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Miner tears and the new patch.
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Pipa Porto
#141 - 2012-08-09 07:07:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Pipa Porto
Eugene Kerner wrote:
doffmann wrote:
Not this trend again gankers winining about the new barges i love you guys miners never bitches as much as these gank bears buuuhuu i cant kill miners anymore with a triel char maybe grow a pair and go into low sec

http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14276541
they are quite gankable still....you just need more people and by boosting the exhumers you brought together the most antisocial scum of New Eden ( I <3 You ) to work in a team.
Congratulations on that.
Ganking is far beyond dead...I have a dream...where random people group together on Ts and having a blast planning single kills and succeeding with it...


That's not at all a well tanked fit. There's a Yield mod in the mids and an Empty Midslot. Nor was it well flown (he was using the same fit a week and a half ago in the same system when the same people ganked him).
Anyway, the way to tank ganks now is to use a Skiff (or Mack, while it still has it's great tank [the 3rd Low is for a DCII)).
The others presume your method of survival is more active, so you don't need a brick tank.

Ships aren't balanced based on the worst fits you can slap on them.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy
Caldari State
#142 - 2012-08-09 07:21:20 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:
Ships aren't balanced based on the worst fits you can slap on them.


No, ships are balanced around ganking. If it can't be ganked profitably it's not balanced.
pussnheels
Viziam
#143 - 2012-08-09 07:33:40 UTC
Hiyora Akachi wrote:
I logged in today at around 8am Central. Switched to the Help channel and -DROWNED- in the miner tears. Apparently, making anything besides the Hulk a viable miner is like punching a baby repeatedly.


I think you are in denial only miners whinning are those that never read the devblogs and the patch notes , sadly too many of them
If there are people acting like crybabies it is those ' elite pvp' who cry just about anything on here
WWHHHAAA my toranado costing me more than 78 mil iskies how cann i gank miners cheap
WWHHAAAA they buffing barges how can i gank a miner now with my 2 mil lolfit destroyer
WWHHAAA the rebalancing gate guns in low sec , sure i never go into low sec because real people shooting at me out there but i need to whine about something right
WWHHAAA i got a sec rating of - 10 and faction navy in high sec is molesting me i demand unrestricted acces to highsec so i can gank in peace and quiet
WWHHAA CCP is allowing people to play how they want to play and not how i wantthem to play how unfair

etcetcetc
makes me wonder who the real crybabies are and who the real carebears are

I do not agree with what you are saying , but i will defend to the death your right to say it...... Voltaire
Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
Goonswarm Federation
#144 - 2012-08-09 07:34:39 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:
Eugene Kerner wrote:
doffmann wrote:
Not this trend again gankers winining about the new barges i love you guys miners never bitches as much as these gank bears buuuhuu i cant kill miners anymore with a triel char maybe grow a pair and go into low sec

http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14276541
they are quite gankable still....you just need more people and by boosting the exhumers you brought together the most antisocial scum of New Eden ( I <3 You ) to work in a team.
Congratulations on that.
Ganking is far beyond dead...I have a dream...where random people group together on Ts and having a blast planning single kills and succeeding with it...


That's not at all a well tanked fit. There's a Yield mod in the mids and an Empty Midslot. Nor was it well flown (he was using the same fit a week and a half ago in the same system when the same people ganked him).
Anyway, the way to tank ganks now is to use a Skiff (or Mack, while it still has it's great tank [the 3rd Low is for a DCII)).
The others presume your method of survival is more active, so you don't need a brick tank.

Ships aren't balanced based on the worst fits you can slap on them.

http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14276676

Another one...semi tanked but less effort to kill it.

TunDraGon is recruiting! "Also, your boobs [:o] "   CCP Eterne, 2012 "When in doubt...make a diȼk joke." Robin Williams - RIP
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#145 - 2012-08-09 07:39:00 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:
Anyway, the way to tank ganks now is to use a Skiff (or Mack, while it still has it's great tank [the 3rd Low is for a DCII)).
Sir, I must point out the fallacy in your thinking and correct your blasphemous ways.

