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POS-less WH living. Possible?

Author
Plead
Henehen Conflict Logistics
#1 - 2011-09-26 12:34:18 UTC
After a years absence from Eve I'm planning to move into a WH with this char in an Orca and my main in a Tengu. My main has most of the relevant skills at V, and both chars will have good probing skills by the time I move in. I have a few questions for you pro WH-dwellers:

1: First of all; is this even worth it? Is it easier to just go look for decent WH's and clear them out, and then look for the next?

2: What category WH would be most profitable? 3, or can I do 4?

3: Inside the WH, what sites should I be looking for to make a decent isk?

4: What ships do I need to bring? Planning to take a Tengu, scanner frig and some kind of Iteron. Am I missing something obvious?
Lorkin Desal
That Hole Over There
#2 - 2011-09-26 13:33:21 UTC
Plead wrote:
After a years absence from Eve I'm planning to move into a WH with this char in an Orca and my main in a Tengu. My main has most of the relevant skills at V, and both chars will have good probing skills by the time I move in. I have a few questions for you pro WH-dwellers:

1: First of all; is this even worth it? Is it easier to just go look for decent WH's and clear them out, and then look for the next?

2: What category WH would be most profitable? 3, or can I do 4?

3: Inside the WH, what sites should I be looking for to make a decent isk?

4: What ships do I need to bring? Planning to take a Tengu, scanner frig and some kind of Iteron. Am I missing something obvious?



A Backup scanner frig; just because. Are you going to PVP or simply PVE?

As you are on your own, I would limit yourself to C1/C2 Wormholes. Your Tengu will not survive a C4 site. (Neuting)
You also need to remember that the only way to make a significant amount of money from wormhols PVE is to salvage all the wrecks, which I recommend a noctis/destroyer for.

If you are bringing an iteron in, do PI. You can make a significant amount of money this way.

Feel free to convo me in game for w-space advice.
Comy 1
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#3 - 2011-09-26 13:38:42 UTC
Lorkin Desal wrote:

As you are on your own, I would limit yourself to C1/C2 Wormholes.


Unfortunately an orca can't enter a C1 due to too much mass.

To the OP:

If you run solo I would personally just focus on running the anomalies if you decide to go for a C3, the radar/mag sites will probably be too hard for you unless you really know what you are doing and spend quite some isk on the fittings. In a C2 however you can probably run these aswell.
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2011-09-26 13:44:16 UTC
I've heard of people doing this. Keep in mind that the Orca pilot will basically be stuck piloting the Orca full time. No way you want to leave it floating in space to be probed out.

Personally I would only do this for short stays. Basically for WH diving I would handle them this way.

If I found a WH with sites I wanted to run, and I knew I could finish them up in one sitting (you will have to figure out the # of sites you could do in one sitting) I would take my main in a Tengu and alt in a Noctis. I'd leave the Noctis cloaked at a safe while running sites, and then salvage behind. Finish up the sites and get back out.

If it was a system where there were so many sites I might need to spend a few days, I'd do the cloaky Orca thing.

If I were to do PI, I'd just find a WH I could setup shop in and setup a POS (which I have done).

Keep in mind the Orca plan will only work with C2 or higher.
Plead
Henehen Conflict Logistics
#5 - 2011-09-26 13:57:26 UTC
The reason I don't simply apply for a proper WH corp is that I have somewhat erratic playtimes atm. What I need is the option to log on and run a few sites before I have to log again, that's why it seems like a good option to park a cloaked Orca inside with ammo and spare subsystems/mods etc.

I want to clear the sites, redo my ship, and go back for salvage/hacking/dance on sleeper corpses.

I don't mind a challenge, might give C3's a go :)

Thanks for the answers, I'm sure I'll have more!
Arazel Chainfire
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2011-09-26 14:07:44 UTC
I used to run WH's out of an orca (stay for a day or two, then move on). I would recommend sticking to C2 sites simply for the matter of how long it would take to run sites in a solo tengu in C3's (c3's are everyone's favorite WH to go hunting in, whether it is sleepers or other players that they are hunting). However, I would recommend putting a small POS inside your orca for when you decide you need a bit of safety. Only put it up when you need it, then take it down again when you are done. I would recommend finding a C2 with C2 static, then go through your static WH each day to run sites, then come back to your "home" WH. This guarantees that you have C2 sites to run at any time, while keeping a direct exit for your orca in case you need to get out in a hurry.

-Arazel
xenodia
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2011-09-26 18:50:49 UTC
Plead wrote:
The reason I don't simply apply for a proper WH corp is that I have somewhat erratic playtimes atm. What I need is the option to log on and run a few sites before I have to log again, that's why it seems like a good option to park a cloaked Orca inside with ammo and spare subsystems/mods etc.

I want to clear the sites, redo my ship, and go back for salvage/hacking/dance on sleeper corpses.

I don't mind a challenge, might give C3's a go :)

Thanks for the answers, I'm sure I'll have more!



You cant change t3 subsystems using the orca fitting service, or even the fitting service at a POS for that matter. Has to be done while docked in a station.

