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NULL whiners mantra is getting tedious... and CSM lacks HI SEC representation

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Author
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#761 - 2012-09-05 00:26:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Frying Doom wrote:
Maa Ku wrote:
What is that stat?

Number of players, num of accounts, active accounts, characters, time spent in game, current location at a point in time or average time spent ?
Number of people playing specific characters at a specific time.
No. Number of characters in any sec-category at the time of data poll. It does not count people in any way, shape, or form.

Quote:
I am sorry did I pick up the wrong piece of information?
Hard to tell. You didn't provide a source. So what is your source?

Quote:
So like many games with so many people ignoring the forums how do you expect people to follow what is going on in them?
Because they are fed the information without going to the forums.

Quote:
Well here is a fact baseless claim, CCP increased the amount it sent to the populous on the CSM and voting numbers increased.
Source?
Karl Hobb
Imperial Margarine
#762 - 2012-09-05 00:36:18 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:
You can't get people who don't give a **** to give a **** just because you nag them more.

Quoting because this is the fact that keeps getting ignored.

A professional astro-bastard was not available so they sent me.

Inquisitor Kitchner
The Executives
#763 - 2012-09-05 00:43:28 UTC
Alekseyev Karrde wrote:
I skipped over a lot of this thread but I get the gist that we need to do something big to get empire players involved in the process.

On an unrelated matter of concern specific to our 0.0 constituents, the CSM has had much success in our efforts to get CCP to remove the asteroid belts and agents from highsec. We're also trying to get CCP to increase the ISK/hour in 0.0 by actually giving 0.0 players some free ISK every hour but there may be some technical reasons why that can't happen.

We'll keep at it.



CSM troll Best troll.


DarthNefarius wrote:


You forgot to mention CSM7's influence in successfully moving Incursions from HI to NULL next patch but then again besides the cheering on of the decimation of Incursion communities in thier minutes CSM7's silence has been deafening there.


Since everyone in Null is like "LOL incursions" moving it to Null would have literally 0 effect on us.


betoli wrote:

I think thats 100% true. Its also why some of us suggested different electoral models Big smile



Please, tell me more about your suggested electoral models and I will single-handedly tear the theory behind using it apart. Democracy is totally rubbish as it doesn't do anything it claims to do, the only reason its the best form of government is because it is better than everything else.

Unless you have invented a new form of electoral system entirely (in which case PM me with details) they are all bound to fail to do what you want it to do anyway.

"If an injury has to be done to a man it should be so severe that his vengeance need not be feared." - Niccolo Machiavelli

Sabrina Solette
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#764 - 2012-09-05 00:56:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Sabrina Solette
Karl Hobb wrote:
Lord Zim wrote:
You can't get people who don't give a **** to give a **** just because you nag them more.

Quoting because this is the fact that keeps getting ignored.



Very true.

But it's the reasons they don't give a **** that people dispute.


Some reasons below:

They don't know the candidates.

They feel the candidates standing won't represent their interests.

They won't vote because they don't see the CSM system as fair of useful and hence don't want to validate the elections by voting.

Because the candidates have a vested interest in the game and as such are highly likely to put their own interests first.

They don't think that they'll stay playing the game long enough to even care who gets elected.

...
Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#765 - 2012-09-05 01:03:07 UTC
Sabrina Solette wrote:
They don't know the candidates.

All the candidates had written introductions of what they stood for, and iirc there was a page somewhere which compared your standpoint to each candidate to guesstimate which would be the best fit for you.

Sabrina Solette wrote:
They feel the candidates standing won't represent their interests.

Very little CCP can do to fix this.

Sabrina Solette wrote:
They won't vote because they don't see the CSM system as fair of useful and hence don't want to validate the elections by voting.

Very little CCP can do to fix this, since this won't be fixed by saying "this is A Useful Thing", it must be proven.

Sabrina Solette wrote:
Because the candidates have a vested interest in the game and as such are highly likely to put their own interests first.

Very little CCP can do to fix this, the only thing which'll remove this doubt is seeing the candidates in action.

Sabrina Solette wrote:
They don't think that they'll stay playing the game long enough to even care who gets elected.

Very little CCP can do to fix this.