The third lowslot is obviously for more MLUs. Blink
Dave stark
#146 - 2012-08-09 07:40:48 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Pipa Porto wrote:
Anyway, the way to tank ganks now is to use a Skiff (or Mack, while it still has it's great tank [the 3rd Low is for a DCII)).
Sir, I must point out the fallacy in your thinking and correct your blasphemous ways.

The third lowslot is obviously for more MLUs. Blink


of course it is, else you may as well use a skiff with 2x mlus and still have more tank.
Illest Insurrectionist
Sparta.
#147 - 2012-08-09 07:43:51 UTC
Eugene Kerner wrote:
Pipa Porto wrote:
Eugene Kerner wrote:
doffmann wrote:
Not this trend again gankers winining about the new barges i love you guys miners never bitches as much as these gank bears buuuhuu i cant kill miners anymore with a triel char maybe grow a pair and go into low sec

http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14276541
they are quite gankable still....you just need more people and by boosting the exhumers you brought together the most antisocial scum of New Eden ( I <3 You ) to work in a team.
Congratulations on that.
Ganking is far beyond dead...I have a dream...where random people group together on Ts and having a blast planning single kills and succeeding with it...


That's not at all a well tanked fit. There's a Yield mod in the mids and an Empty Midslot. Nor was it well flown (he was using the same fit a week and a half ago in the same system when the same people ganked him).
Anyway, the way to tank ganks now is to use a Skiff (or Mack, while it still has it's great tank [the 3rd Low is for a DCII)).
The others presume your method of survival is more active, so you don't need a brick tank.

Ships aren't balanced based on the worst fits you can slap on them.

http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14276676

Another one...semi tanked but less effort to kill it.


Less effort pfff... I put plenty of effort into that :D
Pipa Porto
#148 - 2012-08-09 07:44:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Pipa Porto
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
Pipa Porto wrote:
Ships aren't balanced based on the worst fits you can slap on them.


No, ships are balanced around ganking. If it can't be ganked profitably it's not balanced.


Quote and Link where I said all ships must be profitable to gank.
Or Stop Lying.
Seriously, straw man arguments are better if they're not entirely transparent.

In the meantime, the Barges should be balanced with an eye towards how risky they are to fly vs what reward they bring.

The Hulk brings in high rewards with high effort, and should be high risk.
The Mack brings in medium rewards with low effort, so probably should also be high risk (the low effort is worth a fair bit).
The Skiff brings in low rewards with low effort, so probably should be low risk (and what a tank it can fit, even with 2 MLUIIs. 88k Omni and 73.1k vs PP which attacks it's weakest resist)



[Skiff, Tanking Skiff] Please note, I spent about a minute on this fit. I'm sure it can be improved.

Mining Laser Upgrade II
Mining Laser Upgrade II

Medium Shield Extender II
Medium F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Limited 'Anointed' EM Ward Field

Modulated Deep Core Strip Miner II, Mercoxit Mining Crystal II

Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I

Hobgoblin II x3

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#149 - 2012-08-09 07:45:38 UTC
Dave stark wrote:
of course it is, else you may as well use a skiff with 2x mlus and still have more tank.
…and get less ore as a result.
Pipa Porto
#150 - 2012-08-09 07:46:37 UTC
Dave stark wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Pipa Porto wrote:
Anyway, the way to tank ganks now is to use a Skiff (or Mack, while it still has it's great tank [the 3rd Low is for a DCII)).
Sir, I must point out the fallacy in your thinking and correct your blasphemous ways.

The third lowslot is obviously for more MLUs. Blink


of course it is, else you may as well use a skiff with 2x mlus and still have more tank.


