)

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
De'Veldrin
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#10 - 2012-10-01 15:12:21 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
I'd be reluctant to use faction ammo for a PvE Mach, because 7 RoF-bonused Autcannons will guzzle ammo like you wouldn't believe. The Mach works extremely well with T1 ammo. Faction ammo is for 100% damage bonused ships like Marauders and Nightmares. (Or Arty ships)


I like the faction ammo for nullsec sites, but I crunched the numbers and I still make decent money on them. I cannot disagree with Malcanis' observation, though - the Mach will chew through ammo of any sort like a fat kid at an all you can eat ice cream buffet.

To give you a basic idea, with RF EMP, it costs me 156,000 ISK (based on market prices) to kill an NPC battleship in my Mach (on average). It costs me 8400 ISK to one-shot a frigate. If the bounties you're receiving on the ships aren't high enough to support that, use the T1 ammo. Like most of Eve, it's a numbers game. You have to understand what the costs versus the benefits are if you want to get ahead.

De'Veldrin's Corollary (to Malcanis' Law): Any idea that seeks to limit the ability of a large nullsec bloc to do something in the name of allowing more small groups into sov null will inevitably make it that much harder for small groups to enter sov null.