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NULL whiners mantra is getting tedious... and CSM lacks HI SEC representation

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Author
Frying Doom
#661 - 2012-09-04 11:51:18 UTC
Muad 'dib wrote:
I was in high sec, i did missions, missions got boring, went to low sec, made much more isk, started to pvp, now i only pvp.

Problem is like THE WARCRAFT people like to just make isk to buy plex/make isk better.

I say problem, but really its what they like to do. So how about having a special mission once in a while with a huge reward that cant be done solo, sort of like a double reward lvl 5 mission in low sec (like once in a while hauling missions), something to temp them out and gather some friends. That sort of stuff? a dash of incursions if you will.

Personally never been much of a group, mission person myself but I know some people already do that on lvl 4's and with so many people having multiple accounts it would not make much difference.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!

Cutter Isaacson
DEDSEC SAN FRANCISCO
#662 - 2012-09-04 11:59:51 UTC
Wow, are you still harping on about this?

There is something you need to be educated on I think. The difference between capability and willingness. Everyone is capable of learning, not everyone is willing. So unless you are going to literally go to peoples houses and force them to read up on the CSM and then force them to vote, all your "WE MUST EDUCATE THE MASSES" and "PEOPLE MUST VOTE" speeches are worth precisely zero.

Now can you please go find something else for your life to be about?

"The truth is usually just an excuse for a lack of imagination." Elim Garak.

Muad 'dib
The Nine Nine
#663 - 2012-09-04 12:02:34 UTC
i wonder if ccp could pull it some stats for us to paw over, things like players in high that have never been to low sec or null etc.

might be a good lead for the brainstormer's to come up with something.

Cosmic signature detected. . . . http://i.imgur.com/Z7NfIS6.jpg I got 99 likes, and this post aint one.

Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#664 - 2012-09-04 12:05:30 UTC
Muad 'dib wrote:
i wonder if ccp could pull it some stats for us to paw over, things like players in high that have never been to low sec or null etc.

might be a good lead for the brainstormer's to come up with something.

That wouldn't be as interesting as getting actual numbers of how many hisec characters are alts of null/lowsec people.

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat

Frying Doom
#665 - 2012-09-04 12:05:44 UTC
Cutter Isaacson wrote:
Wow, are you still harping on about this?

There is something you need to be educated on I think. The difference between capability and willingness. Everyone is capable of learning, not everyone is willing. So unless you are going to literally go to peoples houses and force them to read up on the CSM and then force them to vote, all your "WE MUST EDUCATE THE MASSES" and "PEOPLE MUST VOTE" speeches are worth precisely zero.

Now can you please go find something else for your life to be about?

So what your saying is that unless you threaten people they don't learn, that might explain the schools system these days but Just like schools we should not give up because it is hard. If anything the fact that is a challenge should drive us forward not make us apathetic.

Good to see you expressing your opinion, now we just need to get more people to express theirs by voting.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!

Frying Doom
#666 - 2012-09-04 12:07:35 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:
Muad 'dib wrote:
i wonder if ccp could pull it some stats for us to paw over, things like players in high that have never been to low sec or null etc.

might be a good lead for the brainstormer's to come up with something.

That wouldn't be as interesting as getting actual numbers of how many hisec characters are alts of null/lowsec people.

Would be nice to have some solid statistics like that.

Might mean that studying their general play styles, more might be done to want them to move out.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!

Muad 'dib
The Nine Nine
#667 - 2012-09-04 12:12:13 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:
Muad 'dib wrote:
i wonder if ccp could pull it some stats for us to paw over, things like players in high that have never been to low sec or null etc.

might be a good lead for the brainstormer's to come up with something.

That wouldn't be as interesting as getting actual numbers of how many hisec characters are alts of null/lowsec people.


i like it!

Interesting account/char stats please ccp :D

Cosmic signature detected. . . . http://i.imgur.com/Z7NfIS6.jpg I got 99 likes, and this post aint one.

Cutter Isaacson
DEDSEC SAN FRANCISCO
#668 - 2012-09-04 12:29:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Cutter Isaacson
Frying Doom wrote:
Cutter Isaacson wrote:
Wow, are you still harping on about this?

There is something you need to be educated on I think. The difference between capability and willingness. Everyone is capable of learning, not everyone is willing. So unless you are going to literally go to peoples houses and force them to read up on the CSM and then force them to vote, all your "WE MUST EDUCATE THE MASSES" and "PEOPLE MUST VOTE" speeches are worth precisely zero.

Now can you please go find something else for your life to be about?

