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[Updated][Winter] Missile Rebalance 2.0 + Hurricane tweak

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TKL HUN
Jugis Modo Utopia
#5961 - 2012-11-09 21:25:01 UTC
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
TKL HUN wrote:
Dear CCP,

I trained 2 alts to fly a tengu, for mission and complex/anom running.

Half a year on both accs - cruiser lvl5, subsystems lvl5, missile skills + the other skills needed.

I would like to ask only 1 question:

Will you let me reallocate these skill points which are WASTED with the coming missile nerf?

I really hope so...

Thanks!

Nope. The SP isn't wasted unless you choose to waste it by not using it, in which case that isn't CCP's fault. HML's and the tengu are still very usable.


Really?

Did you try it on the test server?

1. -10% damage
2. 10-20% exposion velocity nerf
3. 12% explosion radius nerf
4. 15% velocity nerf

etc etc...

All in one 30% damage nerf for cruiser sized and more damage nerf for frig sized targets.

Just do the math with the radiuses and the target speeds, sig radiuses etc etc....

We tried it, and well.... No comment
MIrple
Black Sheep Down
Tactical Narcotics Team
#5962 - 2012-11-09 21:29:25 UTC
serras bang wrote:

as you have said a minor kin hole witch is 40% i bilieve why then bassed on what you have said dont minmatar then have a completely 0% resists to kinetic if they never have to worry about it ? my point being is that certian thing like this dont add up i get that fact that t2 ships are wieghted to there faction rivals so then in turn minmatar should have a 0% kinetic resist ?

and im sure ccp will think og that and possibly give a blanket 40% resist to gall ships on the whole when they get to tech 2 however i would like them to readress the ships resists so that they all add up to the same


I think it works on the idea that you get a 75% bonus to your idea resist so in Mimmys case 75% EM I understand what you are saying with this as Caldari and Gall have the larges holes but Amar also have a pretty even spread on their HAC as well.
serras bang
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#5963 - 2012-11-09 21:31:18 UTC
Bouh Revetoile wrote:
Morrigan LeSante wrote:
Of course not, but to get it to a comparable level as my current CML skills requires quite a few up to 5.

So again, why would I deviate from my current plan "just in case" when a weapon system was lifted out of the gutter? One could just as easily point out that there's nothing stopping turret users training missiles and enjoying the madness that is cruises Blink

Not just in case of a nerf, but because that open you some oportunities ?

How many players do you think have trained Torps only to fly bombers ? I'd rather had a stealth frigate with 3 Neutron Canons instead of these torps, though torps do have their strengths, like no tracking and rather long range.

If your current plan is to master missiles, fine for you, though don't complain you can't do turret things, and don't complain when your weapon system is nerfed because it was OP.

What I mean here is that 1) missiles as a whole will be better than ever, and even HML will still be the best medLR weapon ; 2) missiles are not turrets, so any time you face something you can't do with missiles but you would be able to do with turrets, just consider training turrets, because that's why they exists in the first place.

@serras : caldari shield definitly are superior ; they have NO contender in this field. If you can tank a maelstrom some way, you can tank the rokh the same way, but better. T2 resist may be unfair, as they have their hole pluged (the same goes for amarr), though caldari always have more midslots than minmatar, and there base shield HP are higher, so they are able to compensate for this. As for the missiles, they do are better than turret *for long range combat*. That is the caldari doctrine. Why do you think they kept hybrid guns ? Are they completely stupid ? Or do hybrid guns still retain some qualities despite not being the best in their doctrine ?


never did say that guns were stupid just mainly correcting someone else that said hybrids were the caldari mains witch aint true thats all and the shields was my lil ramble thats all.
MIrple
Black Sheep Down
Tactical Narcotics Team
#5964 - 2012-11-09 21:31:27 UTC
TKL HUN wrote:
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
TKL HUN wrote:
Dear CCP,

I trained 2 alts to fly a tengu, for mission and complex/anom running.

Half a year on both accs - cruiser lvl5, subsystems lvl5, missile skills + the other skills needed.