But less cargo. Costs and Benefits.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Dave stark
#151 - 2012-08-09 07:46:39 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
Pipa Porto wrote:
Ships aren't balanced based on the worst fits you can slap on them.


No, ships are balanced around ganking. If it can't be ganked profitably it's not balanced.


Quote and Link where I said all ships must be profitable to gank.
Or Stop Lying.
Seriously, straw man arguments are better if they're not entirely transparent.

In the meantime, the Barges should be balanced with an eye towards how risky they are to fly vs what reward they bring.

The Hulk brings in high rewards with high effort, and should be high risk.
The Mack brings in medium rewards with low effort, so probably should also be high risk (the low effort is worth a fair bit).
The Skiff brings in low rewards with low effort, so probably should be low risk (and what a tank it can fit, even with 2 MLUIIs. 88k Omni and 73.1k vs PP which attacks it's weakest resist)



[Skiff, Tanking Skiff] Please note, I spent about a minute on this fit. I'm sure it can be improved.

Mining Laser Upgrade II
Mining Laser Upgrade II

Medium Shield Extender II
Medium F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Limited 'Anointed' EM Ward Field

Modulated Deep Core Strip Miner II, Mercoxit Mining Crystal II

Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I

Hobgoblin II x3

deep core strip, mercoxit crystal, no mercoxit rig?

oh dear.
Pipa Porto
#152 - 2012-08-09 07:47:55 UTC
Eugene Kerner wrote:

http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14276676

Another one...semi tanked but less effort to kill it.


Cargo rig is an anti-tank mod. And again, we see the survey scanner.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Dave stark
#153 - 2012-08-09 07:48:27 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Dave stark wrote:
of course it is, else you may as well use a skiff with 2x mlus and still have more tank.
…and get less ore as a result.


by like 1 cycle every time you want to scoop a jetcan. practically nothing, you'll lose more ore not cutting cycles short when roids are about to pop.
Pipa Porto
#154 - 2012-08-09 07:48:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Pipa Porto
Dave stark wrote:

deep core strip, mercoxit crystal, no mercoxit rig?

oh dear.


That's what I get for editing an old fit without paying enough attention. Oops


(Though the fitting stats for a MDCSMII and a MSMII are the same, so it doesn't actually matter)

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#155 - 2012-08-09 07:50:37 UTC
Dave stark wrote:
[by like 1 cycle every time you want to scoop a jetcan.
…in other words, you get less ore. Not to mention that the suitcase can make the difference between getting the ore and getting insurance money, which is a whole lot less…
Dave stark
#156 - 2012-08-09 07:52:05 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Dave stark wrote:
[by like 1 cycle every time you want to scoop a jetcan.
…in other words, you get less ore. Not to mention that the suitcase can make the difference between getting the ore and getting insurance money, which is a whole lot less…


which is why you use a skiff if you aren't using a third mlu on the mobile jetcan.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#157 - 2012-08-09 07:58:19 UTC
Dave stark wrote:
which is why you use a skiff
…and get less ore. Or you could use a DC2, get more ore, and still not blow up.
Dave stark
#158 - 2012-08-09 08:03:09 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Dave stark wrote:
which is why you use a skiff
…and get less ore. Or you could use a DC2, get more ore, and still not blow up.


but in practice, with roids popping, the simply won't be a difference in yield.
Pipa Porto
#159 - 2012-08-09 08:03:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Pipa Porto
Tippia wrote:
Dave stark wrote:
which is why you use a skiff
…and get less ore. Or you could use a DC2, get more ore, and still not blow up.


Skiff mines the same as the Mack before MLUs.

DCII Mack's advantage over the Skiff is the Ore Hold twice the size of the Skiff's.

If that advantage isn't big enough for you on something you can safely leave AFK, then use a Skiff and set your timer twice as often.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#160 - 2012-08-09 08:21:29 UTC
Dave stark wrote:
but in practice, with roids popping, the simply won't be a difference in yield.
So keep an eye on your rocks.