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Crime & Punishment

 
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The reality of the goon freighter ganking in Uedema and neighboring systems.

First post
Author
Seminole Sun
Hell's Librarians
#361 - 2012-09-20 17:19:45 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:


Posted before. Stay under 2 bill and no wraps on your stuff and you will avoid most gank. It can still happen tho...


The quality of high sec pilots is rather telling given that 18 pages in and they still do not understand this very simple concept.


The fact people still ask for it in this very thraed prove people can't read. I personally posted it at lest 3 time now ans some people pointed out it was pretty much right. Too lazy to read a thread, too lazy to not auto-pilot across a 0.5 I guess...


Someone posted math that then multiple people indicated was wrong. I was just curious what the right math is. I lack a sufficient knowledge base to do it myself and its an awful lot of stuff that's poorly documented.
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#362 - 2012-09-20 17:32:22 UTC
Seminole Sun wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:


Posted before. Stay under 2 bill and no wraps on your stuff and you will avoid most gank. It can still happen tho...


The quality of high sec pilots is rather telling given that 18 pages in and they still do not understand this very simple concept.


The fact people still ask for it in this very thraed prove people can't read. I personally posted it at lest 3 time now ans some people pointed out it was pretty much right. Too lazy to read a thread, too lazy to not auto-pilot across a 0.5 I guess...


Someone posted math that then multiple people indicated was wrong. I was just curious what the right math is. I lack a sufficient knowledge base to do it myself and its an awful lot of stuff that's poorly documented.


An aproximate cost in ship to kill a freighter was listed in this thread. It's probably not a 100% perfect value but it's something recent. The wrap rule was also explained in this thread.
PI Maker
Doomheim
#363 - 2012-09-20 17:48:00 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:


Posted before. Stay under 2 bill and no wraps on your stuff and you will avoid most gank. It can still happen tho...


The quality of high sec pilots is rather telling given that 18 pages in and they still do not understand this very simple concept.


The fact people still ask for it in this very thraed prove people can't read. I personally posted it at lest 3 time now ans some people pointed out it was pretty much right. Too lazy to read a thread, too lazy to not auto-pilot across a 0.5 I guess...

Its not that they can't read, its that they don't want to read your crappy posts.

This thread is all about you, baby
Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#364 - 2012-09-20 18:04:25 UTC
Dan Carter Murray wrote:
I don't think anyone here has actually played WoW.

Yes, use rapier to insta warp freighters.

No, goons don't recruit adults.

No, goons aren't "good" at pvp.

Yes, goons have a few think tank corps that come up with clever ways to make isk.

No, nothing interesting happens in nullsec.


lol so bitter, sorry you got scammed

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar

Tom Gerard
Glorious Nation of Kazakhstan
#365 - 2012-09-20 18:08:30 UTC
Andski wrote:
Dan Carter Murray wrote:
I don't think anyone here has actually played WoW.

Yes, use rapier to insta warp freighters.

No, goons don't recruit adults.

No, goons aren't "good" at pvp.

Yes, goons have a few think tank corps that come up with clever ways to make isk.

No, nothing interesting happens in nullsec.


lol so bitter, sorry you got scammed



Bitter like a recently nerfed Caldari, or a soon to be nerfed Winmatar=P

Now with 100% less Troll.

Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#366 - 2012-09-20 18:08:45 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Gun Gal wrote:
Amazing
Justifying exploitable offenses, no risk vs reward, recyclable characters

Eve has come a long way, but its still going down the toilet due to you *******.


Point out the exploit.


The no risk part too please.


there's plenty of risk in suicide ganking, you just chalk it up to an "accepted cost" because you want to frame the argument your way

sorry you lost all of your isk in a freighter

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar

Tom Gerard
Glorious Nation of Kazakhstan
#367 - 2012-09-20 18:12:49 UTC
Andski wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Gun Gal wrote:
Amazing
Justifying exploitable offenses, no risk vs reward, recyclable characters

Eve has come a long way, but its still going down the toilet due to you *******.


