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Bookmark naming and organization – how do you do it?
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Terrorfrodo
Interbus Universal
#1 - 2012-09-19 11:35:40 UTC
One thing that annoys me to no end is how corpmates and allies name the corp bookmarks and how they are (not) organized. I'd be interested to learn what methods other wormhole people use to organize their intel.

I'm not talking about folks who only scan in their home system and maybe their static. I'd be interested to know how the people do it who scan a dozen systems every day or even a hundred. What BM naming convention do you use? How many folders? Any external tools like a google spreadsheet or chain mapper?

The best I've come up with so far is using the wormnav chain mapper for an overview of how systems are connected, use a google spreadsheet to keep track of what signatures are in the systems and what they are, then name BMs in game so that every WH bookmark shows what system locus it leads to. But everyone else refuses to adhere to this because they think it's too complicated, so we always end up with a mess of unorganized bookmarks.

.
Gumby Ambraelle
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2012-09-19 11:54:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Gumby Ambraelle
The most important thing for a corp is that there is an agreed upon standard for naming and storing BM's

You do not want to have a crisis and corpmates unable to find the person in crisis in time because the book marks are all fouled up. Having a consistent naming convention and storage location also allows everyone in the corp to be able to determine the status of the w-space in a very quick time. It allows them to see what has been scanned and what has not, and where they need to scan. It prevents duplication of effort.

We use the ingame bulletin board and consuistent BM's and within 2 min of login I can tell what the status of our space is, what our routes are, who our neighbors are, and how active things have been in te recent past. This saves us a great deal of time and effort for all in the corp.

we scan the entire chain each time a new wh appears.

We store the BM is a folder that is only for route information... how to get to the various points in a chain. We also use wormnav to update chain information. We use the bulletin board to annotate the Coprs residing in the various locations along the map and our consisten naming convention allows us to look at names and figure out how far from home each system is. We have a seperate folder for out of date BM's as we see some of the same locations from time to time and it gives us a reference point for previous visits.

There are many ways to accomplish these task, the biggest thing is everyone has to agree to a standard and then use that standard
Ashimat
Clandestine Services
#3 - 2012-09-19 12:01:07 UTC
Quote:
But everyone else refuses to adhere to this because they think it's too complicated, so we always end up with a mess of unorganized bookmarks.

Change corp/alliance.

Got blog: http://thecloakedones.blogspot.com
Terrorfrodo
Interbus Universal
#4 - 2012-09-19 12:03:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Terrorfrodo
Using a folder just for wormhole BM's is a good idea. Keep it coming Lol

You're right that the most important part is that there is a standard and everyone sticks to it. Unfortunately this never really worked with us because many people are just too lazy and don't care... people who are otherwise not dumb or bad at EVE. Am I just unlucky in my friends? I'd assume that most corps have this problem. Even people who are somewhat trying to use the standard often slip up and make naming mistakes because they don't care enough to properly memorize how it should be done.

And just sticking to a standard is not actually so great if the standard sucks. I was 'forced' under a corp standard that is imho not very good and I'm complying with it, but I get more annoyed with it every day. I think I may just establish my own personal standard for my private bookmarks, but this is hardly a perfect solution...


Ashimat wrote:
Quote:
But everyone else refuses to adhere to this because they think it's too complicated, so we always end up with a mess of unorganized bookmarks.

Change corp/alliance.

So you think my proposed method is good? Maybe I can convince people if I come up with something even better/easier, that's why I started this thread.

Changing corp is hard if you've known all the people for years, some of them even in RL ;-)

.
Gumby Ambraelle
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2012-09-19 12:19:57 UTC
Terrorfrodo wrote:
Using a folder just for wormhole BM's is a good idea. Keep it coming Lol

You're right that the most important part is that there is a standard and everyone sticks to it. Unfortunately this never really worked with us because many people are just too lazy and don't care... people who are otherwise not dumb or bad at EVE. Am I just unlucky in my friends? I'd assume that most corps have this problem. Even people who are somewhat trying to use the standard often slip up and make naming mistakes because they don't care enough to properly memorize how it should be done.

And just sticking to a standard is not actually so great if the standard sucks. I was 'forced' under a corp standard that is imho not very good and I'm complying with it, but I get more annoyed with it every day. I think I may just establish my own personal standard for my private bookmarks, but this is hardly a perfect solution...


Ashimat wrote:
Quote:
But everyone else refuses to adhere to this because they think it's too complicated, so we always end up with a mess of unorganized bookmarks.

Change corp/alliance.

So you think my proposed method is good? Maybe I can convince people if I come up with something even better/easier, that's why I started this thread.

Changing corp is hard if you've known all the people for years, some of them even in RL ;-)



Suggest a change in the corporate structure, make it something that is easy to follow. put together a series of instructions and examples to show how this will assist in finding routes quicker.

We also use seperate folders for Anoms and sis.

