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Latest patching (Mining)
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#61 - 2012-08-08 19:12:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Anslo wrote:
I see, then this confirms it.
Indeed it does. 75% of EVE players like PvP. There is no way to bend the facts to avoid this simple conclusion.

Quote:
The way YOU phrased your statement indicated that 75% of the population as a whole liked PvP
…which is what the results say: 75% of the sample like PvP. If you want to distrust the representativeness of the sample CCP picked, then that's your (or possibly CCP's) problem and has nothing to do with me. If you cannot grasp how the survey answers work, then that's entirely your problem and has nothing to do with either me or CCP.

So no. Along my line of thinking, upwards of 73% of the population like something that is not PvP, and 10% actively dislike PvP.

Quote:
That statement says that the largest percentage of customers are PvPers.
Which kind of lines up with the whole “75% of the population like PvP” and the simply fact that this percentage is the largest of any of the activities surveyed.
Anslo
Scope Works
#62 - 2012-08-08 19:13:35 UTC
Tiberious Thessalonia wrote:
Yes, because they are. PvPer is not a binary choice. If you make the choice to PvP it does not mean that you are prevented from stepping foot into a mining vessel or playing the market or running missions.


Once again, she framed her response in such a way to make it seem like a binary choice.

baltec1 wrote:
Then that makes them PvPers.


Then that makes 70% Missioners, 60% Miners, 60% Industrialists.

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
Denidil
Cascades Mountain Operatives
#63 - 2012-08-08 19:14:09 UTC
alittlebirdy wrote:
you want hello kitty in space


as a fellow PVPer...


STFU you dumb ****. anyone who starts accusing others of wanting "hello kitty" in space needs to contract me all their items and isk then biomass their own dumb ******* self.

it is literally one of the single dumbest ad hominem arguments i've seen in a ******* MMO forum. grow the **** up you dumb ****.

Tedium and difficulty are not the same thing, if you don't realize this then STFU about game design.
Tiberious Thessalonia
True Slave Foundations
#64 - 2012-08-08 19:14:44 UTC
Anslo wrote:
Tiberious Thessalonia wrote:
Yes, because they are. PvPer is not a binary choice. If you make the choice to PvP it does not mean that you are prevented from stepping foot into a mining vessel or playing the market or running missions.


Once again, she framed her response in such a way to make it seem like a binary choice.
.


She really didn't.
Sentamon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#65 - 2012-08-08 19:14:59 UTC
OP. Throw your computer into a deep lake. Problem solved.

~ Professional Forum Alt  ~
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#66 - 2012-08-08 19:15:33 UTC
Anslo wrote:

Then that makes 70% Missioners, 60% Miners, 60% Industrialists.


Yep.

I myself am an industrialist as well as a pvper.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#67 - 2012-08-08 19:15:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Anslo wrote:
Once again, she framed her response in such a way to make it seem like a binary choice.
Nope. That's just you assuming that PvPing must be a binary choice.

All I said is that 75% of players like PvP, making them the largest group in EVE since no other categorisation reaches the same numbers.

Quote:
Then that makes 70% Missioners, 60% Miners, 60% Industrialists.
…all of which are smaller sets than the 75% PvPer set.
Roll Sizzle Beef
Space Mutiny
#68 - 2012-08-08 19:16:59 UTC
I don't remember the servery specifying what kind of PvP. Ship pew pew, market or otherwise.
Asuka Solo
I N E X T R E M I S
Tactical Narcotics Team
#69 - 2012-08-08 19:17:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Asuka Solo
Yea... I ran the numbers 2 nights ago and threw a tantrum across a few channels when I realized they nerfed ice mining cycle times on the mack.

To fuel my towers, my 6 hour mining fleets 4 times a month will now have to be extended to 9 hours.

And increased yield with the Hulk my ass.... even with its role bonuses and mining upgrade mods, its an estimated 50% -> 60% slower than the old mackinaw per block.