Point out the exploit.


The no risk part too please.


there's plenty of risk in suicide ganking, you just chalk it up to an "accepted cost" because you want to frame the argument your way

sorry you lost all of your isk in a freighter


They should really nerf Caldari freighters along with their combat ships.

Now with 100% less Troll.

Mara Tessidar
Perkone
Caldari State
#368 - 2012-09-20 18:21:53 UTC
It's like CCP sat down at a meeting and asked themselves "Why is anyone still flying Caldari and what can we do to stop this?"
Tom Gerard
Glorious Nation of Kazakhstan
#369 - 2012-09-20 18:24:04 UTC
Mara Tessidar wrote:
It's like CCP sat down at a meeting and asked themselves "Why is anyone still flying Caldari and what can we do to stop this?"


Certainly feels like it =)

Now with 100% less Troll.

baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#370 - 2012-09-20 18:29:35 UTC
Tom Gerard wrote:


They should really nerf Caldari freighters along with their combat ships.


The caldari freighter looks like an aircraft carrier yet you cant land any fighters on it. I'd say thats nerf enough.
Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#371 - 2012-09-20 18:31:41 UTC
guys I have the best joke ever

a viable caldari ship

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar

Samahiel Sotken
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#372 - 2012-09-20 18:33:11 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:

Someone posted math that then multiple people indicated was wrong. I was just curious what the right math is. I lack a sufficient knowledge base to do it myself and its an awful lot of stuff that's poorly documented.


The math was largely correct, the numbers he was using are out of date. It boils down to anything less than 5 billion will probably be ignored unless the Pirate is bored, already made enough that day to cover his loses, or personally doesn't like you/your name/your corp/your bio.
Mara Tessidar
Perkone
Caldari State
#373 - 2012-09-20 18:40:22 UTC
Andski wrote:
guys I have the best joke ever

a viable caldari ship


leave my ibis alone
Seminole Sun
Hell's Librarians
#374 - 2012-09-20 18:43:00 UTC
Samahiel Sotken wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:

Someone posted math that then multiple people indicated was wrong. I was just curious what the right math is. I lack a sufficient knowledge base to do it myself and its an awful lot of stuff that's poorly documented.


The math was largely correct, the numbers he was using are out of date. It boils down to anything less than 5 billion will probably be ignored unless the Pirate is bored, already made enough that day to cover his loses, or personally doesn't like you/your name/your corp/your bio.


Thank you... that answers my question. The way people responded I was concerned he was off by an order of magnitude or something. It still seems like a T3 booster shadowing the freighter would wreak some real havoc on their numbers.
Kalchak
Polaris Rising
Goonswarm Federation
#375 - 2012-09-20 18:45:53 UTC
1) Stop loading freights with insane value cargoes.
2) Stop jumping into systems with recent spates of ship kills.
3) CCP fix bumping.

Of all the issues here the only one that really qualifies for a complaint is the use of ships to bump the target out of alignment, essentially becoming a warp disruptor without actually having to lock a target. No risk to the pilot, yet you can basically stop a freighter in its tracks all day.

Maybe CCP need to look at allowing the mass of a vessel to dictate how much it can be nudged off course by smaller ships (if at all).

Apart from that, be more aware of your surroundings, don't load your life into a freighter.

Hell use an ORCA :P I hear they make good transport ships these days.
Tom Gerard
Glorious Nation of Kazakhstan
#376 - 2012-09-20 18:50:51 UTC
Kalchak wrote:
1) Stop loading freights with insane value cargoes.
2) Stop jumping into systems with recent spates of ship kills.
3) CCP fix bumping.

Of all the issues here the only one that really qualifies for a complaint is the use of ships to bump the target out of alignment, essentially becoming a warp disruptor without actually having to lock a target. No risk to the pilot, yet you can basically stop a freighter in its tracks all day.

Maybe CCP need to look at allowing the mass of a vessel to dictate how much it can be nudged off course by smaller ships (if at all).

