Player Features and Ideas Discussion

You forget the other ships that use Heavy Missiles, those are going to be hit hard as well. They never had any dominance either.

CCP is applying a terrible blanket nerf.

You're suggesting that the shorter range, higher DPS, faction HML ammo should be able to be projected consistently farther than the falloff of most the other long-range turret platforms?

I completely understand comparing apples to apples - but the problem is that a shorter range, high DPS ammo is outclassing falloff ranges on long-range turret platforms. The purpose of the graph wasn't to make a direct comparison, is was to highlight this specific imbalance.

Are you suggesting that missiles should be instant damage?

Not empty quoting.

WTF!!!!!!!!

This is a bit ridiculous, heavy missiles were the only missiles that were viable for PvP now there are no missies except torps on bombers.

This nerf is too extreme it should be small changes, like a 5-10% nerf and then see how it is, then nerf more if there still considered OP.

What is the justification for nerfing heavies anyway? Is it because they are too strong in PvE? If people were worried about drake blobs its just gonna be some other kind of blob in nullsec. heavy missiles were a way that alowed smaller groups to take on larger groups through kiting, skill etc rather than just F1 the primary in alphabetical order, all this encourages is a different kind of blob.

And in wormholes the effects are even worse, currently its armor T3's and guardians everyware, there were a few viable shield ships that relied on heavy missiles, shield ships basically just got deleted from wormholes.

No, not really. I'm just pointing out the many advantages missiles have had to offset the fact that they are not instant damage. I would certainly agree that there's a lot of variables in motion here to be considered.

ITT people who don't realize that HMLs are still the best medium sized long range weapons.

When you said, "bringing heavy missiles in line with other long range cruiser weapons" did you have beam lasers in mind?

Because you've turned Heavy Missiles into the new Railguns. Bottom of the barrel here, we're going to. Now if HMLs only lost maybe 5% of their damage, but kept their -25% current range like you propose, that'd probably be ok. But this change is reducing a fifth of their current damage output from them. That's kind of significant. Unless you're going to boost their RoF to try and compensate slightly (for maybe a net 5 or 10 percent loss in damage output), which I don't think is going to happen.

It doesn't seem like you guys are very good at balancing things. If something is too effective you don't take your tools to it and chisel away, reshaping the role and powers of a ship, which is generally a rational approach.

You take a sledgehammer, and you smash out the metaphorical legs of the construction, and leave the wreck of what could've still been something decent to rot.

That's Caldari medium missile platforms right now. I'm fully aware that you can still boost the range back to how it was before. But this is at the cost of now utterly **** poor DPS compared to other long range weapon systems. The problem with the Drake wasn't sheer damagedealing potential. It was damage projection. Which isn't something you fix by making the damage that they project nearly irrelevant compared to other weapon systems. So now the Drake is going to have average at best defensive capabilities, but utterly awful offense.

So with this horribad blanket nerf you've thrown over Caldari, you've axed the Caracal's ability to strike at things it's own size or larger (somehow I don't think it's going to be that great with HAMs), the entire Caldari HAC lineup is overwhelmingly useless for a multitude of reasons, the Nighthawk? Oh well.

Why not just remove Caldari from the game? It's not like they're going to have much of a presence after all is said and done anyways. Unless you guys somehow manage to make the Moa and Ferox truly awe inspiring in a balanced fashion.

With the plethora of evidence you've submitted to support this claim, I don't know how we could ever have doubted this. Thank you, Roime, for helping us all see the clear light of day.

no but they should still be the highest dps... but not by that much...

20% might be to harsh... perhaps 15% would be better...

but look at advantages for missiles

damage selection...

no decrease of damage over range

sure it has delayed damage but thats ok....

its just td's are now kind of OP and should have thier base bonus reduced...

i would reduce base bonus on TD to 15% for falloff optimal range and tracking...

but inkind i would increase the bonus on amarr special ships to 10% to compensate...

that way TD will be good but only on amarr special EW ships...