I would like to ask only 1 question:

Will you let me reallocate these skill points which are WASTED with the coming missile nerf?

I really hope so...

Thanks!

Nope. The SP isn't wasted unless you choose to waste it by not using it, in which case that isn't CCP's fault. HML's and the tengu are still very usable.


Really?

Did you try it on the test server?

1. -10% damage
2. 10-20% exposion velocity nerf
3. 12% explosion radius nerf
4. 15% velocity nerf

etc etc...

All in one 30% damage nerf for cruiser sized and more damage nerf for frig sized targets.

Just do the math with the radiuses and the target speeds, sig radiuses etc etc....

We tried it, and well.... No comment


So your ship is now on par with the other 3 races T3 sounds pretty right to me.
serras bang
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#5965 - 2012-11-09 21:39:36 UTC
MIrple wrote:
serras bang wrote:

as you have said a minor kin hole witch is 40% i bilieve why then bassed on what you have said dont minmatar then have a completely 0% resists to kinetic if they never have to worry about it ? my point being is that certian thing like this dont add up i get that fact that t2 ships are wieghted to there faction rivals so then in turn minmatar should have a 0% kinetic resist ?

and im sure ccp will think og that and possibly give a blanket 40% resist to gall ships on the whole when they get to tech 2 however i would like them to readress the ships resists so that they all add up to the same


I think it works on the idea that you get a 75% bonus to your idea resist so in Mimmys case 75% EM I understand what you are saying with this as Caldari and Gall have the larges holes but Amar also have a pretty even spread on their HAC as well.


not so much of a problem with armarr as they are armour tankers and lets face it an armour repper can be a bi***h to fit.
TKL HUN
Jugis Modo Utopia
#5966 - 2012-11-09 21:39:55 UTC  |  Edited by: TKL HUN
MIrple wrote:
TKL HUN wrote:
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
TKL HUN wrote:
Dear CCP,

I trained 2 alts to fly a tengu, for mission and complex/anom running.

Half a year on both accs - cruiser lvl5, subsystems lvl5, missile skills + the other skills needed.

I would like to ask only 1 question:

Will you let me reallocate these skill points which are WASTED with the coming missile nerf?

I really hope so...

Thanks!

Nope. The SP isn't wasted unless you choose to waste it by not using it, in which case that isn't CCP's fault. HML's and the tengu are still very usable.


Really?

Did you try it on the test server?

1. -10% damage
2. 10-20% exposion velocity nerf
3. 12% explosion radius nerf
4. 15% velocity nerf

etc etc...

All in one 30% damage nerf for cruiser sized and more damage nerf for frig sized targets.

Just do the math with the radiuses and the target speeds, sig radiuses etc etc....

We tried it, and well.... No comment


So your ship is now on par with the other 3 races T3 sounds pretty right to me.


Admit it, caldari ships are .... well I don't want to say it, cuz I'm a gentlemen.

There are 2 useable caldari ships right now: tengu, and falcon.

But let's just think about a HML drake.... my wolf will have more dps than a tier2 bc???

It's a joke.... what else do you want to nerf on caldari?
serras bang
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#5967 - 2012-11-09 21:41:42 UTC  |  Edited by: serras bang
MIrple wrote:
TKL HUN wrote:
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
TKL HUN wrote:
Dear CCP,

I trained 2 alts to fly a tengu, for mission and complex/anom running.

Half a year on both accs - cruiser lvl5, subsystems lvl5, missile skills + the other skills needed.

I would like to ask only 1 question:

Will you let me reallocate these skill points which are WASTED with the coming missile nerf?

I really hope so...

Thanks!

Nope. The SP isn't wasted unless you choose to waste it by not using it, in which case that isn't CCP's fault. HML's and the tengu are still very usable.


Really?

Did you try it on the test server?

1. -10% damage
2. 10-20% exposion velocity nerf
3. 12% explosion radius nerf
4. 15% velocity nerf

etc etc...

