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[Winter] Exploration Frigate Rebalance

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Alticus C Bear
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#181 - 2012-08-23 18:59:45 UTC
Perhaps the graphical model does not have enough hardpoint locations?

Might be better anyway gives a bit more versatility for armour or shield, although given they will generally have a probe launcher you could drop a missile hardpoint to leave a pure utility high. Just speculation of course.
Hannott Thanos
Squadron 15
#182 - 2012-08-23 19:05:07 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Bloodpetal wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
For technical reasons the 4th highslot on the Probe is getting bumped, so I'm moving that slot to a mid.


Technical reasons?

You got me curious now.

Too much awesome with 2 Turrets+2 Launchers?


Not enough space on the model. Oops


Um... What about the Atron? It can fit 3 turrets, but only 2 show.

while (CurrentSelectedTarget.Status == ShipStatus.Alive) {

     _myShip.FireAllGuns(CurrentSelectedTarget);

}
CCP Fozzie
C C P
C C P Alliance
#183 - 2012-08-23 19:06:31 UTC
Hannott Thanos wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Bloodpetal wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
For technical reasons the 4th highslot on the Probe is getting bumped, so I'm moving that slot to a mid.


Technical reasons?

You got me curious now.

Too much awesome with 2 Turrets+2 Launchers?


Not enough space on the model. Oops


Um... What about the Atron? It can fit 3 turrets, but only 2 show.


That one we have a fix in the works for.

Game Designer | Team Five-0

Twitter: @CCP_Fozzie
Twitch chat: ccp_fozzie
Ravcharas
Infinite Point
Pandemic Horde
#184 - 2012-08-23 19:52:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Ravcharas
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Bloodpetal wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
For technical reasons the 4th highslot on the Probe is getting bumped, so I'm moving that slot to a mid.


Technical reasons?

You got me curious now.

Too much awesome with 2 Turrets+2 Launchers?


Not enough space on the model. Oops

Isn't that the same reason why the Naglfar still has split weapon systems? How was that solved with the new launchers?
Nagarythe Tinurandir
Einheit X-6
#185 - 2012-08-24 11:21:35 UTC
Ravcharas wrote:

Isn't that the same reason why the Naglfar still has split weapon systems? How was that solved with the new launchers?


they made the citadel launchers rather small tubes and let them spit swarms missiles isntead of one missile as big as a cruiser.
Vilnius Zar
SDC Multi Ten
#186 - 2012-08-24 11:45:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Vilnius Zar
Magnate:
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 15(+5) / 40(+30)

So uhm 15 bandwidth but 40 bay. How does that make sense? Apart from the fact that having extra bay is just silly in most cases I get the feeling that all the stats are calculated through some formula and in this case adding more bay than twice the bandwidth (which is already silly) thus means the ship's stats suffer for it elsewhere.

Also, I don't see the use in a cycle time bonus, mostly because these ships will probably be used by newbies who'll get into cap problems because of it. make it a success chance bonus instead.
Spugg Galdon
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#187 - 2012-08-24 12:16:51 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Bloodpetal wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
For technical reasons the 4th highslot on the Probe is getting bumped, so I'm moving that slot to a mid.


Technical reasons?

You got me curious now.

Too much awesome with 2 Turrets+2 Launchers?


Not enough space on the model. Oops


Can the model not be modified just a little? I would really love 4 highs on this thing. Pwease!!

Vilnius Zar wrote:
Magnate:
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 15(+5) / 40(+30)

So uhm 15 bandwidth but 40 bay. How does that make sense? Apart from the fact that having extra bay is just silly in most cases I get the feeling that all the stats are calculated through some formula and in this case adding more bay than twice the bandwidth (which is already silly) thus means the ship's stats suffer for it elsewhere.

Also, I don't see the use in a cycle time bonus, mostly because these ships will probably be used by newbies who'll get into cap problems because of it. make it a success chance bonus instead.



I imagine the large drone bays in all the frigates is to allow for the new fangled salvager drones we will be getting. This way you can have two weapons + damage drones and a proble launcher instead of dropping a weapon for a salvager. The imicus gets to use a salvager though. Dunno why.
CCP Fozzie
C C P
C C P Alliance
#188 - 2012-08-24 12:28:48 UTC
Spugg Galdon wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Bloodpetal wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
For technical reasons the 4th highslot on the Probe is getting bumped, so I'm moving that slot to a mid.


Technical reasons?

You got me curious now.

Too much awesome with 2 Turrets+2 Launchers?


Not enough space on the model. Oops


Can the model not be modified just a little? I would really love 4 highs on this thing. Pwease!!


Getting stuff done faster means picking changes that are worth the effort. The extra high isn't worth a whole new model when a mid will also serve the ship very well.

Spugg Galdon wrote:

Vilnius Zar wrote:
Magnate:
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 15(+5) / 40(+30)

So uhm 15 bandwidth but 40 bay. How does that make sense? Apart from the fact that having extra bay is just silly in most cases I get the feeling that all the stats are calculated through some formula and in this case adding more bay than twice the bandwidth (which is already silly) thus means the ship's stats suffer for it elsewhere.

Also, I don't see the use in a cycle time bonus, mostly because these ships will probably be used by newbies who'll get into cap problems because of it. make it a success chance bonus instead.



I imagine the large drone bays in all the frigates is to allow for the new fangled salvager drones we will be getting. This way you can have two weapons + damage drones and a proble launcher instead of dropping a weapon for a salvager. The imicus gets to use a salvager though. Dunno why.