Other than that flaw in your plan, its doable in a c2. C1 isnt possible because the orca wont fit. C3 is possible but iffy because of tougher rats and increased neuting. C4 and above would be basically impossible to solo, even in a tengu.
aldhura
Blackjack and Exotic Dancers
Top Tier
#8 - 2011-09-26 19:29:33 UTC
Hi,

Sent you an evemail.

Cheers,
FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#9 - 2011-09-26 21:03:26 UTC  |  Edited by: FloppieTheBanjoClown
Comy 1 wrote:
Unfortunately an orca can't enter a C1 due to too much mass.


I've done it. You just find a K162 into a C1, that has plenty of mass load for an Orca and everything else.

edit: to be specific, an N110 connecting a C1 to highsec will take 1,000,000,000 kg

I run three accounts. This is what I took in:

Legion fitted with expanded probe launcher
Noctis fitted with cloak and core probe launcher, plus MWD and analyzer
An orca with a large armor rep, large hull rep, and cloak, plus armor rep drones

In the ship hold was an Echelon, an Anathema, a Purifier, a salvage Catalyst, and a Zealot as a backup PVE ship in case I lost the Legion.

I could run any site I wanted, only logged in the industrials when I need them, and was prepared to lose 2-3 ships and one pod before having to vacate the hole.

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.

Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2011-09-26 21:11:06 UTC
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:
Comy 1 wrote:
Unfortunately an orca can't enter a C1 due to too much mass.


I've done it. You just find a K162 into a C1, that has plenty of mass load for an Orca and everything else.

I run three accounts. This is what I took in:

Legion fitted with expanded probe launcher
Noctis fitted with cloak and core probe launcher, plus MWD and analyzer
An orca with a large armor rep, large hull rep, and cloak, plus armor rep drones

In the ship hold was an Echelon, an Anathema, a Purifier, a salvage Catalyst, and a Zealot as a backup PVE ship in case I lost the Legion.

I could run any site I wanted, only logged in the industrials when I need them, and was prepared to lose 2-3 ships and one pod before having to vacate the hole.


Not a chance. The k162 has the same limits as the other side. And all C1 wormholes have a max per jump limit of 20mil. An orca has a mass of 250 mil.
FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#11 - 2011-09-26 22:26:33 UTC  |  Edited by: FloppieTheBanjoClown
Derath Ellecon wrote:
Not a chance. The k162 has the same limits as the other side. And all C1 wormholes have a max per jump limit of 20mil. An orca has a mass of 250 mil.


Makes me wonder how I got my Orca in those C1s then...maybe I got lucky with a bug back when I was doing that.

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.

Comy 1
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#12 - 2011-09-26 22:46:44 UTC
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:
Derath Ellecon wrote:
Not a chance. The k162 has the same limits as the other side. And all C1 wormholes have a max per jump limit of 20mil. An orca has a mass of 250 mil.


Makes me wonder how I got my Orca in those C1s then...maybe I got lucky with a bug back when I was doing that.


Only way to get an orca into a C1 is to build it inside.
Khanh'rhh
Sparkle Motion.
#13 - 2011-09-26 22:53:21 UTC
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:
Derath Ellecon wrote:
Not a chance. The k162 has the same limits as the other side. And all C1 wormholes have a max per jump limit of 20mil. An orca has a mass of 250 mil.


Makes me wonder how I got my Orca in those C1s then...maybe I got lucky with a bug back when I was doing that.


You weren't in a C1. That's the simple explanation.

Or, you'd have us believe it glitched when you went in, then the glitch gods saw fit to glitch it again to come out, which is also impossible.

"Do not touch anything unnecessarily. Beware of pretty girls in dance halls and parks who may be spies, as well as bicycles, revolvers, uniforms, arms, dead horses, and men lying on roads -- they are not there accidentally." -Soviet infantry manual,

Uzbeg Khan
Henehen Conflict Logistics
#14 - 2011-09-27 11:03:53 UTC
Slight thread ninja, but oh well...

What is needed to put up a pos? Anchoring?
What do one need besides a sma to be relatively safe from the odd solo/small gang roam?

Things I hate: - Signatures - Irony - Lists

grumpyguts1
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#15 - 2011-09-27 22:07:20 UTC
Uzbeg Khan wrote:
Slight thread ninja, but oh well...

What is needed to put up a pos? Anchoring?
What do one need besides a sma to be relatively safe from the odd solo/small gang roam?


You never safe Shocked But if you put up a small don't leave you ships in it as 1 bubble will cover the whole pos.
kasai zenpachi
Circle Of Chaos
#16 - 2011-09-27 22:45:33 UTC  |  Edited by: kasai zenpachi
OK how about instead of an ORCA to base out of use a carrier instead ( in a c4 or higher WH ) That's an idea that i being dying to try when i finish training both my toons. Would that be wise?

p.s. cloacky carriers and it would be 2 carriers, 2 basi ,2-3 tengus for dps. Good idea or not?

p.s.s. sorry for high jacking you thread
Comy 1
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#17 - 2011-09-27 23:13:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Comy 1
kasai zenpachi wrote:
OK how about instead of an ORCA to base out of use a carrier instead ( in a c4 or higher WH ) That's an idea that i being dying to try when i finish training both my toons. Would that be wise?

p.s. cloacky carriers and it would be 2 carriers, 2 basi ,2-3 tengus for dps. Good idea or not?

p.s.s. sorry for high jacking you thread


First off you can not get a carrier in a WH lower than class 5 without building it inside (and if you do you can never get it out), and if you warp them into any site in a C5/6 they will trigger capital escalations. I really would not recommend trying that unless you really know what you are doing.