Eve is about Capital ships, WiS, Boobs, PI and Isk!
Tiberious Thessalonia
True Slave Foundations
#70 - 2012-08-08 19:18:08 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Anslo wrote:
Once again, she framed her response in such a way to make it seem like a binary choice.
Nope. That's just you assuming that PvPing must be a binary choice.

All I said is that 75% of players like PvP, making them the largest group in EVE since no other categorisation reaches the same numbers.

Quote:
Then that makes 70% Missioners, 60% Miners, 60% Industrialists.
…all of which are smaller sets than the 75% PvPer set.


And which, as stated, will have some mix and match. What is good for the miner is not necessarily bad for the PvPer. In fact, its relatively seperate.

I'm glad I do all four things! Gives me a lot of choice over what I want to do on any given day.
Tiberious Thessalonia
True Slave Foundations
#71 - 2012-08-08 19:19:11 UTC
Asuka Solo wrote:
Yea... I ran the numbers 2 nights ago and threw a tantrum across a few channels when I realized they nerfed ice mining cycle times on the mack.

To fuel my towers, my 6 hour mining fleets 4 times a month will now have to be extended to 9 hours.

And increased yeild my ass on the hulk.. even with its role bonuses and mining upgrade mods, its an estimated 50% -> 60% slower than the old mackinaw per block.


The ice you mine is not free. Consider doing something more profitable and buying your fuel.
Anslo
Scope Works
#72 - 2012-08-08 19:19:17 UTC
Tippia wrote:
…which is what the results say: 75% of the sample like PvP.


Again, along those lines of thinking, a vast majority prefer NON-PVP activity to PvP. Specifically, 70% missions, 60% mining, 60% industry. There is also no raw data indicating that those who checked off PvP actually pvp'd or just liked the idea. Also, there is no indication that the distribution of the sample for the post is accurate, making your argument poorly supported, save for a colorful graph.

Quote:
If you want to distrust the representativeness of the sample CCP picked, then that's your (or possibly CCP's) problem and has nothing to do with me.


It does when you use that representation as absolute truth when, in fact, it may very well not be.

Quote:
If you cannot grasp how the survey answers work, then that's entirely your problem and has nothing to do with either me or CCP.


In fact I believe I grasp the idea BEHIND sampling and surveying methodologies much better than you.

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#73 - 2012-08-08 19:21:06 UTC
Asuka Solo wrote:
Yea... I ran the numbers 2 nights ago and threw a tantrum across a few channels when I realized they nerfed ice mining cycle times on the mack.

To fuel my towers, my 6 hour mining fleets 4 times a month will now have to be extended to 9 hours.

And increased yield with the Hulk my ass.... even with its role bonuses and mining upgrade mods, its an estimated 50% -> 60% slower than the old mackinaw per block.

Less ice mined = higher prices though. Which is alweays a good thingBlink
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#74 - 2012-08-08 19:22:58 UTC
Anslo wrote:
Tippia wrote:
…which is what the results say: 75% of the sample like PvP.


Again, along those lines of thinking, a vast majority prefer NON-PVP activity to PvP. Specifically, 70% missions, 60% mining, 60% industry. There is also no raw data indicating that those who checked off PvP actually pvp'd or just liked the idea. Also, there is no indication that the distribution of the sample for the post is accurate, making your argument poorly supported, save for a colorful graph.

Quote:
If you want to distrust the representativeness of the sample CCP picked, then that's your (or possibly CCP's) problem and has nothing to do with me.


It does when you use that representation as absolute truth when, in fact, it may very well not be.

Quote:
If you cannot grasp how the survey answers work, then that's entirely your problem and has nothing to do with either me or CCP.


In fact I believe I grasp the idea BEHIND sampling and surveying methodologies much better than you.


You remind me of the global warming deniers and flat earth group.
Roll Sizzle Beef
Space Mutiny
#75 - 2012-08-08 19:23:42 UTC
Asuka Solo wrote:
Yea... I ran the numbers 2 nights ago and threw a tantrum across a few channels when I realized they nerfed ice mining cycle times on the mack.

To fuel my towers, my 6 hour mining fleets 4 times a month will now have to be extended to 9 hours.

