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New problem with the mining barge changes
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Ban Bindy
Bindy Brothers Pottery Association
True Reign
#21 - 2012-08-19 20:28:12 UTC
Newbies do the tutorials and move. If they don't do the tutorials then they just move. There's no problem.
Evil Cleaner
Clean Evil Incorporated
#22 - 2012-08-19 20:31:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Evil Cleaner
So how many new players are told to go collect 25 m3 ore ( been 5 years since last I ran those missions) in their first few missions only to see empty ore belts? That is the point im trying to make. If you enjoy this game then keeping new players is a step in keeping CCP's bank roll going.


edit.... Or perhaps you are a bunch of forum Trolls and could care less about the game.? Are you?

Evil Is in my name, So what did you expect?
Hypercake Mix
#23 - 2012-08-19 20:32:06 UTC
Get together with other miners, form up mining fleets, and go tackle the systems that have belts and no stations.
Elvis Fett
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#24 - 2012-08-19 20:37:21 UTC
Evil Cleaner wrote:
So how many new players are told to go collect 25 m3 ore ( been 5 years since last I ran those missions) in their first few missions only to see empty ore belts? That is the point im trying to make. If you enjoy this game then keeping new players is a step in keeping CCP's bank roll going.


edit.... Or perhaps you are a bunch of forum Trolls and could care less about the game.? Are you?


So if your only concern is new people, why not just seed the systems new people are in with a bunch of asteroids with only 75m3 of veld in them. People in exhumers won't even bother targeting these asteroids. It sounds to me someone is too lazy/scared to move more than a few jumps from Jita to mine... You sound like those people in Freelancer that ***** about being so rich that their wallet can't hold any more money.
Evil Cleaner
Clean Evil Incorporated
#25 - 2012-08-19 20:38:39 UTC
How many people did you know or trust even a little bit in your first 30 minutes of playing this game? Im going to guess none.


System: go collect some ore...
player: There is no ore here.
3 systems later still no ore... You getting the point yet?

Evil Is in my name, So what did you expect?
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#26 - 2012-08-19 20:39:10 UTC
Evil Cleaner wrote:
So how many new players are told to go collect 25 m3 ore ( been 5 years since last I ran those missions) in their first few missions only to see empty ore belts? That is the point im trying to make. If you enjoy this game then keeping new players is a step in keeping CCP's bank roll going.


edit.... Or perhaps you are a bunch of forum Trolls and could care less about the game.? Are you?



If it's such a problem, why are you mining anywhere near those systems?

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Evil Cleaner
Clean Evil Incorporated
#27 - 2012-08-19 20:48:58 UTC
Elvis Fett wrote:


So if your only concern is new people, why not just seed the systems new people are in with a bunch of asteroids with only 75m3 of veld in them.[/url]

Thank you the first person to make a suggestion. Too bad it wont work though. As I pointed out these guys target everything. Its mainly the new players that are getting screwed. Who knows maybe enough super low yield roids will keep them away.

Evil Is in my name, So what did you expect?
Evil Cleaner
Clean Evil Incorporated
#28 - 2012-08-19 20:55:15 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Evil Cleaner wrote:
So how many new players are told to go collect 25 m3 ore ( been 5 years since last I ran those missions) in their first few missions only to see empty ore belts? That is the point im trying to make. If you enjoy this game then keeping new players is a step in keeping CCP's bank roll going.


edit.... Or perhaps you are a bunch of forum Trolls and could care less about the game.? Are you?



If it's such a problem, why are you mining anywhere near those systems?


Supply and demand. Trit and mex prices are rather high & Easy to grab ore in one region rather than risk flying in a freighter full of it in from another region.

supply & demand combined with risk vs reward...

That and you have convinced me that most of you want this company to fail.

Evil Is in my name, So what did you expect?
Rellik B00n
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#29 - 2012-08-19 21:01:40 UTC
Cedar Locus wrote:
why did i click this link?


its like a troll that doesnt know hes a troll.

hidden troll Smile
[Of a request for change ask: Who Benefits?](https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=199765)
Hypercake Mix
#30 - 2012-08-19 21:18:13 UTC
I thought the mining tutorial gave you a warp point to a spawned rock O.o
D3F4ULT
#31 - 2012-08-19 21:22:15 UTC
I don't see the problem with game mechanics.

Points:
A) Market is driven by supply and demand.
B) Supply is limited (daily).
C) First come first serve.

As supply closest to market is depleated the resource becomes more valued. The resource is then brought in from further and further away where the number of belts tenfold as you expand your distance from the center point (Trade hub).

thus, you have plenty of astroid belts to mine, but your "work" is doubled in effort (Though you act like this **** is breaking your back). If you can't simply comprehend this nature of economics then I'm safe to say this game isn't for you.

I, and quite a few people here, am not worried about Subscription numbers, look at graphs since release and the game has been fine for many years and the same mechanic has been in place.


TL;DR: Working as intended.

"Bow down before the one you serve, you're going to get what you deserve"
Bommel McMurdoc
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#32 - 2012-08-19 21:29:25 UTC
bleh, my troll-dar is blaring.....

unsubscribing, too hard for me to believe that "moving systems" is a difficult concept for anyone.
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#33 - 2012-08-19 21:31:13 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
Evil Cleaner wrote:
That and you have convinced me that most of you want this company to fail.

Malcanis's Law: Anything done that supposedly benefits younger, poorer player is invariably to the greater benefit of older, richer players.

