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Fleet Boosting, A discussion:

Author
adopt
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#21 - 2012-08-10 20:33:16 UTC
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
Bunnie Hop wrote:
If they are required to be on grid people simply won't fly them anymore as they will be a primary target and they lack the ability to survive. The command-T3 booster ships would need to be completely reworked before putting them on grid.


Most Fleet Command Ships easily have enormous EHP...
and
most command t3s can still wield a 100k EHP tank while fitting a single Warfare Link...

Also, the damnation can have an obnoxious tank (make sure you include mindlink armor warfare bonuses to it too)... whether it can hit 1+m EHP or not is moreless irrelevant, as any subcapital tank above 200k EHP is more than battle ready....


All Command ships and T3s can break 200k EHP, with god damn ease. The Eos/Astarte need some Love.

Regarding the off-grid T3s, switch the bonus of the Command Ship and the T3 Warfare Link Subsystem around, so CSs get 5% and T3s get 3%, keep the system wide effects though.
Bloodpetal
Tir Capital Management Group
#22 - 2012-08-10 20:41:49 UTC

The bonus of the T3 was never "intended" to have multiple co-processors. That's a player invention and you are gimping your setups.

This nonsense about "MY T3 CAN"T LIVE ON GRID" is bullshit because you are the one making it not-viable because you want to exploit the bonuses by having 6 command links on it, with ECCM boosters that make it unscannable (impossible to scan, done it many times with max skill faction fitted covert ops and they're not scannable.)

So, remove the ability to min-max the setups by denying the Command Processors to T3s and then people can go cry in the corner.

The T3s with full ECCM are pretty much unscannable, and hiding them behind a POS and saying "Destroy the POS" is the biggest troll of a joke I've ever heard.

Where I am.

Syphon Lodian
Fabled Enterprises
#23 - 2012-08-10 20:49:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Syphon Lodian
I see no reason to force on-grid boosting.

Command Ships are not meant to be a combat ship. Off-grid is especially needed for W-Space, because you lack the intel acquired from local and system jump-gate pipelines. You're just a flimsy, defenseless target waiting to be popped.

The idea is that you're sacrificing a man, or a "slot" in the fleet in order have boosts. What difference does it make if the Command Ship flies around and does nothing, or if it sits off-grid and does "nothing".

Scan it down, pop it. In a POS? Pop that then, because your enemy will retreat to that POS, where you have to either bring the fight to them anyway, or bugger off.

Bloodpetal wrote:
The T3s with full ECCM are pretty much unscannable, and hiding them behind a POS and saying "Destroy the POS" is the biggest troll of a joke I've ever heard.
It's not a joke. The Booster has to be in the same system, so if you're fighting there, then you are fighting in the system where your enemy keeps a POS. Whether you win or lose the battles, the fight is going to end up at the POS. I agree with your T3 assessment however, it shouldn't be stealing the role of BC Command Ships.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#24 - 2012-08-10 20:51:57 UTC  |  Edited by: James Amril-Kesh
Actually, I have an even better idea.

Keep fleet boosting off grid, but change ganglinks so that they bloom signature radius by a really huge amount while they're online while also reducing signature resolution and sensor strength, and disallow activation within pos shields (not applicable to mining ganglinks).

Enjoying the rain today? ;)

Lin-Young Borovskova
Doomheim
#25 - 2012-08-10 20:56:54 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Actually, I have an even better idea.

Keep fleet boosting off grid, but change ganglinks so that they bloom signature radius by a really huge amount while they're online while also reducing signature resolution and sensor strength, and disallow activation within pos shields (not applicable to mining ganglinks).



Welp this is not actually a real solution, I got your sarcastic comment and actually enjoy it Lol

However in all the myriad of proposed solutions yours it's actually not the worst at all. Blink

brb

James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#26 - 2012-08-10 20:59:25 UTC  |  Edited by: James Amril-Kesh
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Actually, I have an even better idea.

Keep fleet boosting off grid, but change ganglinks so that they bloom signature radius by a really huge amount while they're online while also reducing signature resolution and sensor strength, and disallow activation within pos shields (not applicable to mining ganglinks).



Welp this is not actually a real solution, I got your sarcastic comment and actually enjoy it Lol

However in all the myriad of proposed solutions yours it's actually not the worst at all. Blink

What sarcastic comment are you referring to?
As far as the post you were quoting goes, I was actually entirely serious.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)

Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#27 - 2012-08-10 21:10:39 UTC
Syphon Lodian wrote:


...Command Ships are not meant to be a combat ship. ..


Thats a new one.

If they were not meant to be in combat, why do they get bonuses for gank and tank?

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815

Muad 'dib
Digital Ghosts
#28 - 2012-08-10 21:13:01 UTC
What if their were different boost amounts for on grid vs off grid. On grid being the best of course, then off grid being say half of any link bonuses/gang skills.

Just throwing it out there.

All on grid boosting means that any inty that needs to chase a target from the main gang wont get the benefits etc Theres alot of reasons off grid is good.

Cosmic signature detected. . . . http://i.imgur.com/Z7NfIS6.jpg I got 99 likes, and this post aint one.

Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#29 - 2012-08-10 21:17:44 UTC
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:
Command ships on the field is not that bad as people might think with fake arguments "we'll shoot it first" yadayada, that's a fake argument TBH !!!
Why in hell would you spend alpha volleys on a fast uber tanked brick providing boosts when you can use 1/3 of that energy and stuff to kill other important ships mike tackle and dps ships??? -if some FC's are dumb then let them be.

Actually flying a bait "command ship" would be hilarious.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Lin-Young Borovskova
Doomheim
#30 - 2012-08-10 21:19:30 UTC
Muad 'dib wrote:
Theres alot of reasons off grid is good.