All in one 30% damage nerf for cruiser sized and more damage nerf for frig sized targets.

Just do the math with the radiuses and the target speeds, sig radiuses etc etc....

We tried it, and well.... No comment


So your ship is now on par with the other 3 races T3 sounds pretty right to me.


sis test last time it was up on duality with the 2.0 nerf and tbh with my current missle boat wasnt to bad(sept range) and i was useing t2 furry and although yeah cost a few more volleys but didnt kill it ( sept range)
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#5968 - 2012-11-09 21:44:34 UTC
TKL HUN wrote:
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
TKL HUN wrote:
Dear CCP,

I trained 2 alts to fly a tengu, for mission and complex/anom running.

Half a year on both accs - cruiser lvl5, subsystems lvl5, missile skills + the other skills needed.

I would like to ask only 1 question:

Will you let me reallocate these skill points which are WASTED with the coming missile nerf?

I really hope so...

Thanks!

Nope. The SP isn't wasted unless you choose to waste it by not using it, in which case that isn't CCP's fault. HML's and the tengu are still very usable.


Really?

Did you try it on the test server?

1. -10% damage
2. 10-20% exposion velocity nerf
3. 12% explosion radius nerf
4. 15% velocity nerf

etc etc...

All in one 30% damage nerf for cruiser sized and more damage nerf for frig sized targets.

Just do the math with the radiuses and the target speeds, sig radiuses etc etc....

We tried it, and well.... No comment

And yet the tengu is still the best all around PvE T3.

1. Fury only got a 5% damage nerf, Precision got a buff.
2. T1/Faction explosion velocity is the same as before. Precision explosion velocity got a buff.
3. You can always use HAM's to get the old explosion radius, conversely you can use the newly buffed precision for frigs.
4. All HML got a velocity buff, not a nerf.
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#5969 - 2012-11-09 21:49:12 UTC
TKL HUN wrote:

Admit it, caldari ships are .... well I don't want to say it, cuz I'm a gentlemen.

There are 2 useable caldari ships right now: tengu, and falcon.

But let's just think about a HML drake.... my wolf will have more dps than a tier2 bc???

It's a joke.... what else do you want to nerf on caldari?

What is the range on that wolf compared to the drake?
How do the 2 stack up when using HAM's?
TKL HUN
Jugis Modo Utopia
#5970 - 2012-11-09 21:51:33 UTC
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
TKL HUN wrote:
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
TKL HUN wrote:
Dear CCP,

I trained 2 alts to fly a tengu, for mission and complex/anom running.

Half a year on both accs - cruiser lvl5, subsystems lvl5, missile skills + the other skills needed.

I would like to ask only 1 question:

Will you let me reallocate these skill points which are WASTED with the coming missile nerf?

I really hope so...

Thanks!

Nope. The SP isn't wasted unless you choose to waste it by not using it, in which case that isn't CCP's fault. HML's and the tengu are still very usable.


Really?

Did you try it on the test server?

1. -10% damage
2. 10-20% exposion velocity nerf
3. 12% explosion radius nerf
4. 15% velocity nerf

etc etc...

All in one 30% damage nerf for cruiser sized and more damage nerf for frig sized targets.

Just do the math with the radiuses and the target speeds, sig radiuses etc etc....

We tried it, and well.... No comment

And yet the tengu is still the best all around PvE T3.

1. Fury only got a 5% damage nerf, Precision got a buff.
2. T1/Faction explosion velocity is the same as before. Precision explosion velocity got a buff.
3. You can always use HAM's to get the old explosion radius, conversely you can use the newly buffed precision for frigs.
4. All HML got a velocity buff, not a nerf.


I'm really happy that you are satisfied, but I'm not, and I think I'm not alone with this.

Anyway I asked CCP, but I think I won't get an answer.
TKL HUN
Jugis Modo Utopia
#5971 - 2012-11-09 21:53:17 UTC
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
TKL HUN wrote:

Admit it, caldari ships are .... well I don't want to say it, cuz I'm a gentlemen.