- You can't give newbies [too much] "protection" without making it attractive for veterans to pump out alts and use said "protecttion" to their advantage.
- You can't increase the amount of asteroids out in high-sec... because then more people would mine in relative safety and bring the prices of minerals down... leaving those who can't mine on an industrial scale with less potential money.
- Creating a special "newbie asteroid" won't work because it will STILL be mined away when everything else in the immediate area has been gobbled up.
- Creating "itty bitty" asteroids for newbies won't work because THEY TOO will be mined away when everything else has been depleted.

Plus... CCP's intention (and design) was to make resources "scarce" in areas with high population... thus "forcing" people to spread out and populate other areas of the game.
Jita, and the area surrounding Jita, has one of the highest concentrations of players in the the game. It should not be surprising that most of the asteroids are gone given that they are anemic when they respawn (which is caused by game mechanics in response to over harvesting) and they fierce competition for said anemic 'roids by so many people.

How did you Veterans start?
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy
Caldari State
#34 - 2012-08-19 21:38:22 UTC
Toko Too wrote:
What is asteroids?


Kids these days...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AZdSurJ3hkI
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#35 - 2012-08-19 21:56:26 UTC
Evil Cleaner wrote:
Korsiri wrote:
nah new players will just learn the same thing we did - go explore.

Find a system that's off the beaten path, less competition, less ganks, etc. Makes a good lesson for market applications as well.

Oh I agree with you completely on that point. But is a day 1 or even a day 10 new player ready to make that leap? Most likely they are not.

Since I have 3 areas covered one being close to jita and the others 2 nowhere near jita this is a problem.


A Minmatar pilot could spawn in a system whose first neighbour system is 0.5 sec and the next one is a perma-camped 0.4 sec.

Caldari have it too easy.

EvE Online portal | EvE markets tutorials
Ginger Barbarella
#36 - 2012-08-19 21:57:48 UTC
Evil Cleaner wrote:
The problem is there isn't any asteroids left to go mining. Most .8 and above systems have 99% of their asteroids mined out within a few hours of server up. I have seen new players mining from 3 asteroids that were the only ones left in the system. Since the mining barge changes this is happening every day it seems. This could become a problem where new players might get discouraged and quit playing.

If I want to go mining in these systems I either have to run a lv 1 mission or scan down someone and run in with mining barge just to go mine some veld (in hopes of getting something much better of course). I guess you could say I am ninja mining but that isn't really doable for new players.

The only thing I can think is to ad some new type of roid that is really large and worth 1/4 that of veldspar. Dull veldspar maybe? Something keep new players happy that they are able to go out and do something other than run system to system looking for a lone rock worth maybe 100,000 isk.


As a side note I do mine in a .7 system regularly due to the fact that there is plenty of roids to be had. I just have mu home base 2 jumps away in a .9 system that is close to jita since I like to trade on the weekends.


Just curious, but would you complain to your Mayor if there wasn't a McDonalds withing 2 blocks of your house?

Like I said, just curious... You must have a horribly rough life.

"Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." --- Sorlac
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#37 - 2012-08-19 21:58:46 UTC
Evil Cleaner wrote:
So how many new players are told to go collect 25 m3 ore ( been 5 years since last I ran those missions) in their first few missions only to see empty ore belts? That is the point im trying to make. If you enjoy this game then keeping new players is a step in keeping CCP's bank roll going.


edit.... Or perhaps you are a bunch of forum Trolls and could care less about the game.? Are you?


How many new players skip the mission with the privately "just for them" spawned ore and then go cry on the forums?

EvE Online portal | EvE markets tutorials
Virgil Travis
Non Constructive Self Management
#38 - 2012-08-19 22:00:26 UTC
Evil Cleaner wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
Evil Cleaner wrote:
So how many new players are told to go collect 25 m3 ore ( been 5 years since last I ran those missions) in their first few missions only to see empty ore belts? That is the point im trying to make. If you enjoy this game then keeping new players is a step in keeping CCP's bank roll going.


edit.... Or perhaps you are a bunch of forum Trolls and could care less about the game.? Are you?



If it's such a problem, why are you mining anywhere near those systems?


Supply and demand. Trit and mex prices are rather high & Easy to grab ore in one region rather than risk flying in a freighter full of it in from another region.

supply & demand combined with risk vs reward...

That and you have convinced me that most of you want this company to fail.


So in actual fact, you are part of the problem you're talking about.

One idea might be to stop mining barges from entering the rookie systems. That would end the problem for new players.

Unified Church of the Unobligated - madness in the method Mamma didn't raise no victims.
Mutant Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#39 - 2012-08-19 22:01:26 UTC
Evil Cleaner wrote:
Korsiri wrote:
nah new players will just learn the same thing we did - go explore.

Find a system that's off the beaten path, less competition, less ganks, etc. Makes a good lesson for market applications as well.

Oh I agree with you completely on that point. But is a day 1 or even a day 10 new player ready to make that leap? Most likely they are not.

Since I have 3 areas covered one being close to jita and the others 2 nowhere near jita this is a problem.

I was in null sec within 10 days of starting yet these days newbies aren't ready to go into a high sec system below .8 after a day or 10? Jesus christ.
Abel Merkabah
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#40 - 2012-08-19 22:16:37 UTC
Good. Maybe this will encourage more New players to do something other then mine. I say, reduce the high sec roid respawn even further. Tons of roids not being used in lowsec.

James315 for CSM 8!