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Wasted space

Author
Shepard Wong Ogeko
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#221 - 2012-09-27 04:57:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Shepard Wong Ogeko
Touval Lysander wrote:
Natsett Amuinn wrote:


No timers would indeed be the best thing ever.

For goons.

So let's put in a request for it shall we? If it comes from you guys it'll get more traction.




Our words carry no weight and our votes don't count, so we have no traction.


But if this idea was ever implemented, I am sure that our actions would generate a swift response.
Ghazu
#222 - 2012-09-27 05:00:05 UTC
Touval Lysander wrote:
Ghazu wrote:
Touval Lysander wrote:
Natsett Amuinn wrote:


No timers would indeed be the best thing ever.

For goons.

So let's put in a request for it shall we? If it comes from you guys it'll get more traction.


no your idea is dumb.


Quote:
Many 1 liner responses (predominately by Goons strangely) show a complete lack of appreciation and respect for any debate, even if you don't agree with the content.

Read Lord Zim's posts it has already been discussed why your idea is dumb.
Now tell me about chewing through struture HPs

http://www.minerbumping.com/ lol what the christ https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2299984#post2299984

Touval Lysander
Zero Wine
#223 - 2012-09-27 05:03:16 UTC
Shepard Wong Ogeko wrote:
Touval Lysander wrote:
Natsett Amuinn wrote:


No timers would indeed be the best thing ever.

For goons.

So let's put in a request for it shall we? If it comes from you guys it'll get more traction.




Our words carry no weight and our votes don't count, so we have no traction.


But if this idea was every implemented, I am sure that our actions would generate a swift response.

And really. to TL;DR the entire Goon response in this thread.

Do nothing. Goons will win.
Do something. Goons will win.

So wtf is it such a problem for Goons? You are the only 0.0 response on the thread!!

Bring it. What's gonna change?

"I've always been mad, I know I've been mad, like the most of us...very hard to explain why you're mad, even if you're not mad..."

Natsett Amuinn
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#224 - 2012-09-27 05:07:43 UTC
Touval Lysander wrote:
Shepard Wong Ogeko wrote:
Touval Lysander wrote:
Natsett Amuinn wrote:


No timers would indeed be the best thing ever.

For goons.

So let's put in a request for it shall we? If it comes from you guys it'll get more traction.




Our words carry no weight and our votes don't count, so we have no traction.


But if this idea was every implemented, I am sure that our actions would generate a swift response.

And really. to TL;DR the entire Goon response in this thread.

Do nothing. Goons will win.
Do something. Goons will win.

So wtf is it such a problem for Goons? You are the only 0.0 response on the thread!!

Bring it. What's gonna change?

Why are you avoiding Ghazu's question?

Defending a system doesn't make it used. Use means the system has some point when it's not being attacked.
Touval Lysander
Zero Wine
#225 - 2012-09-27 05:15:25 UTC
Natsett Amuinn wrote:
Touval Lysander wrote:
Shepard Wong Ogeko wrote:
Touval Lysander wrote:
Natsett Amuinn wrote:


No timers would indeed be the best thing ever.

For goons.

So let's put in a request for it shall we? If it comes from you guys it'll get more traction.




Our words carry no weight and our votes don't count, so we have no traction.


But if this idea was every implemented, I am sure that our actions would generate a swift response.

And really. to TL;DR the entire Goon response in this thread.

Do nothing. Goons will win.
Do something. Goons will win.

So wtf is it such a problem for Goons? You are the only 0.0 response on the thread!!

Bring it. What's gonna change?

Why are you avoiding Ghazu's question?

Defending a system doesn't make it used. Use means the system has some point when it's not being attacked.

I haven't avoided Ghazu's question because the same question has been asked 100 times already and I have argued my stance and POV the whole time.

You've said I'm wrong. Fine. I'm saying your wrong. If "Ghazu" wants to blow wind out of his ass then that's his call. Not mine.

But answer MY question. Why you guys even bothering to shoot it down and slap me around if it's soo stupid an idea it won't even get traction?

Why bother? If I'm being metagamed out of it. Tough. I'm broad shouldered enough to NGAF. But I will retain my right to respond in a thread I started. I'm obliged to.

"I've always been mad, I know I've been mad, like the most of us...very hard to explain why you're mad, even if you're not mad..."

Ghazu
#226 - 2012-09-27 05:19:31 UTC
Touval Lysander wrote:

I haven't avoided Ghazu's question because the same question has been asked 100 times already and I have argued my stance and POV the whole time.