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat

Sabrina Solette
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#766 - 2012-09-05 01:16:36 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:
Sabrina Solette wrote:
They don't know the candidates.

All the candidates had written introductions of what they stood for, and iirc there was a page somewhere which compared your standpoint to each candidate to guesstimate which would be the best fit for you.


...and of course people that stand for elections always, but always follow through on their election promises.



Sabrina Solette
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#767 - 2012-09-05 01:17:25 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:
Sabrina Solette wrote:
They feel the candidates standing won't represent their interests.

Very little CCP can do to fix this.

Sabrina Solette wrote:
They won't vote because they don't see the CSM system as fair of useful and hence don't want to validate the elections by voting.

Very little CCP can do to fix this, since this won't be fixed by saying "this is A Useful Thing", it must be proven.

Sabrina Solette wrote:
Because the candidates have a vested interest in the game and as such are highly likely to put their own interests first.

Very little CCP can do to fix this, the only thing which'll remove this doubt is seeing the candidates in action.

Sabrina Solette wrote:
They don't think that they'll stay playing the game long enough to even care who gets elected.

Very little CCP can do to fix this.


Of course CCP can fix this, by removing the CSMs and the system of elections.
Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#768 - 2012-09-05 01:18:27 UTC
Sabrina Solette wrote:
Lord Zim wrote:
Sabrina Solette wrote:
They don't know the candidates.

All the candidates had written introductions of what they stood for, and iirc there was a page somewhere which compared your standpoint to each candidate to guesstimate which would be the best fit for you.


...and of course people that stand for elections always, but always follow through on their election promises.

Very little CCP can do to fix this.

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat

Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#769 - 2012-09-05 01:20:43 UTC
Sabrina Solette wrote:
Of course CCP can fix this, by removing the CSMs and the system of elections.

"I can fix your broken leg by chopping it off."

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat

Selinate
#770 - 2012-09-05 01:20:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Selinate
You know, this reminds me of another game I've just restarted recently called Dark Souls. It shares a bit of it's style with Eve where it's fairly unforgiving.

However, when it first came out, the players got all in a hissy fit over just how unforgiving it really was. The game was literally next to impossible to beat. I had to cheat to beat several parts of it, it was just that freakishly hard. The rub? The players complained enough and they made it easier. They gave out humanity (one of the secondary resources in the game) like candy, make a lot of the monsters much easier to kill, changed various aspects of it to make it easier, etc. In many ways, they also essentially ruined the game because you cherished those little bits of progress. The other issue was that they had a cheat in there where you could essentially get max level near-instantly, and never got rid of the players who used that cheat, ergo PvP is a bit of a joke with a level 900 beating on a level 2 player (and other factors added in that essentially ruins PvP in that game), but I digress.

The point is, I think Eve should instead be made more difficult for everyone. Make all resources more scarce. Make it so concord responds much slower and can be destroyed. Etc. Etc. Then again, so many people invest so much of their lives into Eve, I know this would never happen (which I think is kind of sad. You really shouldn't invest that much in an MMO that doesn't really give anything back).

For the fun of the game. The saddest part that people need to realize is that low sec isn't hard to live in, and 0.0 isn't hard to visit. Living in null can be rather tough on your own since the npc stations are typically infested with pirates, but it's still possible. I see a lot of people claiming that soloers should join a corp. Quite frankly, I don't like most of the ******* in Eve, ergo I most often choose to play solo. But still, It's definitely not difficult to live in either, just learn the tips and tricks at how to dodge PvP that you know you'll lose or that you don't want, make isk by exploring (or mining, if you're really that desperate), and go about your business. Hell, if you're ambitious, you can even try building a POS. It's more fun out there anyway, god knows living in High Sec is essentially like playing Dark Souls and just staying at the firelink shrine the entire time. It loses it's fun.

I don't care if that was somewhat incoherent. I'm tired. **** all of you. I just want my new tengu so I can try something new and venture out into null and see what fun I can have.
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
#771 - 2012-09-05 01:41:30 UTC  |  Edited by: DarthNefarius
Tippia wrote:
Frying Doom wrote:
Maa Ku wrote:
What is that stat?

Number of players, num of accounts, active accounts, characters, time spent in game, current location at a point in time or average time spent ?
Number of people playing specific characters at a specific time.
No. Number of characters in any sec-category at the time of data poll. It does not count people in any way, shape, or form.


