Warfare & Tactics

Holding systems and the associated upgrades are lol worthy and there isn't really any penalty/downside for not holding anything other than having to spend a few minutes travelling back and forth from staging points in highsec.

FW is very casual with no real tie to a faction your're fighting for, outside some RP groups or maybe the odd person who have become really invested in being faction 'x' it shouldn't be surprising to see people pile onto just one side to make the most possible money out of the system.

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Some interesting things in this thread the only one that I really can say is worthy however is:

Why Sov?

This is what CCP is working on, there is no point to hold sov at this time. There is no reason to keep the systems upgraded and no point in owning more sov unless you are preparing for an lp dump.

However the main problem is Amar dont care about the new way FW mechanics work, until they care they will just be the same old Amar.

ISK feeds the war machine. FW provides this. People that want to war will also need isk. Without ISK there is no war so stop complaining and make isk for the war which means plexing......

Well then lets admit this is a pve mechanic so ccp will fix it. Then we can see who will win. But by keeping up this obvious lie that it is already a pvp mechanic ccp might never fix it.



If they are happy to do pve thats fine for them. Others want pvp and want occupancy to be a pvp mechanic.



Fweddit wasn't in for the isk - at least not originally. Nulli was in it for the isk. WBR I am notreally sure. They were in fw before the big inferno farmville started. I would imagine each of their members had their own reasons to be in fw.

My corp TMFED are 2 of the older amarr militia corps. Others left due to the station lock out rule change. (whcih didn't really effect minmatar) Others left for caldari like amarrian retribution.

But really when you have a system that is a pve system pretty much everyone will farm it. "No amarr were killed in the farming of the minmatar lp. " Make the system pvp and this will change.

We used to have a hard and fast rule no plexing for the enemy that is no plexing for minmatar and no plexing for gallente. Perhaps we were one of the last hold outs I'm not sure. But then after our 40 systems that we flipped became about 50% contested in 36 hours after the flip, even I lost all faith in this system.

Jade says we should ahve gone up there and started defensive plexing the metro area. LOL how long do you think that would work for? how much more isk would minmatar earn from us letting them continue to farm these systems? How fun is it to just run into a plex and watch the enemy warp to a different plex again and again and again. If I had recomended that people would rightly think I was crazy. I don't want to be the guy who recomends we do the most boring pve gameplay- all the time.

I'll get to some other responses later on (lunch break now) but just want to bring you up on this point. I certainly didn't suggest that you should be defensive plexing metro in the wake of your tier 4 spike. In fact the only kind of defensive plexing I'd advise anyone to do in good conscience is defensive plexing in a critical staging system where the enemy is interested in fighting to kick you out. The thrust of my critique on your strategy Cearain is that you fixated on ISK through the infinite vulnerability situation as an extremely short term tactic that immediately vanished in smoke when you achieved it, rather than using the numerical advantage you had for a time to remove critical minmatar staging systems in order to throw us back 10 jumps to our hisec.

Defensive plexing is only PVE when its done in irrelevant systems nobody really cares about taking. It becomes vibrant PVP when its done in systems that matter (and people are fighting over it).

Short point is that you weren't contesting systems that matter to the overall war, you got seduced into pure short term isk-gain effort and got surprised about it when an enemy (you'd done nothing to actually hurt) bounced back to immediately punch you in the face minutes after your cash out.

In historical terms you can't "win" faction warfare without fighting a Stalingrad at some point you've either got to crush your enemy and drive them from their staging systems or accept that you raising your flag in a few dozen pointless backwater villages in the countryside will mean nothing when their big battalions come rolling out the collective factories and reclaiming territory in days.

If you read what I said to you yesterday its about overall strategy and my belief that your fixation on alt-plexing hordes is misplaced and draws your eye from the real necessity to displace an enemy encamped on your doorstep. Its utterly astonishing that the Matari faction is able to maintain an operating base in Huola in the center of the Amarrian heartland given the relative strengths of the two factions fleet and pvp assets (until last week end) - and fighting for and against occupation in huola would be done purely with combat ships and fleet battles in complexes (gunless alts and whatnot would and have been completely irrelevant to a fight in a significantly defended system).

The imbalance in the warzone is player made really. Minmatar have an operational base with its boot on the Amarrian throat. That's your problem Cearain - not the hordes of plexing alts elsewhere in the warzone. You will never achieve a reliable high tier of warzone control unless you defeat the major minmatar corporations and alliances and push them back closer to their hisec.

What you tried to do over the past month was to finesse this reality and game your way to a short term cash out that did nothing whatsoever to hurt your enemy. It worked in those terms - it got you some more isk in your pocket. But it was pretty crushing to overall Amarrian morale and camaraderie and sense of unity. Ultimately it actually hurt the collective Amarrian fortunes because some of your more mercenary comrades took the money and promptly buggered off.

A sensible strategist in the Amarrian ranks would be trying to leverage the pvp expertise you claim (I've heard it said many times that the amarrians consider themselves able to run pitched battles against Minmatar with great success) and fight in places where the enemy cannot ignore you.

Still, its just an observation from the outside.

For 5 hours after the systems flipped, myself, and at lest 10 others you were in the Aset pocket contesting the systems to pull Amarr out of T4 as fast as possible. My Navy Caracal had missiles. (and I also lost it to a Pirate Talos grrrrr).


I don't know how many were by t1 frigs. I'll give you 90%. You feel better? It does not change what happened. About the only argument I can see for why things are the way they are is that a majority of Amarr elements decided that they did not want to employ themselves in elements they deemed unworthy of their time and effort. Even after being made to understand how that would impact the parts they did care about.


Alts did not make choices for those people. Those people made their choices with alts. Beside, Saswong won the FW for us, remember that. *Saswong is overpowered and needs nerfed*

Please continue flying gunless ships. It makes killing them less risky.

Each faction has at most 7 systems as home base systems. Flipping these is not going to bring about tier 5. The minmatar were riding tier 5 for ages without ever flipping the 2 base systems of kamela or sahtogas.

People who talk of "core systems" or the importance of basing in fw systems are those who don't really understand the plexing mechanic or tier system.

People who are smart realize that if you base in a fw system that just means you are going to have to waste time defensive plexing it. It becomes a tar baby that sucks your pilots time. Time that would be better spent offensive plexing or fighting enemy plexers trying to plex your own systems.

I see you are more interested in isk than winning the war. /thread!


It's only important because we choose to make it important. For Gallente, basing in key choke point systems (Heyd, Nenna, Nis, Vlill) leads to more fights and gets us closer to the action -wherever it is on the FW map. We can also project power more easily.

It's only important if you make it important. You Cearain don't, so it's not. For those who want to hold systems (Occupancy Warfare) and get more fights closer to the action (PVP guys, especially the -5 and below guys) - it's important.

How does one win any war in Eve? Break the will of the opposing force.