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EVE Online: Inferno 1.2 Feedback

First post First post
Author
Sylvanium Orlenard
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#201 - 2012-08-09 14:36:54 UTC
SmileFrom the perspective if a relatively new player (1.5 months) . . .

LOVE the new toop tip for the modules, really helps me figure out the range of my guns Big smile

I understand how older players whom have already learned my heart all this stuff would find that ennoying, but don,t remove it just add the option to hide or something. . .

Mining Barges +10

I can now effectively mine in my Retreiver and not be lighyears behind the HULK. I can even attempt to mine in Low Sec or even Null Sec using a procurer and have a (relatively) better chance of getting out of there with the skin of my back . . . Thanks Smile


New "Agent Missions" tab bellow the auto-pilot route. NICE

However there is one (small) function I'd like to have added to this. When click on it you have the option to warp to / gate to a station. Why is there not the "align to" option there, (either in the context menu or in the main menu). I'd just like the ability to align to the station I must dock at while I wait for my drones to be recalled . . . I know its a small thing but it would be usefull (for me anyway) .Smile


Everyone please understand that whenever someone designs or (god forbid) changes a UI. For every 1 person that complains about it there is atleast 1 (or more) that loves it but says nothing. (I myself like the Unified Inventory, while I haven't used the old one I can honestly say that I have not had any issues with moving my stuff from one container to an other (and I honeslty prefer not having 20 trillian windows pop-up).
Bruce Blacky
Blacky Invention Research Development YinYang
#202 - 2012-08-09 14:42:13 UTC
Sylvanium Orlenard wrote:
Smile....
I can even attempt to mine in Low Sec or even Null Sec using a procurer and have a (relatively) better chance of getting out of there with the skin of my back . . . Thanks Smile


nope it just takes slightly longer for you to die.
One of the first things you will get on you is a warp scram/disruptor so you will not go anywhere and just wait to die.

cheers
Bruce
Ribikoka
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#203 - 2012-08-09 14:55:47 UTC
Kusum Fawn wrote:
Ok seriously now, where are my neocom buttons for ship hanger and items hanger, and Corp hanger ?

where is corp deliveries button ?

I know where they are in the tree menu. I want them on the Neocom. Deliveries are a much more important function then "move hq here" why does only one of those have a button?

why cant i customize this to my liking?


+1
They promised when 2200 new hate pages generated from Uninv . They tried to playing with time,they think about it maybe we will forget that.
But no, we wont forget this crap inventory tree system. We want those changes.
Alina Altara
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#204 - 2012-08-09 14:58:43 UTC
Its quite interesting, that there are rigs for ice- and mercoxit-mining available now, but i don't understand, why there is no rig for normal mining? (because of declassifying the hulk?)

The other thing is the hulk. i don't see any advantage in it anymore. why should i buy this ship, when i can get nearly the same amount in an other exhumer with less stress? I mean, these role bonuses, so your single/double stripminer is as effective as three. That make not really sense to me.
Except, CCP want to initiate a mineral flood, cause i think that is the consequence of this.

AND my cargo rigs, built in in all my exhumer are now really senseless. So lots of ISK for nothing :-(
Bantara
Dolmite Cornerstone
#205 - 2012-08-09 14:59:48 UTC
CCP Greyscale wrote:
This is however something that happens pretty much every time we make any serious balance changes, and it's been long-standing policy that we don't reimburse skill points due to this kind of change.

Explain to me....
1) How removing a skill and replacing it with something completely unrelated (other than the corporation aspect) is a balancing issue? Those are your words. Balancing would be about bringing two or more things into intended comparative relations with each other. I fail to see how a multi-racial population restriction and the cost of hiring allies in war are comparable.

2) How removing Ethnic Relations and its function is different than the removal of the entire Learning category of skills and their functions. Sounds the same to me yet you treat them differently, and then talk about a "long-standing policy".
Ford Perfekt
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#206 - 2012-08-09 15:39:17 UTC
I love new Mission Overlay. Cool and I have an idea how it could be even better Lol
It would be nice to have mission objectives statuses on the same overview so one could check if the objactives were met with only one cllick.

And I have to say that tab Skill-required for is an really great add-on that was missing til now. Thanks!
Cyxopyc
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#207 - 2012-08-09 15:56:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Cyxopyc
Allow tooltips to be disabled. After my first 6 months of playing EVE I've rarely found them useful and quite often found them in the way.


Also please:

- fix the Tactical Overlay so it always displays properly after jumping systems with it on.
- fix player standings so they always display properly. For example, when I log in and see many players in local as neutral when they aren't neutral and after players jump systems and appear to me as neutral when they aren't neutral. (The second one is is rather good at producing unreimbursable losses)
- allow us to move or disable the view blocking display of notifications top center on the client while still allowing these notifications to be shown in the Log.
- allow Strategic Cruisers to have their cargo bay opened when they are not in use.
- fix the fleet window so it displays correct information and doesn't become broken requiring the fleet members to form a new fleet so they can receive leadership bonuses.
- allow background graphics such as the sun and nebula clouds to be disabled. The stars are fine and don't hinder game play.

Thank you
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
#208 - 2012-08-09 16:07:30 UTC
can you make the tooltips of the reactive armor hardener show how its currently adjusted?

how to fix eve: 1) remove ECM 2) rename dampeners to ECM 3) add new anti-drone ewar for caldari 4) give offgrid boosters ongrid combat value

Jean D'Hon
Doomheim
#209 - 2012-08-09 17:11:39 UTC
CCP Fear wrote:
Regarding the module tool-tip:

We will be adding an option to disable them and possibly a delay as well in a patch very very soon! (Can't say specific dates yet I'm afraid)


When you do, I would like to ask that the "Active" pop-up be revived.