The BM process should be almost the same for an anom as a wh so that there is less to remember

The important info is the date, location, identifier, time if appropriate

couple of examples


19 | Home -> C2a | ABC


19 | C2a Ladar Site | Forgotten Perimiter | DEF | Activated 2130

19 | Home -> Lowsec | BBC | K162 EOL 2215

this gives the date, the location and the destination C2a is used as a designation for a c2 that is one jump from home C2b would be a c2 that is 2 jumps from home The anom is idetified by three letter designator and type of anom as well as the activation time.
The bulletin board would contain the details for example

if you have a c4b and a c5c as well as a c3b and lowsec out of the c5 the bulletin board would give the route info. This can also be tracked in wormnav.

in the BB you could list this as Home -> C2a -> C3b and Home to C4a->C4b-C5c->Lowsec

this allows someone to check the BB abd see the avail routes and the BM will show what was scanned and what sitll needs scanning

Again, there are many ways to do this, it is important that the corp all agree on one and stick with it, other wise as the previous poster said... it may be time to find a new corp
Efraya
V0LTA
New Eden Alliance 99013733
#6 - 2012-09-19 12:25:37 UTC
Folder: Home Sites
Folder: Home Chain
Folder: Old Chain (Deleted every 2 days or so)

Folder:Target Chain

c5y > Hs
c5y > c6x
c6x > c5y
c6x > Home
Home > c6x
Home > c6s
c6s > home
c6s > c5a
c5a > c6s
c5a> lsa
c5a > nsa
c5a > nsb

That's it, anything that is in a chain site's wise just goes in the chain folder.

[b][center]WSpace; Dead space.[/center] [center]Lady Spank for forum mod[/center][/b]
Terrorfrodo
Interbus Universal
#7 - 2012-09-19 12:38:40 UTC
That's it? How do you keep track of what was in the 'c5y' and where it is located relative to the home system? What players live there who may provide pvp later, what signatures are there, what was scanned and what wasn't?

.
Irya Boone
The Scope
#8 - 2012-09-19 12:46:28 UTC
I am not in this alliance but you should take a look to talocan United site for thèse matter

CCP it's time to remove Off Grid Boost and Put Them on Killmail too, add Logi on killmails .... Open that damn door !!

you shall all bow and pray BoB
Matt Ellis
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#9 - 2012-09-19 13:24:17 UTC
Surely having Time and Date in the bookmark string is redundant, seeing as though the bookmark will only display a certain length in the Contextual Menu? Again, slightly pointless seeing as you have to load up people and places to see the extra information, and that has an exact time stamp.

For me, Daily Folders work just fine, with a strict policy on how to bookmark. E.g. ABC - WH/[combat sig type] - [Wormhole Destination/Site Name]. That, and a connected group of players, and you dont need to read up yourself as to what is where. Your corpmates will tell you when you log in.
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2012-09-19 13:24:52 UTC
We use a fairly simple setuip.

For folders we have corp folders for

Sigs (in home system)
Anoms (in home system)
Chains (for other systems)

For naming conventions it is generally:


Non wormhole sigs and anoms:
Sig ID 3 letter code Sig name

Ex: FRP Frontier barracks

For Ladar's and gravs a "*" is put at the end to signify it has been "activated" and the sleeper spawn cleared

Ex: AAG Minor Frontier Reservior*

For Wormhole signatures it is a bit similar but some differences.

Wormholes when possible we try to give more information in the bookmark when we can.

IE

RAP WH U210 inactive (static, inactive if you know it hasn't been warped to yet)
FRP WH U210 2145 (activated at 2145 eve time)
CRP WH k162 UK (dang UK, Dead UK, 0.0, etc) to indicate the nature of the k162

For the other side of a WH, the original sig is put in parenthesis so they can be quickly matched to each other. Since you need to bookmark that side before you scan down that system, or in some cases you dont bother (such as a WH exit to k-space) you won't know it's actual sig ID. If it is later scanned its sig ID goes at the end.

(RAP) WH k162 Systemname

For more detailed info, we use Wormhole space. In it we can put notes about a system (inhabitants etc) which is usually just an evewho link.
Efraya
V0LTA
New Eden Alliance 99013733
#11 - 2012-09-19 13:31:51 UTC
Terrorfrodo wrote:
That's it? How do you keep track of what was in the 'c5y' and where it is located relative to the home system? What players live there who may provide pvp later, what signatures are there, what was scanned and what wasn't?


We use a chain mapper tool.

Try siggy
Contact: Messoroz

That will track that stuff

[b][center]WSpace; Dead space.[/center] [center]Lady Spank for forum mod[/center][/b]
Terrorfrodo
Interbus Universal
#12 - 2012-09-19 13:43:53 UTC
I tried to register for Siggy, but I get stuck on the "select character" step, because no character is displayed to select. Maybe the registration only works in the IGB, will try again when I'm home...

Matt Ellis wrote:
That, and a connected group of players, and you dont need to read up yourself as to what is where. Your corpmates will tell you when you log in.