According to the last QEN the total number of characters could be arrived fairly closey by the number of accounts * 2.
Dunno if anything has changed in the number of characters per account being around a steady 2 ( main & a single alt )
You get 1 vote per account
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
Koba Kyogen
Kiwis In Space
Dock Workers
#772 - 2012-09-05 01:45:51 UTC
Y'all don't deserve representation.

You have no skin in the game. No blood on the mat.

If Manifest Destiny was left up to you guys - we'd have been ****ed.



Null only survives as long as they run CSM - and hopefully CSM remains relevent to CCP decision making. Otherwise it's the slow roll towards Hello Kitty Incursion Island.


This is like my seventh post ever. I hate you.


Koba
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
#773 - 2012-09-05 01:49:08 UTC  |  Edited by: DarthNefarius
Inquisitor Kitchner wrote:

DarthNefarius wrote:


You forgot to mention CSM7's influence in successfully moving Incursions from HI to NULL next patch but then again besides the cheering on of the decimation of Incursion communities in thier minutes CSM7's silence has been deafening there.


Since everyone in Null is like "LOL incursions" moving it to Null would have literally 0 effect on us.

.


That is bull crap I knew a few in NULL that were running them until the Escalation NERF ABSOLUTELY WIPED THEM OUT
I think if Mittani was still on the CSM he may have paid some attention to it since a few of his constituants were affected.
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#774 - 2012-09-05 01:54:47 UTC
DarthNefarius wrote:
According to the last QEN the total number of characters could be arrived fairly closey by the number of accounts * 2.
…and we have no data about number of accounts per person (to say nothing about distribution of character and of accounts) so it tells us nothing about people.
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
#775 - 2012-09-05 01:57:13 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:
Sabrina Solette wrote:
Of course CCP can fix this, by removing the CSMs and the system of elections.

"I can fix your broken leg by chopping it off."


The CSM if not representing the entire playerbase it can become a gangrene which may require the limb to be sawed off anyways.
I tend to think a certain limb was sawn off after last fanfest a little too quickly but its liable to regrow next election unless something major happens. Blink
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
Sabrina Solette
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#776 - 2012-09-05 01:59:36 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:
Sabrina Solette wrote:
Of course CCP can fix this, by removing the CSMs and the system of elections.

"I can fix your broken leg by chopping it off."



But if a broken leg can't be fixed it might have to be removed.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#777 - 2012-09-05 02:02:31 UTC
Sabrina Solette wrote:
Lord Zim wrote:
Sabrina Solette wrote:
Of course CCP can fix this, by removing the CSMs and the system of elections.

"I can fix your broken leg by chopping it off."

But if a broken leg can't be fixed it might have to be removed.

I don't know if you're trying to make some sort of reference to gangrene and ...

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#778 - 2012-09-05 02:03:35 UTC
DarthNefarius wrote:
The CSM if not representing the entire playerbase it can become a gangrene which may require the limb to be sawed off anyways.
…and thus we arrive right back at the fundamental question: is anything wrong with the current representation?

Sabrina Solette wrote:
But if a broken leg can't be fixed it might have to be removed.
Is it broken? If so, how?
Corina Jarr
en Welle Shipping Inc.
#779 - 2012-09-05 02:05:21 UTC
Sabrina Solette wrote:
Lord Zim wrote:
Sabrina Solette wrote:
Of course CCP can fix this, by removing the CSMs and the system of elections.

"I can fix your broken leg by chopping it off."



But if a broken leg can't be fixed it might have to be removed.

A broken leg (if it is in fact only broken) can always be fixed. May need massive amounts of surgery and artificial restructure, but removal is never needed for a break.


Now the infection, thats another story.
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
#780 - 2012-09-05 02:07:57 UTC  |  Edited by: DarthNefarius
Tippia wrote:


Sabrina Solette wrote:
But if a broken leg can't be fixed it might have to be removed.
Is it broken? If so, how?


WELL IT SURE IS LEANING TO ONE SIDE!!!Attention
And I think I've caught a whiff of something that smelled last fanfest but it was too early to say gangrene before it was cut of IMHO.
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'