There are 2 useable caldari ships right now: tengu, and falcon.

But let's just think about a HML drake.... my wolf will have more dps than a tier2 bc???

It's a joke.... what else do you want to nerf on caldari?

What is the range on that wolf compared to the drake?
How do the 2 stack up when using HAM's?


Who cares about the range if I can get in range with a wolf in 5 seconds (and finish off a drake)?
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#5972 - 2012-11-09 21:58:08 UTC
TKL HUN wrote:
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
TKL HUN wrote:

Admit it, caldari ships are .... well I don't want to say it, cuz I'm a gentlemen.

There are 2 useable caldari ships right now: tengu, and falcon.

But let's just think about a HML drake.... my wolf will have more dps than a tier2 bc???

It's a joke.... what else do you want to nerf on caldari?

What is the range on that wolf compared to the drake?
How do the 2 stack up when using HAM's?


Who cares about the range if I can get in range with a wolf in 5 seconds (and finish off a drake)?


It matters because the drake doesn't need to waste time getting in range. That and an HML drake would still do better against the wolf than a beam harbinger/prophecy or a rail brutix/ferox once the wolf got in range.
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#5973 - 2012-11-09 21:59:04 UTC
TKL HUN wrote:
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
TKL HUN wrote:
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
TKL HUN wrote:
Dear CCP,

I trained 2 alts to fly a tengu, for mission and complex/anom running.

Half a year on both accs - cruiser lvl5, subsystems lvl5, missile skills + the other skills needed.

I would like to ask only 1 question:

Will you let me reallocate these skill points which are WASTED with the coming missile nerf?

I really hope so...

Thanks!

Nope. The SP isn't wasted unless you choose to waste it by not using it, in which case that isn't CCP's fault. HML's and the tengu are still very usable.


Really?

Did you try it on the test server?

1. -10% damage
2. 10-20% exposion velocity nerf
3. 12% explosion radius nerf
4. 15% velocity nerf

etc etc...

All in one 30% damage nerf for cruiser sized and more damage nerf for frig sized targets.

Just do the math with the radiuses and the target speeds, sig radiuses etc etc....

We tried it, and well.... No comment

And yet the tengu is still the best all around PvE T3.

1. Fury only got a 5% damage nerf, Precision got a buff.
2. T1/Faction explosion velocity is the same as before. Precision explosion velocity got a buff.
3. You can always use HAM's to get the old explosion radius, conversely you can use the newly buffed precision for frigs.
4. All HML got a velocity buff, not a nerf.


I'm really happy that you are satisfied, but I'm not, and I think I'm not alone with this.

Anyway I asked CCP, but I think I won't get an answer.

You already have your answer on the OP.
Bouh Revetoile
In Wreck we thrust
#5974 - 2012-11-09 22:00:30 UTC
TKL HUN wrote:
Admit it, caldari ships are .... well I don't want to say it, cuz I'm a gentlemen.

There are 2 useable caldari ships right now: tengu, and falcon.

But let's just think about a HML drake.... my wolf will have more dps than a tier2 bc???

It's a joke.... what else do you want to nerf on caldari?

Hum... Maybe use short range weapon ? I know, terrible, how could anyone use a weapon with less than 50km range ?! Completely insane and surreal !
TKL HUN
Jugis Modo Utopia
#5975 - 2012-11-09 22:02:36 UTC
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
TKL HUN wrote:
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
TKL HUN wrote:

Admit it, caldari ships are .... well I don't want to say it, cuz I'm a gentlemen.

There are 2 useable caldari ships right now: tengu, and falcon.

But let's just think about a HML drake.... my wolf will have more dps than a tier2 bc???

It's a joke.... what else do you want to nerf on caldari?

What is the range on that wolf compared to the drake?
How do the 2 stack up when using HAM's?


Who cares about the range if I can get in range with a wolf in 5 seconds (and finish off a drake)?


It matters because the drake doesn't need to waste time getting in range. That and an HML drake would still do better against the wolf than a beam harbinger/prophecy or a rail brutix/ferox once the wolf got in range.