So what your saying is that unless you threaten people they don't learn, that might explain the schools system these days but Just like schools we should not give up because it is hard. If anything the fact that is a challenge should drive us forward not make us apathetic.

Good to see you expressing your opinion, now we just need to get more people to express theirs by voting.



Ok so you are just trolling then. Since I made it very very clear what I meant.


Cutter Isaacson wrote:
Everyone is capable of learning, not everyone is willing.



Which part of that do I need to explain more carefully?

"The truth is usually just an excuse for a lack of imagination." Elim Garak.

Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#669 - 2012-09-04 12:32:35 UTC
Frying Doom wrote:
now we just need to get more people to express theirs by voting.

We have. 16.6% (or whatever) gave a distinct vote, the remainder abstained.

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat

Frying Doom
#670 - 2012-09-04 12:47:49 UTC
Cutter Isaacson wrote:
Frying Doom wrote:
Cutter Isaacson wrote:
Wow, are you still harping on about this?

There is something you need to be educated on I think. The difference between capability and willingness. Everyone is capable of learning, not everyone is willing. So unless you are going to literally go to peoples houses and force them to read up on the CSM and then force them to vote, all your "WE MUST EDUCATE THE MASSES" and "PEOPLE MUST VOTE" speeches are worth precisely zero.

Now can you please go find something else for your life to be about?

So what your saying is that unless you threaten people they don't learn, that might explain the schools system these days but Just like schools we should not give up because it is hard. If anything the fact that is a challenge should drive us forward not make us apathetic.

Good to see you expressing your opinion, now we just need to get more people to express theirs by voting.



Ok so you are just trolling then. Since I made it very very clear what I meant.


Cutter Isaacson wrote:
Everyone is capable of learning, not everyone is willing.



Which part of that do I need to explain more carefully?

No that would be you who is trolling. Everyone is capable of learning but not everyone is willing, but as you cannot tell me with any reliability how many of those people who did not vote are unwilling, Trying to educate them all is the best option.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!

Frying Doom
#671 - 2012-09-04 12:49:33 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:
Frying Doom wrote:
now we just need to get more people to express theirs by voting.

We have. 16.6% (or whatever) gave a distinct vote, the remainder abstained.

The remainder did not vote that does not mean they would not take part if they were better informed.

As I have said many, many times, trying to educate the masses does no one harm but the minorities. We are better of having a council for the majority, than we are a minority council.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!

Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#672 - 2012-09-04 12:51:27 UTC
Frying Doom wrote:
but as you cannot tell me with any reliability how many of those people who did not vote are unwilling, Trying to educate them all is the best option.

They've had more than enough information, hence those who did not vote are unwilling to do so.

Frying Doom wrote:
The remainder did not vote that does not mean they would not take part if they were better informed.

How can they possibly become better informed than they already were?

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat

Muad 'dib
The Nine Nine
#673 - 2012-09-04 12:52:26 UTC
id like to see the stats on chars in FW since inferno and how many of those are alts from hi sec or null sec players.

I have a distinct feeling that players mains have gone down and alts have rocketed.

Cosmic signature detected. . . . http://i.imgur.com/Z7NfIS6.jpg I got 99 likes, and this post aint one.

Jenn aSide
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#674 - 2012-09-04 12:52:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Jenn aSide
Kryss Darkdust wrote:
Quote:
Yeah PVE is as boring as hell and it is not so much people will leave over it but more might stay if it wasn't so horrible


Not to switch topics here, but I think the point here is that if your playing Eve for PvE content.... you missed the point of Eve. PvE is there as a filler, not its primary content, unlike most MMO's in which PvP is the filler and PvE is the primary game content.

PvE in Eve is fine and serves its purpose. A little bit of farming to make some ISK to get yourself going, fill out your income a bit or entertain you while you wait for your friends to log in. If its all you do, than yeah, your probably going to get bored, but I don't see how focusing on PvE content in a game designed for Player interaction would improve it. And what we are really talking about here is Solo content, which to me has zero logic in an MMO (Multiplayer) ... say it with me.. if you play Eve alone, your doing it wrong.



But but, what about my playstyle that is totally valid and worthwhile even though it goes 100% against the core logic of the game! I pay my sub like you do so what I want is just as valid as what you want even though what I want was never promised to me by this particular game. And it doesn't matter at all that MOST games treat me like the undisputed king of the universe and I could siply go there and have fun THIS GAME must also cater to my deep seating psychological need to be "the Bawse" to, there for suicide ganking, afk cloaking and everything else that interferes with my fun should be outlawed!