Main reason is so you have backups if the rats shoot your drones. These are intended to be able to spend a fair amount of time away from wherever your home base is.
You are right however that new drones would fit in there very nicely.

Game Designer | Team Five-0

Twitter: @CCP_Fozzie
Twitch chat: ccp_fozzie
Vilnius Zar
SDC Multi Ten
#189 - 2012-08-24 14:05:22 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
You are right however that new drones would fit in there very nicely.



/dramatic chipmunk
Justin Cody
War Firm
#190 - 2012-08-26 04:01:08 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
We felt that they were good enough as cyno ships as is, and that capital projection isn't really an area of the game that needs a buff right now.

Since cyno lighting is such a big part of their use, the equalized cargo capacity is intended to make sure that each of them can at least keep up with the old Probe.

The avenues for these ships to become more useful to older players most likely will lie with hacking and archaeology.


correct sir it needs a nerf...or space needs to get bigger/ more spread out.
Mike Whiite
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#191 - 2012-08-27 08:05:28 UTC
I think it wise to look at the Exploration sites as well as there ships, but aside from that.

Maybe it would be better to look at utillity drones for hacking, analyzing and gas mining than to try and fit all those modules on a ship.

something like a module adjustable drone bay for utillity drones or the like, that is a far greater adjustion than the ships I'm aware, but it would make them universal exploration ships.
Cleuseau Remos
EVE University
Ivy League
#192 - 2012-08-29 03:06:40 UTC
Just wanted to say I hate to see the cargo bonus go away from the probe. It was one of the most interesting quirky things in the game and I loved the frigate for PI.

Does it _really_ hurt to keep it in there?

... enjoy the game, keep up the good work.
Spugg Galdon
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#193 - 2012-08-29 08:33:58 UTC
Cleuseau Remos wrote:
Just wanted to say I hate to see the cargo bonus go away from the probe. It was one of the most interesting quirky things in the game and I loved the frigate for PI.

Does it _really_ hurt to keep it in there?

... enjoy the game, keep up the good work.




The fact the Probe still has a large cargo hold (they even buffed it slightly) and an extra low slot I'm sure that bonus won't be missed.
Pinky Denmark
The Cursed Navy
#194 - 2012-08-30 10:10:44 UTC
Plz make sure these ships have a signature big enough to catch them with other T1 frigates and destroyers so people don't use them to Benny Hill in other peoples back yards :-)

Also I feel these ships miss some racial differences... I know you want them to rely on drones, kiting and be good at exploration however if you don't put a racial touch on them you will end up with people primarily only using THE ship community think does the job best.

A racial bonus towards a racial ranged weapon would certainly give flavor and you can move one of the bonuses to a role bonus... Anyway these seems interesting and I hope they all gets used for fun.

Pinky
Khaim Khal
Perkone
Caldari State
#195 - 2012-08-31 02:43:04 UTC
Overall I like these new frigates, but one thing bothers me: they all have the same bonuses! It seems like players would simply choose between the ships based on slot layouts. It's not a huge problem, but it bugs me.
rodyas
Tie Fighters Inc
#196 - 2012-09-01 05:09:13 UTC  |  Edited by: rodyas
Sorry to rain sadness on this idea. It sounded cool, until I realized something.

Exploration in hi-sec is already overdone as it is. Now with improved ships, it will be dumber. All the sites are taken. I gave up on exploration, even though I enjoyed it. Since you spend hours and won't find a single site. This ship doesn't help that at all, just makes it worse. Now I won't even contemplate exploring.

Its a terrible idea to get new players pumped up, then they go out and can't do ****.

If this is still a plan, they better revamp hi sec exploration sites. Or this ship will just sit in hangars.

EDIT: Just saw the changes with their roles taken away. I mostly see these new frigs as a newbie wormhole ship if anything. Or to say this helps make wormholes more accessible to players then exploration. Now you can use these ships as better scanners, and focus on other ship skills while in a WH.

Signature removed for inappropriate language - CCP Eterne
Deena Amaj
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#197 - 2012-09-01 07:06:45 UTC
But still, Hi-Sec sites are damn rare as there are too many professional explorers nowadays.

That, and 0.0 sec sites will nuke the hell out of you when you warp in as warp to 100km doesn't always work (even if you abort warp and warp to 100km - landed several times right under the rats' noses)

Hi-Sec sites has nothing to do with the ship's revamp, but really, sites need to be looked at.

confirthisposmed

I'm probably typing on a Tablet too, which means the auto-correct is silly and fixing typos is a pain. I ain't fixing them.
Tarn Kugisa
Kugisa Dynamics
#198 - 2012-09-03 20:47:59 UTC
I freaking love dat heron
Screw CovOps, get Heron Big smileBig smile

Be polite. Be efficient. Have a plan to troll everyone you meet - KuroVolt
The Bazzalisk
One Risky Click
Snuffed Out
#199 - 2012-09-03 23:13:49 UTC
So now unless you have Cov Ops 4 or 5, a T1 scanning frigate is better for scanning than the T2 variant.

Doesn't make much sense to me.
Cage Man
Fusion Enterprises Ltd
Pandemic Horde
#200 - 2012-09-04 00:42:12 UTC
The Bazzalisk wrote:
So now unless you have Cov Ops 4 or 5, a T1 scanning frigate is better for scanning than the T2 variant.

Doesn't make much sense to me.



Warping cloaked may be a benefit of the T2 Ugh