You expect people to brief you on all 20 systems that were scanned that day when you come online? And to do it again every time someone else logs on? I got the feeling your corp is rather one of those who only scan their home.

.
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2012-09-19 13:58:27 UTC
Terrorfrodo wrote:
I tried to register for Siggy, but I get stuck on the "select character" step, because no character is displayed to select. Maybe the registration only works in the IGB, will try again when I'm home...

Matt Ellis wrote:
That, and a connected group of players, and you dont need to read up yourself as to what is where. Your corpmates will tell you when you log in.

You expect people to brief you on all 20 systems that were scanned that day when you come online? And to do it again every time someone else logs on? I got the feeling your corp is rather one of those who only scan their home.


Also try wormhole space. It's free. It may not have all the features of Siggy (never tried it) but its pretty decent.
Casirio
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2012-09-19 14:29:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Casirio
Yes a chain mapper tool is what you need. Siggy or something similar. Scanning chains without it is like holding a match in a dark hallway. With it, it's like turning on the lights. Maybe not the best metaphor, but thats how I felt when I first used a chain mapper tool.
Efraya
V0LTA
New Eden Alliance 99013733
#15 - 2012-09-19 14:45:49 UTC
Terrorfrodo wrote:
I tried to register for Siggy, but I get stuck on the "select character" step, because no character is displayed to select. Maybe the registration only works in the IGB, will try again when I'm home...

Matt Ellis wrote:
That, and a connected group of players, and you dont need to read up yourself as to what is where. Your corpmates will tell you when you log in.

You expect people to brief you on all 20 systems that were scanned that day when you come online? And to do it again every time someone else logs on? I got the feeling your corp is rather one of those who only scan their home.


You need to pay for it.

[b][center]WSpace; Dead space.[/center] [center]Lady Spank for forum mod[/center][/b]
Matt Ellis
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#16 - 2012-09-19 15:04:49 UTC
Terrorfrodo wrote:
I tried to register for Siggy, but I get stuck on the "select character" step, because no character is displayed to select. Maybe the registration only works in the IGB, will try again when I'm home...

Matt Ellis wrote:
That, and a connected group of players, and you dont need to read up yourself as to what is where. Your corpmates will tell you when you log in.

You expect people to brief you on all 20 systems that were scanned that day when you come online? And to do it again every time someone else logs on? I got the feeling your corp is rather one of those who only scan their home.


I don't expect it, we just do it. People will log on, and important information will be shared. We also use the Corp chat MOTD to show this aswell.

And no, we don't JUST scan our home system. what would be the point in that? Might as well live in K-Space!

I was merely pointing out that huge spreadsheets arent exactly necessary in my situation. Alot of wormholes arent really worth noting, imo...
Syn Fatelyng
Redanni
#17 - 2012-09-19 15:15:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Syn Fatelyng
We have 3 corp bookmark folders.

Bookmark format is: Probe ID - Classification - Name

For Sites, G = Grav, M = Mag, R = Radar, L = Ladar.

For Wormholes, H = highsec, L = lowsec, N = nullsec, W = wspace

Sites:

  • FPR-151 - G - Exceptional Core Deposit
  • AFG-910 - M - Forgotten Frontier Recursive Depot
  • ROA-559 - R - Unsecured Frontier Database
  • PDA-315 - L - Barren Perimeter Reservoir

Wormholes:

  • GQK-420 - H - Paara
  • TED-882 - L - Hier
  • BLP-614 - N - EC-P8R
  • AFG-910 - W - J100195

Stations:

  • Elysium Tower
  • Elysium Industry
  • Elysium Scout Safe


We update all systems once a day for the new probe IDs after DT, excluding all the half an hour checks for new sites or wormholes. Putting the probe ID in the bookmark has made quick work of knowing what's new and what is old, especially for people logging in and out.
Terrorfrodo
Interbus Universal
#18 - 2012-09-19 15:23:12 UTC
Ok no real revelations so far, people do it similar to us, though most methods are a little too crude for my taste ;)

Now I want this Siggy thing, it seems to be perfect for my needs. Hopefully they don't charge an arm and a leg, because I guess at least initially I'll have to pay for it all by myself... Roll

.
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#19 - 2012-09-19 15:24:45 UTC
Terrorfrodo wrote:
Ok no real revelations so far, people do it similar to us, though most methods are a little too crude for my taste ;)

Now I want this Siggy thing, it seems to be perfect for my needs. Hopefully they don't charge an arm and a leg, because I guess at least initially I'll have to pay for it all by myself... Roll


I think its mostly an arm or a leg.
Casirio
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#20 - 2012-09-19 16:17:44 UTC
Terrorfrodo wrote:
Ok no real revelations so far, people do it similar to us, though most methods are a little too crude for my taste ;)

Now I want this Siggy thing, it seems to be perfect for my needs. Hopefully they don't charge an arm and a leg, because I guess at least initially I'll have to pay for it all by myself... Roll


It is worth it. It's the revelation you are looking for.. Although we use a different program but very similar.
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