You've said I'm wrong. Fine. I'm saying your wrong. If "Ghazu" wants to blow wind out of his ass then that's his call. Not mine.

But answer MY question. Why you guys even bothering to shoot it down and slap me around if it's soo stupid an idea it won't even get traction?

Why bother? If I'm being metagamed out of it. Tough. I'm broad shouldered enough to NGAF. But I will retain my right to respond in a thread I started. I'm obliged to.

No you haven't.
First you wanted to blow up structures in one go, we said no because of game-wide ramifications.
You want to disrupt production, which you already can by reinforcing, yet you continue to whine.

http://www.minerbumping.com/ lol what the christ https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2299984#post2299984

Touval Lysander
Zero Wine
#227 - 2012-09-27 05:27:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Touval Lysander
Ghazu wrote:
Touval Lysander wrote:

I haven't avoided Ghazu's question because the same question has been asked 100 times already and I have argued my stance and POV the whole time.

You've said I'm wrong. Fine. I'm saying your wrong. If "Ghazu" wants to blow wind out of his ass then that's his call. Not mine.

But answer MY question. Why you guys even bothering to shoot it down and slap me around if it's soo stupid an idea it won't even get traction?

Why bother? If I'm being metagamed out of it. Tough. I'm broad shouldered enough to NGAF. But I will retain my right to respond in a thread I started. I'm obliged to.

No you haven't.
First you wanted to blow up structures in one go, we said no because of game-wide ramifications.
You want to disrupt production, which you already can by reinforcing, yet you continue to whine.


1) Yes I have.
2) Correct. Game-wide ramifications. THAT's exactly what I am asking for.
3) I cannot because when I come back on the timer obvious is obvious. (and the disruption is how long? n stront long.)
4) Yes. I continue to whine because you can't get a grasp on the obvious (see 3).

You guys have even said it yourself. This plan wouldn't work because Goons would win everything. I might agree.

But you can do that WITHOUT making changes. YOU guys said that too.

Now it's your turn: So why put so much effort into poo-pooing it as a possible game changer?

"I've always been mad, I know I've been mad, like the most of us...very hard to explain why you're mad, even if you're not mad..."

Natsett Amuinn
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#228 - 2012-09-27 05:31:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Natsett Amuinn
Touval Lysander wrote:
Quote:

Why are you avoiding Ghazu's question?

Defending a system doesn't make it used. Use means the system has some point when it's not being attacked.

I haven't avoided Ghazu's question because the same question has been asked 100 times already and I have argued my stance and POV the whole time.

You've said I'm wrong. Fine. I'm saying your wrong. If "Ghazu" wants to blow wind out of his ass then that's his call. Not mine.

But answer MY question. Why you guys even bothering to shoot it down and slap me around if it's soo stupid an idea it won't even get traction?

Why bother? If I'm being metagamed out of it. Tough. I'm broad shouldered enough to NGAF. But I will retain my right to respond in a thread I started. I'm obliged to.

What part of, nothing you've suggested or complained about would make things easier or put smaller alliances on equal footing with larger ones.

Smaller alliances shouldn't be on equal footing. Why do you have this idea that sov mechanics should be "fair for all". If you can't figure out how to do what goons did, using the same mechanics goons had, then that's your problem and not a fault of the game.

No mechanic will make you work better with others, be more organized, learn to use diplomacy, or stop being ****. If you're **** before the mechanic, then you'll be **** after the mechanic. Nothing will make you a better player but you.

However, is quite clear from reading your posts that you aren't smart enough to be a better player. Unfortunetly CCP can't help you with that.


Current mechanics do not benefit goons. No timers would. Your suggestions would make it harder for small corps and alliances. To say nothing of the fact that people would evenually die from boredom due to having to sit on gate camps 23/7.

The need for 24 hour defense of a system does not benefit small groups. You have to be really, really, REALLY stupid to not understand that. I've said this over, and over, and over; so what does that make you?
Shepard Wong Ogeko
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#229 - 2012-09-27 05:34:24 UTC
Touval Lysander wrote:


So wtf is it such a problem for Goons? You are the only 0.0 response on the thread!!

Bring it. What's gonna change?


Because you started this whole thing about shooting down our butter producing POSes in our less traveled systems. So you get a response from us. Why is this a surprise?
Ghazu
#230 - 2012-09-27 05:37:55 UTC
What you get depends on effort. If you drive-by reinforce the pos once, yeah you only get to disrupt for as long as the stront timer, what more do you want?