Do you mean there's a lot of reasons making afk off grid boosting something easy to replace another player? -that's not a good thing, it's bad, it's worst than afk mining and harms a lot more the game than the afk guy reading his book or working while mining.

If you can't bring an off grid boost so doesn't someone else witch brings everyone at the same level if you have to bring them on grid. Just make more friends.

brb

Lin-Young Borovskova
Doomheim
#31 - 2012-08-10 21:21:02 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:
Command ships on the field is not that bad as people might think with fake arguments "we'll shoot it first" yadayada, that's a fake argument TBH !!!
Why in hell would you spend alpha volleys on a fast uber tanked brick providing boosts when you can use 1/3 of that energy and stuff to kill other important ships mike tackle and dps ships??? -if some FC's are dumb then let them be.

Actually flying a bait "command ship" would be hilarious.


Well all you need actually it's a bait Keres it seems Blink but this only proves how some FC's are plain awful, even I can't be that bad. And trust me I'm awful at pvp.

brb

Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#32 - 2012-08-10 21:29:19 UTC
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:
If you can't bring an off grid boost so doesn't someone else witch brings everyone at the same level if you have to bring them on grid. Just make more friends.

B-blobbing ?!

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#33 - 2012-08-10 21:29:45 UTC
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:
Command ships on the field is not that bad as people might think with fake arguments "we'll shoot it first" yadayada, that's a fake argument TBH !!!
Why in hell would you spend alpha volleys on a fast uber tanked brick providing boosts when you can use 1/3 of that energy and stuff to kill other important ships mike tackle and dps ships??? -if some FC's are dumb then let them be.

Actually flying a bait "command ship" would be hilarious.

Well all you need actually it's a bait Keres it seems Blink but this only proves how some FC's are plain awful, even I can't be that bad. And trust me I'm awful at pvp.

Oh my. I actually remember Boat or someone else being primaried in their bricked out command ship.

Makalu <3, enemy FC of our hearts.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Klown Walk
Black Rebel Rifter Club
The Devil's Tattoo
#34 - 2012-08-10 21:30:14 UTC
Just nerf the amount they give you, it´s to much. On grid will not help, there is already ways around it.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#35 - 2012-08-10 21:30:37 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:
Command ships on the field is not that bad as people might think with fake arguments "we'll shoot it first" yadayada, that's a fake argument TBH !!!
Why in hell would you spend alpha volleys on a fast uber tanked brick providing boosts when you can use 1/3 of that energy and stuff to kill other important ships mike tackle and dps ships??? -if some FC's are dumb then let them be.

Actually flying a bait "command ship" would be hilarious.


I'm really, really confused....

Bait & Fleet Command Ship are pretty much synonymous....
Every single one of them can field 3x Links, a MWD, and 135k + Tank.... And that's t2 fit without pimp.... They do poor dps, but typically have 80-90% resists across the board, making them a very tough nuts to crack... Sure, they might be called primary in a large fleet batttle, but in small to medium sized gangs, shooting them first is typically ********... That's like primarying a moa over a rupture...
FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#36 - 2012-08-10 21:32:38 UTC  |  Edited by: FloppieTheBanjoClown
Boosting from inside a POS shield should be impossible. Invulnerable boosters are a bad thing.

Yes yes, I know you want to be able to deploy your rorq AND run your gang links AND have zero risk. Maybe it's time you had to make a choice.

I'm curious whether it would be possible and balanced to for someone to get aggression for boosting people who are at war. I'm talking about active gank links, and ONLY for war aggression, not can flips or concord or any other type of aggression that can be spawned without warning.

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.

Lin-Young Borovskova
Doomheim
#37 - 2012-08-10 21:33:05 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:
If you can't bring an off grid boost so doesn't someone else witch brings everyone at the same level if you have to bring them on grid. Just make more friends.

B-blobbing ?!



Blobbing is a players behaviour, not the game's fault. In whatever pvp game numbers matter and you know it as well or better than I do.
Off grid boosting is bad for the game, is bad for everyone starting by CCP. Fake accounts were not, are not and will never be good for them neither on the long run.

brb

Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#38 - 2012-08-10 22:11:16 UTC
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:
If you can't bring an off grid boost so doesn't someone else witch brings everyone at the same level if you have to bring them on grid. Just make more friends.

B-blobbing ?!

Blobbing is a players behaviour, not the game's fault. In whatever pvp game numbers matter and you know it as well or better than I do.
Off grid boosting is bad for the game, is bad for everyone starting by CCP. Fake accounts were not, are not and will never be good for them neither on the long run.

Meh, the fake accounts pay for sub too. But if fleets needed more boosting characters because of (Command ship made better than T3) and (on grid boosting only) there's be a bunch of accounts that would also need months-long training and so on, so it might help.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Muad 'dib
Digital Ghosts
#39 - 2012-08-10 22:16:47 UTC
A link ship is less fun to fly on the battle field than a mining barge in a belt doing its thing.

Give it something fun, not just insanely horrible dps and range, mids for tackle or tank are pwned by co-pros links and if you want an extra link a command module too.

Why not combine some roles for the CS/T3 like logistic rep bonuses, other remote module bonuses tracking links, sensor boosters etc

A logi ship makes a difference by actively repping everyone and its chain and stuff, a link ships job is done if your side wins. not exactly much inspiration for pilots to aim for.

Cosmic signature detected. . . . http://i.imgur.com/Z7NfIS6.jpg I got 99 likes, and this post aint one.

BearJews
Order of Extrodinary Gentlemen
BlackRose.
#40 - 2012-08-10 22:20:55 UTC
Why not just change it to be on grid boost only.