Apart from that, be more aware of your surroundings, don't load your life into a freighter.

Hell use an ORCA :P I hear they make good transport ships these days.


Once again you think CCP could FIX something without nerfing something... let me tell you how it will go down bro.

CCP will disable bumping for all ships.
CCP will place a hard cap on ISK value in a cargo hold, RP it as some CONCORD sanction.
CCP will prevent autopilot from jumping into systems with any pvp activity, so you'll have to sit at your PC from now on.

Now with 100% less Troll.

Seminole Sun
Hell's Librarians
#377 - 2012-09-20 19:03:08 UTC
Tom Gerard wrote:
Kalchak wrote:
1) Stop loading freights with insane value cargoes.
2) Stop jumping into systems with recent spates of ship kills.
3) CCP fix bumping.

Of all the issues here the only one that really qualifies for a complaint is the use of ships to bump the target out of alignment, essentially becoming a warp disruptor without actually having to lock a target. No risk to the pilot, yet you can basically stop a freighter in its tracks all day.

Maybe CCP need to look at allowing the mass of a vessel to dictate how much it can be nudged off course by smaller ships (if at all).

Apart from that, be more aware of your surroundings, don't load your life into a freighter.

Hell use an ORCA :P I hear they make good transport ships these days.


Once again you think CCP could FIX something without nerfing something... let me tell you how it will go down bro.

CCP will disable bumping for all ships.
CCP will place a hard cap on ISK value in a cargo hold, RP it as some CONCORD sanction.
CCP will prevent autopilot from jumping into systems with any pvp activity, so you'll have to sit at your PC from now on.


C'mon now... that's not even a good straw man attempt. The quote SPECIFICALLY said only #3 was a valid complaint (and I agree). It's clearly a zero risk item and would be (in ANY other game) considered an exploit / griefing. I think the ONLY reason it has remained is that it used to be (still is??) a critical component for Titan "tackling" because they couldn't be tackled by subcaps. The other two are obvious and no CCP action is necessary.

Frankly, the bumping issue also gets to a broader complaint of collision geometry being borked. Anyone's who's gotten inadvertently tangled in that reindeer antler looking collidable that shows up in missions sometimes knows what I'm talking about. I'd be all for just eliminated collisions altogether. I think they add very little to game play while being an endless source of frustration (my first rage-quit was a result of losing a hulk in null-sec because I was stuck for 5 minutes in a roid. The guy who killed me actually DIDN'T fire for a good minute while we chatted about how screwed the geometry was while my ship flapped around like a fish on dry land. Nicest gank I've ever been a part of ;)
Glary Crazy
Empyrean Warriors
#378 - 2012-09-20 19:15:55 UTC
Posting in a terrible thread.
Malphilos
State War Academy
Caldari State
#379 - 2012-09-20 19:33:48 UTC
Andski wrote:
there's plenty of risk in suicide ganking, you just chalk it up to an "accepted cost" because you want to frame the argument your way


The downside is completely limited. It is in fact a fixed cost and must be accepted or the process can't happen. One might argue that it turns the "don't fly what you can't afford to lose" rule on it's head as the loss is intended as a cost of business.

You can't lose more than you intend or "accept", unless you're a complete flipping idiot and fail to understand the concept of "suicide". It's all potential upside.

Risk mitigation at it's finest.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#380 - 2012-09-20 19:35:40 UTC
Malphilos wrote:
Andski wrote:
there's plenty of risk in suicide ganking, you just chalk it up to an "accepted cost" because you want to frame the argument your way


The downside is completely limited. It is in fact a fixed cost and must be accepted or the process can't happen. One might argue that it turns the "don't fly what you can't afford to lose" rule on it's head as the loss is intended as a cost of business.

You can't lose more than you intend or "accept", unless you're a complete flipping idiot and fail to understand the concept of "suicide". It's all potential upside.

Risk mitigation at it's finest.


You forgot the loot gods and they are a fickle bunch.