Because this is a game, and people need to sleep and work. Getting all your stuff blown up while you are logged off is stupid. So the compromise is to have some timers so you have at least 24 hours to organize.

http://www.minerbumping.com/ lol what the christ https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2299984#post2299984

Touval Lysander
Zero Wine
#231 - 2012-09-27 05:44:44 UTC
Natsett Amuinn wrote:
The need for 24 hour defense of a system does not benefit small groups. You have to be really, really, REALLY stupid to not understand that. I've said this over, and over, and over; so what does that make you?

I KNOW that. I've said this over, and over, and over.

If I make PRODUCTION MODE POS's vulnerable I CAN MAKE YOU SIT ON A GATECAMP for 24/7.

OR you can lock it down and make nothing. Which part of this haven't YOU got?

"Small groups of people" WHO DO NOT WANT SOV CAN **** ON YOU. Which part of this haven't YOU got?

"Small groups of people" WHO DO WANT SOV can PAY "Small groups of people" to **** ON YOU. Which part of this haven't YOU got?

"Small groups of people" can be PAID to **** ON YOU JUST COS THEY CAN. Which part of this haven't YOU got?


Currently, ANY interruption to production is n(stront) o'clock. You blueball, rep and you're back on. Which part of this haven't YOU got?

Production needs to be vulnerable. You CANNOT be everywhere. Which part of this haven't YOU got?

Now come up with a DIFFERENT question already!



"I've always been mad, I know I've been mad, like the most of us...very hard to explain why you're mad, even if you're not mad..."

Natsett Amuinn
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#232 - 2012-09-27 05:44:47 UTC
Ghazu wrote:
What you get depends on effort. If you drive-by reinforce the pos once, yeah you only get to disrupt for as long as the stront timer, what more do you want?

Because this is a game, and people need to sleep and work. Getting all your stuff blown up while you are logged off is stupid. So the compromise is to have some timers so you have at least 24 hours to organize.

Not to mention, even if you can, who the **** would want to.

Only an absolute idiot would think that it would be fun to be forced to sit at a gate 23/7 to protect your systems. When something like 10-15% of your immediate group of players is online at any give time, it would mean that pretty much everyone that is online in your corp would be required to sit on a gate.



Natsett Amuinn
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#233 - 2012-09-27 05:45:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Natsett Amuinn
Touval Lysander wrote:
Natsett Amuinn wrote:
The need for 24 hour defense of a system does not benefit small groups. You have to be really, really, REALLY stupid to not understand that. I've said this over, and over, and over; so what does that make you?

I KNOW that. I've said this over, and over, and over.

If I make PRODUCTION MODE POS's vulnerable I CAN MAKE YOU SIT ON A GATECAMP for 24/7.

OR you can lock it down and make nothing. Which part of this haven't YOU got?

"Small groups of people" WHO DO NOT WANT SOV CAN **** ON YOU. Which part of this haven't YOU got?

"Small groups of people" WHO DO WANT SOV can PAY "Small groups of people" to **** ON YOU. Which part of this haven't YOU got?

"Small groups of people" can be PAID to **** ON YOU JUST COS THEY CAN. Which part of this haven't YOU got?


Currently, ANY interruption to production is n(stront) o'clock. You blueball, rep and you're back on. Which part of this haven't YOU got?

Production needs to be vulnerable. You CANNOT be everywhere. Which part of this haven't YOU got?

Now come up with a DIFFERENT question already!




Yeah, you really are that stupid.

You're complaining about null sec systems being empty, so your solution is to impliment mechanics that would make it even more empty. How in the world are you breathing?

The **** does production PoS's have to do with sov? I don't produce anything in a PoS. How would my production be interupted because someone elses production PoS is shut down?
Touval Lysander
Zero Wine
#234 - 2012-09-27 05:51:50 UTC
Ghazu wrote:
What you get depends on effort. If you drive-by reinforce the pos once, yeah you only get to disrupt for as long as the stront timer, what more do you want?

Because this is a game, and people need to sleep and work. Getting all your stuff blown up while you are logged off is stupid. So the compromise is to have some timers so you have at least 24 hours to organize.

Again. Repeatedly countered. The POS is as good as INVULNERABLE while you sleep but it PRODUCES nothing.

You turn it ON WHEN YOU are able to DEFEND IT. If you can't ever defend it then you can't damn well have it. Trade butter for guns to help the defense whatever but you make the call.

And correct. The reason for timers is because we gotta sleep sometime.

But why? Because NO POS DEFENSE IN IT"S CURRENT FORM IS CAPABLE OF STOPPING AN ATTACK of ANY reasonable size. I could even DS a POS in current form and won't can't stop an attack.