And increased yield with the Hulk my ass.... even with its role bonuses and mining upgrade mods, its an estimated 50% -> 60% slower than the old mackinaw per block.


Perhaps it is a temporary burden.
When the POS reworking hits. who knows how the modular fuel requirements will effect you.
Desert Ice78
Gryphons of the Western Wind
#76 - 2012-08-08 19:24:21 UTC
Boadicea Wales wrote:
not owned you also seem to be missing the point.

Have a nice day missing you all ready.


You really are an idiot. You don't even understand what the changes were or why it was changed like that, and so you rush onto the forums to advertise your stupidity for everyone to see.

By all means, keep posting.

I am a pod pilot: http://dl.eve-files.com/media/corp/DesertIce/POD.jpg

CCP Zulu: Came expecting a discussion about computer monitors, left confused.
Anslo
Scope Works
#77 - 2012-08-08 19:24:35 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Anslo wrote:
Tippia wrote:
…which is what the results say: 75% of the sample like PvP.


Again, along those lines of thinking, a vast majority prefer NON-PVP activity to PvP. Specifically, 70% missions, 60% mining, 60% industry. There is also no raw data indicating that those who checked off PvP actually pvp'd or just liked the idea. Also, there is no indication that the distribution of the sample for the post is accurate, making your argument poorly supported, save for a colorful graph.

Quote:
If you want to distrust the representativeness of the sample CCP picked, then that's your (or possibly CCP's) problem and has nothing to do with me.


It does when you use that representation as absolute truth when, in fact, it may very well not be.

Quote:
If you cannot grasp how the survey answers work, then that's entirely your problem and has nothing to do with either me or CCP.


In fact I believe I grasp the idea BEHIND sampling and surveying methodologies much better than you.


You remind me of the global warming deniers and flat earth group.


And you remind me of an emaciated Jay Leno, but you don't see me bringing up bad celebrity similarities do you?

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#78 - 2012-08-08 19:25:18 UTC
Roll Sizzle Beef wrote:
Asuka Solo wrote:
Yea... I ran the numbers 2 nights ago and threw a tantrum across a few channels when I realized they nerfed ice mining cycle times on the mack.

To fuel my towers, my 6 hour mining fleets 4 times a month will now have to be extended to 9 hours.

And increased yield with the Hulk my ass.... even with its role bonuses and mining upgrade mods, its an estimated 50% -> 60% slower than the old mackinaw per block.


Perhaps it is a temporary burden.
When the POS reworking hits. who knows how the modular fuel requirements will effect you.


Cannot wait for this to happen.
Tiberious Thessalonia
True Slave Foundations
#79 - 2012-08-08 19:26:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Tiberious Thessalonia
Anslo wrote:
Tippia wrote:
…which is what the results say: 75% of the sample like PvP.


Again, along those lines of thinking, a vast majority prefer NON-PVP activity to PvP. Specifically, 70% missions, 60% mining, 60% industry. There is also no raw data indicating that those who checked off PvP actually pvp'd or just liked the idea. Also, there is no indication that the distribution of the sample for the post is accurate, making your argument poorly supported, save for a colorful graph.

Quote:
If you want to distrust the representativeness of the sample CCP picked, then that's your (or possibly CCP's) problem and has nothing to do with me.


It does when you use that representation as absolute truth when, in fact, it may very well not be.

Quote:
If you cannot grasp how the survey answers work, then that's entirely your problem and has nothing to do with either me or CCP.


In fact I believe I grasp the idea BEHIND sampling and surveying methodologies much better than you.


Forum derped and ate my post. However, that is not what that answer says, Anslo, and it is disingenuous to try to lump the four answers into 'People who like PvP' and 'People who enjoy other activities' as a binary choice, which you are doing.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#80 - 2012-08-08 19:26:12 UTC  |  Edited by: baltec1
Anslo wrote:

And you remind me of an emaciated Jay Leno, but you don't see me bringing up bad celebrity similarities do you?


Not the worst celeb I have been likened to.