Did u calculated in the ROF of the HML? But anyway, more drake kills for me in frigates or cruisers.
TKL HUN
Jugis Modo Utopia
#5976 - 2012-11-09 22:04:09 UTC
Bouh Revetoile wrote:
TKL HUN wrote:
Admit it, caldari ships are .... well I don't want to say it, cuz I'm a gentlemen.

There are 2 useable caldari ships right now: tengu, and falcon.

But let's just think about a HML drake.... my wolf will have more dps than a tier2 bc???

It's a joke.... what else do you want to nerf on caldari?

Hum... Maybe use short range weapon ? I know, terrible, how could anyone use a weapon with less than 50km range ?! Completely insane and surreal !


Mate, I used a pulse legion for running missions before I started to train my alts, so I know short range.

And as I said, I don't care about the range.
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#5977 - 2012-11-09 22:05:06 UTC
TKL HUN wrote:
Did u calculated in the ROF of the HML? But anyway, more drake kills for me in frigates or cruisers.

ROF won't matter because the other 4 ships won't reliably hit a competent wolf pilot in his chosen engagement range when fitted with LR weapons.
serras bang
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#5978 - 2012-11-09 22:29:15 UTC
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
TKL HUN wrote:
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
TKL HUN wrote:
Dear CCP,

I trained 2 alts to fly a tengu, for mission and complex/anom running.

Half a year on both accs - cruiser lvl5, subsystems lvl5, missile skills + the other skills needed.

I would like to ask only 1 question:

Will you let me reallocate these skill points which are WASTED with the coming missile nerf?

I really hope so...

Thanks!

Nope. The SP isn't wasted unless you choose to waste it by not using it, in which case that isn't CCP's fault. HML's and the tengu are still very usable.


Really?

Did you try it on the test server?

1. -10% damage
2. 10-20% exposion velocity nerf
3. 12% explosion radius nerf
4. 15% velocity nerf

etc etc...

All in one 30% damage nerf for cruiser sized and more damage nerf for frig sized targets.

Just do the math with the radiuses and the target speeds, sig radiuses etc etc....

We tried it, and well.... No comment

And yet the tengu is still the best all around PvE T3.

1. Fury only got a 5% damage nerf, Precision got a buff.
2. T1/Faction explosion velocity is the same as before. Precision explosion velocity got a buff.
3. You can always use HAM's to get the old explosion radius, conversely you can use the newly buffed precision for frigs.
4. All HML got a velocity buff, not a nerf.


fury hml tengus explosive rad only raises by about 10 not a killer by any means.
Bouh Revetoile
In Wreck we thrust
#5979 - 2012-11-09 23:03:18 UTC
TKL HUN wrote:
Bouh Revetoile wrote:
TKL HUN wrote:
Admit it, caldari ships are .... well I don't want to say it, cuz I'm a gentlemen.

There are 2 useable caldari ships right now: tengu, and falcon.

But let's just think about a HML drake.... my wolf will have more dps than a tier2 bc???

It's a joke.... what else do you want to nerf on caldari?

Hum... Maybe use short range weapon ? I know, terrible, how could anyone use a weapon with less than 50km range ?! Completely insane and surreal !


Mate, I used a pulse legion for running missions before I started to train my alts, so I know short range.

And as I said, I don't care about the range.

Well, so have you ever heard about HAM ? You know, it's missiles, like HML, but short range, like pulse, but like if beams where HML. Have you ever used beams ? I'm pretty sure you still prefer HML above beams...
Spc One
The Chodak
Void Alliance
#5980 - 2012-11-09 23:22:16 UTC
Bouh Revetoile wrote:

Well, so have you ever heard about HAM ? You know, it's missiles, like HML, but short range, like pulse, but like if beams where HML. Have you ever used beams ? I'm pretty sure you still prefer HML above beams...

Zealot with t-2 beams and T-2 AMMO gets 92km range and if you fit some tracking computers and enhancers you get like 125km range on a T-2 CRUISER.
Roll