>> Now gimme a POS that can and let ME work out what I do with it. <<

"I've always been mad, I know I've been mad, like the most of us...very hard to explain why you're mad, even if you're not mad..."

Natsett Amuinn
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#235 - 2012-09-27 05:54:08 UTC
Touval Lysander wrote:
Ghazu wrote:
What you get depends on effort. If you drive-by reinforce the pos once, yeah you only get to disrupt for as long as the stront timer, what more do you want?

Because this is a game, and people need to sleep and work. Getting all your stuff blown up while you are logged off is stupid. So the compromise is to have some timers so you have at least 24 hours to organize.

Again. Repeatedly countered. The POS is as good as INVULNERABLE while you sleep but it PRODUCES nothing.

You turn it ON WHEN YOU are able to DEFEND IT. If you can't ever defend it then you can't damn well have it. Trade butter for guns to help the defense whatever but you make the call.

And correct. The reason for timers is because we gotta sleep sometime.

But why? Because NO POS DEFENSE IN IT"S CURRENT FORM IS CAPABLE OF STOPPING AN ATTACK of ANY reasonable size. I could even DS a POS in current form and won't can't stop an attack.


>> Now gimme a POS that can and let ME work out what I do with it. <<

Care to explain what a PoS has to do with sov?
Touval Lysander
Zero Wine
#236 - 2012-09-27 05:54:45 UTC
Natsett Amuinn wrote:
Ghazu wrote:
What you get depends on effort. If you drive-by reinforce the pos once, yeah you only get to disrupt for as long as the stront timer, what more do you want?

Because this is a game, and people need to sleep and work. Getting all your stuff blown up while you are logged off is stupid. So the compromise is to have some timers so you have at least 24 hours to organize.

Not to mention, even if you can, who the **** would want to.

Only an absolute idiot would think that it would be fun to be forced to sit at a gate 23/7 to protect your systems. When something like 10-15% of your immediate group of players is online at any give time, it would mean that pretty much everyone that is online in your corp would be required to sit on a gate.




Oh lordy lordy.

EXACTLY. So if you are NOT prepared to "sit on the gate" then switch your POS from "PRODUCE" to "DEFEND" and go kill some miners for fun.

When you ARE ready to camp the gate (whatever) turn it on and make some money.

"I've always been mad, I know I've been mad, like the most of us...very hard to explain why you're mad, even if you're not mad..."

Ghazu
#237 - 2012-09-27 05:54:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Ghazu
Touval Lysander wrote:
Ghazu wrote:
What you get depends on effort. If you drive-by reinforce the pos once, yeah you only get to disrupt for as long as the stront timer, what more do you want?

Because this is a game, and people need to sleep and work. Getting all your stuff blown up while you are logged off is stupid. So the compromise is to have some timers so you have at least 24 hours to organize.

Again. Repeatedly countered. The POS is as good as INVULNERABLE while you sleep but it PRODUCES nothing.

You turn it ON WHEN YOU are able to DEFEND IT. If you can't ever defend it then you can't damn well have it. Trade butter for guns to help the defense whatever but you make the call.

And correct. The reason for timers is because we gotta sleep sometime.

But why? Because NO POS DEFENSE IN IT"S CURRENT FORM IS CAPABLE OF STOPPING AN ATTACK of ANY reasonable size. I could even DS a POS in current form and won't can't stop an attack.


>> Now gimme a POS that can and let ME work out what I do with it. <<

No because that is just convuluted and ball busting.
You need to elaborate on your pos produce/defend modes concept I would like to have some details before I can shite on it some more.

if a pos is on produce you can destroy it in one go?
if a pos is on defense mode timer rules kick in?
is there a cooldown switching modes?

http://www.minerbumping.com/ lol what the christ https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2299984#post2299984

Natsett Amuinn
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#238 - 2012-09-27 05:58:40 UTC
WTF does a PoS have to do with sov?

WTF does a PoS have to do with "wasted space"?

WTF does a PoS have to do with you not getting shot when flying through a system?

WTF does a PoS have to do with defending your systems?

WTF do PoS's have to do with allowing smaller groups to claim sov?
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#239 - 2012-09-27 06:03:23 UTC
Hey guys

what if the NULLSEC BLOB napFEST space rules were changed so that Cascade Imminent could OWN AND BEAT THE CFC?

whats the matter

U SCARED?
Ghazu
#240 - 2012-09-27 06:04:54 UTC
Nicolo, really?

http://www.minerbumping.com/ lol what the christ https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2299984#post2299984