Sorry if I made your brain explode with sarcasm, I just got tired of fighting against the obvious truth of the carebear and joined the darkside for about 2 seconds. I'm better now :) .
Frying Doom
#675 - 2012-09-04 12:57:02 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:

Frying Doom wrote:
The remainder did not vote that does not mean they would not take part if they were better informed.

How can they possibly become better informed than they already were?

Not being them I do not know, but I am aware that the email you showed me I did not receive, so others may not have seen that, also they may have just completely ignored the splash screens as advertising (That and it did not make a lot of sense anyway)

They can become better informed by us continuing and increasing what has been done before.

The CSM becomes more influential every year and now they are starting to be included earlier in the development process so it is becoming more important that people are educated more.

And frankly there is no real reason not to try other than our own apathy.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!

Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#676 - 2012-09-04 13:11:04 UTC
Frying Doom wrote:
They can become better informed by us continuing and increasing what has been done before.

How?

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat

serras bang
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#677 - 2012-09-04 13:11:17 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
From what I can tell at least the nullsec CSM representatives understand highsec mechanics and issues better than at least 90% of people who play EVE exclusively in highsec.
Furthermore they're capable of looking at EVE as a whole and understanding changes to highsec as how it would relate to the bigger picture. A highsec only candidate probably wouldn't have the same understanding of lowsec or nullsec and would probably be too concerned with just the issues (or some perceived issues) of his little corner of space.


and thats exactly a bad thing its why people from all sec space and profestions should be on here if you are a hi sec candidate and a carebear yourself then why should you give a damn about null and low you represent the hi sec players and only them not the null and low. so not the worst thing that could happen.
serras bang
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#678 - 2012-09-04 13:13:32 UTC  |  Edited by: serras bang
Muad 'dib wrote:
I was in high sec, i did missions, missions got boring, went to low sec, made much more isk, started to pvp, now i only pvp.

Problem is like THE WARCRAFT people like to just make isk to buy plex/make isk better.

I say problem, but really its what they like to do. So how about having a special mission once in a while with a huge reward that cant be done solo, sort of like a double reward lvl 5 mission in low sec (like once in a while hauling missions), something to temp them out and gather some friends. That sort of stuff? a dash of incursions if you will.


you know what this isnt a bad idea for lvl 4's to make ones you cannot complete by yourself on occasion but do offer a reward that matches lvl 4's for say 3 - 4 people. Dunno about the whole lowsec things as a lot would skip it but it may encourage people to go outside there comfort a lil more as eve is dull and boreing by yourself and theres much more enjoyment to be had with groups even if its just shooting rocks and having a laugh on ts.
Frying Doom
#679 - 2012-09-04 13:14:29 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:
Frying Doom wrote:
They can become better informed by us continuing and increasing what has been done before.

How?

Please read previous posts that pretty much says it all.

Also as the CSM only come up in the game once a year, why would people who's only used access to eve is via the game consider it relevant?

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!

Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#680 - 2012-09-04 13:30:03 UTC
serras bang wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
From what I can tell at least the nullsec CSM representatives understand highsec mechanics and issues better than at least 90% of people who play EVE exclusively in highsec.
Furthermore they're capable of looking at EVE as a whole and understanding changes to highsec as how it would relate to the bigger picture. A highsec only candidate probably wouldn't have the same understanding of lowsec or nullsec and would probably be too concerned with just the issues (or some perceived issues) of his little corner of space.


and thats exactly a bad thing its why people from all sec space and profestions should be on here if you are a hi sec candidate and a carebear yourself then why should you give a damn about null and low you represent the hi sec players and only them not the null and low. so not the worst thing that could happen.

Except hisec isn't an insular place, it affects the entirety of the rest of the game. If it has a reward scheme which is too good (incursions pre-nerf, L4s, massive manufacturing capacity, etc etc etc), then it will have a detrimental effect on the other areas of space, and it does.

If you have a hisec carebear focusing only on hisec carebearing, then every time someone says things like "nerf L4s", "increase manufacturing installation costs", "increase sales taxes" or similar things, then he will have a literal heartattack because his rewards go down/costs go up oh god, whereas it may very well be a part of a long list of changes which CCP must make to keep the game as a whole healthy in the long run. Case in point, a thread somewhere in which someone said that the PI taxes were exorbiant and should really, really be reduced so they wouldn't get "so gouged with taxes". What they fail to see is that after the taxes are reduced, what'll happen is that everyone'll war down the prices on everything, and voila they're back to square one and they'll ***** and moan yet again about exorbiant taxes.

People who have a bigger view of the game will always end up having a more balanced view of how a change will impact the game as a whole, and this is better than someone who's sole eve existence consists of making manufacturing spreadsheets and hauling stuff around in hisec.

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat