These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

How will crimewatch changes "break" can flipping?

First post
Author
Auar
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#281 - 2012-08-17 13:08:52 UTC
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
I get the feeling that CCP is trying to make high sec PVP more available for everybody with this proposed change.

Presently, you can make the choice to flip cans, and get that sort of PVP that might be 1v1 or 1v corp. But all of the choice is wtih the can flipper at the moment.

They actually have to find a jet can, that someone already made the choice to jettison, to try for that PVP, and the owner of the can can decide on what to do about it based on any available combat assets.

But these days, a lot of people don't have time to go flipping cans all day to get that "one noob who takes the bait" or even better, some turn of events that leads to a fleet battle. While some mining corps can be vast, coordination is not as common nor as easy as some people think. These take a lot of time.

The implication of crimewatch is that you become a part of the equation without having to flip a can, nor be the owner of the can.

This adds a third party to the mix. Whereas we have a can flipper, someone who seeks PVP (or whatever), and the flipee, we now have a vigilante. The participation rate of this form of PVP has now increased 50 percent. You need not be an agressor nor a miner, but you can be a vigilante instead.

And this alone becomes another opportunity for PVP. Not looking for cans to flip, not waiting for someone to flip your can, but instead bouncing around looking for someone who is "flagged" because of this.

Last I recall, there was some cost to being a vigilante, being flagged yourself. I remember that was originally mentioned, but not aware of the latest notes. if this is the case, then there is a lot of potential.

Ultimately, the goal might be such that you undock and get PVP much sooner. It would be nice to do so, without roaming, scouting, having to join a 0.0 corp, or gate camp/cat and mouse in low.

Would this potentially turn high sec into some kind of PVP arena? I don't know, but I would hope so because I think a good time will be had by all.



Great perspective on the change. Hopefully it work out close to how you envision it. +1

Auar
Jerick Ludhowe
Internet Tuff Guys
#282 - 2012-08-17 13:26:08 UTC
Pretty sure changing logi aggression mechanics is more important than this foolish can flipping nerf. How ccp gets so out of touch with their player base is beyond me.
Rats
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#283 - 2012-08-17 13:28:57 UTC
ISD TYPE40 wrote:
I have had to edit numerous troll posts, non constructive posts and personal insults from this thread. As I have stated before, such things will not be tolerated on these forums. Understandably some issues will arise from time to time that cause things to get a little heated, however that does not excuse slinging personal insults at one another.

These forums are for the benefit of the community as a whole, so lets keep the discussion clean and on topic in future, that way we might achieve something. Thank you - ISD type40.



Lol did you just say achieve something in a GD forum thread lols P


Tal


I Fought the Law, and the Law Won... Talon Silverhawk

Melodee619
Heavy Industry Construction and Mining Inc.
#284 - 2012-08-17 13:44:30 UTC
Nerf Burger wrote:
Melodee619 wrote:
As has been said all CCP is doing now is catering hand over firs tto the pve crowd. They want people to start talking about eve being "nice" an friendly an no risk... As the guy from Razor stated "complacency, stupidity will be even more widespread now. No matter how many times you tell them how to avoid trouble, it all comes down to them not wanting to take any responsibility. They have harrased CCP into playing for them.

Without over dramatizing things to much, it's a sad day for EVE to see it going down this path....

"its just unfortunate that most can flippers are cowards and probably wont be flipping many cans after this change. Still, I look foward to extracting many tears from the losers of EVE who are dumb enough to flip a can when I'm in system."

LOL there is no such thing as cowards in a computer game. I get you want to sound like your hard etc etc, but it comes off as...well, anyway.
Fact is, CCP seem to have declared that our playstyle is now no longer valid.
Mission runners will be next to get protection.

Can flipping (not something I bother with)
ganking (my main gameplay style)

Seem to be on the outs.


its purely about adding risk to can flipping, no longer can you have your private grief war against noobs with essentially zero risk. Cry more and l2p.


cry more an l2p?

I assume your speaking 14 year old because I dont speak gibberish. Please dont waste my time with any more silly schoolyard chest beating... ok?

good lad.

As for the issue at hand, none steals from day ones etc, hell can flipping period is silly just because it gains you nothing. Miners deserve to be killed simply because they have no interest in playing themselves. They only want to bot or afk.... so its their fault if they die, none els...

But newbes... it's like kicking a kitten. utterly pointless.Having a global flag so everyone in eve can kill you is the single most moronic thing I have seen in last 4 years, an that includes
Concord boost (jihad over reaction)
Goldships/Ammo (mistake my arse)
Mining ships immunity (lol)
Now this stupidity...... It never ends, this pandering to pve'ers when EVE made it's name on self responsibility an tough game play.
People like myself are not complaining because theres no more hulks left, we are complaining because they are turning EVE into the one thing the net is full off.. wow clones. (granted EVE has a long way to go to be THAT bad), but its getting there.
Every time CCP do these things, they over react in the worst possible way.
malcovas Henderson
THoF
#285 - 2012-08-17 14:36:04 UTC  |  Edited by: malcovas Henderson
Melodee619 wrote:


cry more an l2p?

I assume your speaking 14 year old because I dont speak gibberish. Please dont waste my time with any more silly schoolyard chest beating... ok?

good lad.

As for the issue at hand, none steals from day ones etc, hell can flipping period is silly just because it gains you nothing. Miners deserve to be killed simply because they have no interest in playing themselves. They only want to bot or afk.... so its their fault if they die, none els...

But newbes... it's like kicking a kitten. utterly pointless.Having a global flag so everyone in eve can kill you is the single most moronic thing I have seen in last 4 years, an that includes
Concord boost (jihad over reaction)
Goldships/Ammo (mistake my arse)
Mining ships immunity (lol)
Now this stupidity...... It never ends, this pandering to pve'ers when EVE made it's name on self responsibility an tough game play.
People like myself are not complaining because theres no more hulks left, we are complaining because they are turning EVE into the one thing the net is full off.. wow clones. (granted EVE has a long way to go to be THAT bad), but its getting there.
Every time CCP do these things, they over react in the worst possible way.



I do not like to see EVE become easy. These currant changes, does not make it any easier. Miners have not all of a sudden got 1 million m3 a minute yield. They are safer maybe, But can still be ganked. There will still be those that fly an untanked hulk. Jetting into a can. You have still got your targets. Just a bigger risk/cost to the criminal. Which I personally think is a good call.
Vilnius Zar
SDC Multi Ten
#286 - 2012-08-17 16:13:12 UTC
malcovas Henderson wrote:
Vilnius Zar wrote:
Suvari Khashour wrote:
Vilnius Zar wrote:
Suvari Khashour wrote:
why not try PvP instead, it takes some skill i know, but.. give it a whirl you might even enjoy it. but i doubt you have the balls tbh. Pirate


Why are you using a posting alt?


Because im a miner of course... Roll


So you talk about others lacking balls but you use an alt to post. I guess that invalidates pretty much anything you post then, just so we're clear on that.



Posting on an Alt should never invalidate the posters "Opinions". I think you are wrong. You're posting on your main? does that then invalidate all Mains opininons? There are many reasons people post on alts. some to be total douches. I choose to post on this character. What I say I believe in, and am definately right in MY opinion. All that matters is not the poster, but what the posters writes. If they mouth off. People will judge them for what they are. Reguardless who said it.


Now people could argue about you. You are not posting on your "ganker/canflipper" So truely you have never ganked or canflipped in your history. You know nothing about the mechanic. You have nothing to back your opinions up. Or do you have some truths told here today, that comfirm somethings, and debunk others.

By your reasoning everything you post in this thread is now invalidated.


good day to you sir



You didn't actually read/understand what Suvari wrote, did you.
malcovas Henderson
THoF
#287 - 2012-08-17 16:19:08 UTC  |  Edited by: malcovas Henderson
Vilnius Zar wrote:
malcovas henderson wrote:

Posting on an Alt should never invalidate the posters "Opinions". I think you are wrong. You're posting on your main? does that then invalidate all Mains opininons? There are many reasons people post on alts. some to be total douches. I choose to post on this character. What I say I believe in, and am definately right in MY opinion. All that matters is not the poster, but what the posters writes. If they mouth off. People will judge them for what they are. Reguardless who said it.


Now people could argue about you. You are not posting on your "ganker/canflipper" So truely you have never ganked or canflipped in your history. You know nothing about the mechanic. You have nothing to back your opinions up. Or do you have some truths told here today, that comfirm somethings, and debunk others.

By your reasoning everything you post in this thread is now invalidated.


good day to you sir


You didn't actually read/understand what Suvari wrote, did you.



Post on your main. So we can have a proper discussion. Untill then, everything you say is not valid. Evil
Alavaria Fera
Imperial Shipment
#288 - 2012-08-17 16:19:36 UTC
Melodee619 wrote:
Now this stupidity...... It never ends, this pandering to pve'ers when EVE made it's name on self responsibility an tough game play.
People like myself are not complaining because theres no more hulks left, we are complaining because they are turning EVE into the one thing the net is full off.. wow clones. (granted EVE has a long way to go to be THAT bad), but its getting there.
Every time CCP do these things, they over react in the worst possible way.

*shrug*

Highsec, a wonderful place to pvp.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Herr Wilkus
Aggressive Salvage Services LLC
#289 - 2012-08-17 16:46:31 UTC
Nerf Burger wrote:

Also, posting on an alt doesn't invalidate anything, its actually a smart thing to do if you are a miner. You never know when some disgruntled butthurt baby might take personal offense to hearing the unwanted truth and dedicate his existence to trying to annoy you in EVE.

Nice try, you fail.


No, it just makes you a coward.
And 'calling out' other players as cowards while engaged in a spineless act of cowardice yourself is Roll

I wouldn't expect a silly teenager to understand, but it really makes you look stupid.

At least you learned to stop talking about the mechanics of suicide ganking - because it was quite apparent, like most carebears, you don't comprehend simple game mechanics....or even know the first thing about 'PVP'.

lollerwaffle
Perkone
Caldari State
#290 - 2012-08-20 03:15:13 UTC  |  Edited by: lollerwaffle
Idris Helion wrote:
I'm just curious as to why you feel it's your duty to enlighten noobs as to the "proper" way to play the game. They're paying the same subscription fees you are, and have the same expectation of having an enjoyable experience that you do.

EVE isn't a job. It's not the frigging Army. It's a game, and one that too many people take way too seriously.

That whole "cold, hard universe" thing gets trotted out by every ganking douchebag in EVE, and I'm sick of it. If you're so seriously into the cold, hard aspects of EVE, if you're such a legendary bad-ass, why aren't you mixing it up out in losec or null? Why are you trolling noobs in 1.0 systems for their pathetic little can of Veld?

Griefing noobs should be an immediate death-sentence in high. The game mechanics didn't protect noobs enough until now, but I'm glad to see that CCP is taking the problem seriously.


1. I'm curious which part of my post made you think I feel that I have a duty to educate 'noobs'? Anyway I don't really refer to them as 'noobs'. Newbies, sure.

Also, I have no inclination to make anyone play the way I do.

2. I have fun logging on to forums and reading all the tears, perceived tears, wannabe tears and post like yours that seem to take everything personally (are you sure you don't take it seriously?)

3. FYI, please refer to the previous pages, on who brought up 'cold harsh universe' in this thread. :)

4. Also, look at your third line, you just proved a point of mine, about how people who don't play like you are automatically "ganking douchebags" and "legendary bad-ass" etc.

Also FYI, I don't kill new players in highsec as you seem to think everyone who participates in non-consensual combat does. Blanket statements FTW right? (I have been -10 for the 5 our of the 6 years or so I've been playing, plus I haven't actually logged in apart from to change skills in the last 2)

5. "Griefing" new players is a bannable offense and you should report players found doing so. However, I'm off the opinion that flagging yourself in highsec is far from a bannable/'instant death sentence' offense. If you would like to know more, please find out the difference between "flagging" and "aggression". Going by your post, you'd think people who actually commit aggressions should be banned?

6. Further to the above, can you elaborate more on how the game mechanics doesn't protect new players enough? They were given ample warning as to what would happen if they took from a can that wasn't theirs. Asking someone to read a pop up doesn't really constitute forcing them to play my way does it?
Herping yourDerp
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#291 - 2012-08-20 07:31:55 UTC
so they are making so anyone who steals a can will be attackible by anyone in highsec for the 15 minutes or something? where is the issue
you want to can flip in a mission or something chances are no one will see you. but if you do it in front of a station you will probably be seen and attacked.
Randomize All
Doomheim
#292 - 2012-08-20 09:43:42 UTC
Why is it taking so long for so many people to recognise the unstoppable march towards /pvpoff ?
Jerick Ludhowe
Internet Tuff Guys
#293 - 2012-08-20 13:10:27 UTC
Randomize All wrote:
Why is it taking so long for so many people to recognise the unstoppable march towards /pvpoff ?


It's generally what happens when greyscale starts proposing changes... Got to say he's undoubtedly the worst idea breeder at ccp
Scott PiIgrim
Doomheim
#294 - 2012-08-20 13:13:43 UTC
I for one, welcome the new crimesystem with open arms. I've always hated not beeing able to shoot the can flippers when they go red to some poor inbreed miner. I'm confident CCP will figure out a system that will include the duel option for 1 v 1.