On top of that, carriers would not really make for that great of a ship for what you are trying to accomplish. Not only are they more expensive and require alot more training, but you will be extremely limited in your movement. You can't live nomadic due to wormhole restrictions and the need of cyno alts to move in low/null sec. Plus the pain of actually be lucky enough to find that C5/6 with a random exit to null.

To be perfectly honest, since you have to ask these questions I assume you don't have enough experience to make real use of the carriers, nor should you try life in a C5/6 without experience the lower classes first. If you really wan't to avoid a POS, stick with the Orca is my advice.
Substantia Nigra
Polaris Rising
Goonswarm Federation
#18 - 2011-09-28 00:02:42 UTC
Comy 1 wrote:
kasai zenpachi wrote:
OK how about instead of an ORCA to base out of use a carrier instead (in a c4 or higher WH)


To be perfectly honest, since you have to ask these questions I assume you don't have enough experience ...


I think Comy has nailed it here.

We all have dreams of what we can or want to do in eve, but many of them are not so firmly grounded in 'reality'. We gotta keep on dreaming, because that's fun and lets us set ourselves challenges etc, but we also have to take the occasional reality check.

The best reality check?? Get out there, start where your skills allow, and give it a go. Once you have some experience operating at an achievable level, up the ante and give something tougher a try.

So for the OP .... can I live out of an orca in a w-system?

Yes, you can, but I'd suggest getting a little more hands-on experience in w-space first. You may find, as I did, that POSes are not as daunting as they initially seem and it's way easier to use a POS (even a temporary one) than to live out of an orca. It can be done, and people do do it, but there are many good reasons for the vast majority of w-space denizens using POSes ... even us solo operators.

Suggestion: Chase-up and join a w-space corp and get yourself involved in wormhole efforts.

And, despite whatever the clown was smoking, you cannot get orcas into C1s except by building them there.

And for the "I wanna try a carrier" poster, yes that is do-able also ... but you should probably get some w-space experience and some carrier experience before you commit to trying this. To operate carriers in C4 and below you need to build them in the system. That requires a POS and you cannot take them out of the system. If you didn't already know that, then you're not up for operating in middle - high level w-space without the support of a bundle of more experienced folk.

Again, I'd suggest chasing up a w-space corp and getting involved. That way you get to learn how w-space works, and how people have evolved different strategies for enjoying and profiting from their w-space lives. Then, once you understand w-space a bit better and know what others do, you will be in a way better position to develop your own approach, and enjoy the avant garde life you adopt.

I guess I am almost a 'vet' by now. Hopefully not too bitter and managing to help more than I hinder. I build and sell many things, including large collections of bookmarks.

Plead
Henehen Conflict Logistics
#19 - 2011-09-28 07:37:06 UTC
I've lived in a C4 before, so I've got some experience. I just can't commit to a corp these days, so I want to be able to log off when I have to, and find my puny WH op where I left it whenever I have the time to play again. It's got to be simple and small scale, but provide me with a goal and something to work against. I can't even afford the ships I need at the moment :)

Lets say I'd go for setting up a POS instead as a few have suggested. What would I need for that? How often does it need refueling?

To those warning about the dangers in WH's; I'm ofc prepared to lose the whole operation to pvp'ers at any time. I wouldn't continue playing if I didn't find a challenge in the game :)
Hathrul
NED-Clan
Goonswarm Federation
#20 - 2011-09-28 11:21:13 UTC
Get a pos with some ecm, hardeners, 2 scrams and a few guns. ecm makes your pos annoying to attack, and there are plenty of pos's that are easier to crack.

Fuel: plan how long you think you want to stay in the wormhole, and move that amount of fuel + 1 week in. when it starts dropping below 1 week, either start getting out or refuel if you really like the place you have.

Bring as little as possible. If you use the orca, you can do without sma and corp hangar. those mods smell like loot so better not have them. bring the tengu, a salvager, 2 scanning ships, and if you get a c2, a dedicated analyzer for the mag sites. Also remember to bring a dozen extra probe launcher and dozens of probes. cant have too many.

When logging off, put everything into the orca, and log another toon off in a safespot within dscan range of your pos. Use that to check there aren't nasty people attacking your pos. If there are, stay logged off until they are gone.

As for joining a corp, ideally a wormhole has 23/7 coverage. your irregular times aren't always an objection, and can in fact be an asset. If you really want to live in wormhole space, just talk to people. I know for a fact that Talocan united has several wormhole corporations that wouldn't mind someone with irregular hours. And having a corp instead of solo adds a lot of security.
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