For those of us on scout duty, covertly looking at targets/gates/whs it is comforting to know (by hovering) that the cloak is on. I know it's supposed to glow but in some cases it's not clearly visible (at least to a color impaired noob like me). I prefer to look at my targets than my ship to make sure it's safe...
Misati
Rhea Industries
#210 - 2012-08-09 17:21:06 UTC
Did anyone notice that they removed the Neural Ports on our Backs?
Khoul Ay'd
The Affiliation
#211 - 2012-08-09 18:00:38 UTC
Vash3k5 wrote:
Simple to the point.

Not happy with what was done to the Hulk. Going to buy Mackinaws now. Seems like they are better then the Hulk now.

sigh

correction.

Mackinaw is better than Hulk.



Define "better". If you mean largest ore hold, then yes, Mackinaw is better. If you mean yield, Hulk is still king of all mining.

The things we do today we must live with forever.... Think about it

Mr Beardsley
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#212 - 2012-08-09 18:02:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Mr Beardsley
Idris Helion wrote:
DazedOne wrote:
Layla Ravensclaw wrote:
Maybe was the red horizon patch worster, but what they now did with the minning bargues is also worst.
Cus the smallest ship in that class of t1 minning bargues can carry more ore than a T2 exhumerclassvessel thats its three times bigger than that procuer?

Or the mackinaw has an 35k cargobay for ore thats is 4 timers bigger than in a Hulk , and the mack is 1/3 shorter than a Hulk.!

And than should i said that is good work to the ppls thats work on the patch ? NO
I lost over the half of my cargobay in my hulk . Before the patch was the cargobay 17k for ore and cyrstals ! Now have i 735 cargobay for crystals and a 8500 orebay?
I am mine solo and i need constant big ammount of minerals for my produtionslines.
Thats minningbarguesorecargoholds are total unbalanced and thats is in my eye are reason to said to the programmer team
That works is Crap



Well if you are not working with other people in the game your wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! What do you not understand that the Hulk is now a fleet ship. Learn what the new roles are of the ships and maybe just maybe you'll appreciate the changes like those of us that understand simple things appreciate.


The Hulk always was a fleet ship. People who flew a cargo-maxed Hulk, even in Empire, were doing it wrong. It's just that with the cargo/yield math of the old Hulk, it was a no-brainer to skill for it no matter your mining profile. It rendered other mining ships useless (like the lowly Procurer). Now you have to think a little bit about how you're going to do your mining, and that's obviously cheesing the AFK crowd off. (Though AFK in Empire is now easier than ever with the cavernous Mack ore hold.)

Given the Hulk's enormous cost, flying a Hulk maxed for cargo rather than yield was a silly way to use it. And outside of Empire space, it was just madness to fly a Hulk untanked (even inside Empire during Hulkageddon).

I don't think the complainers have really run the numbers on the advantages the Mack's huge cargo bay will grant to solo miners -- you lose a bit of yield, but make fewer trips back to station. In the end, I'll bet the trade-off will be negligible, or even in favor of the Mack.

Yeah, it sucks that your expensive Hulk is now worth half of what it was a week ago. But if you had a Mack, it's now worth about twice or three times what it was before, so it evens out.


And if you DON'T own a mack then it doesn't, so what's your point? You're also wrong about the "you're doing it wrong", because EVE is a *SANDBOX* as CCP so clearly markets it. This is esp. true for miners who have no friends..try getting someone to haul for you or provide security. See how loyal your precious corp buddies are then. But I have a more important question: WTF is this "AFK mining" people keep mentioning? I'd love to know how you do that, because I've mined with everything and unless you're botting it requires constant attention. On a fully mine-fit Hulk (pre-patch) you could typically hold 2 cycles worth of high-sec ore. Whether you'e alone, dual boxing or have a friend helping there's no "AFK" to it..and thats not even considering the legion of ganker pussies.

Idris is absolutely right about one thing: the size differences in the barge models do seem totally out of sync with thei stats.

Ford Perfekt wrote:
I love new Mission Overlay. Cool and I have an idea how it could be even better Lol
It would be nice to have mission objectives statuses on the same overview so one could check if the objactives were met with only one cllick.

And I have to say that tab Skill-required for is an really great add-on that was missing til now. Thanks!


Also, THIS.

Cyxopyc wrote:
Allow tooltips to be disabled. After my first 6 months of playing EVE I've rarely found them useful and quite often found them in the way.


Also please:

- fix the Tactical Overlay so it always displays properly after jumping systems with it on.
- fix player standings so they always display properly. For example, when I log in and see many players in local as neutral when they aren't neutral and after players jump systems and appear to me as neutral when they aren't neutral. (The second one is is rather good at producing unreimbursable losses)
- allow us to move or disable the view blocking display of notifications top center on the client while still allowing these notifications to be shown in the Log.
- allow Strategic Cruisers to have their cargo bay opened when they are not in use.
- fix the fleet window so it displays correct information and doesn't become broken requiring the fleet members to form a new fleet so they can receive leadership bonuses.
- allow background graphics such as the sun and nebula clouds to be disabled. The stars are fine and don't hinder game play.

Thank you


And THIS. I am sick to DEATH of being blinded by virtual suns!!! Also, that pea-green color for active modules is damn hard to see against anything but pure black space. Sure, you got the little durtation rings going but a pulsing color is MUCH easier to see at a glance.

Although I rarely mine any more due to the armies of risk-averse suicide gankers, I have to agree that the Mack is now the only ship worth using in 90% of situations. Unless their performing a specific role in a fleet, players will always go for the option thats the most effective in the most scenarios - how can the devs possibly not know this??
Khoul Ay'd
The Affiliation
#213 - 2012-08-09 18:15:48 UTC
MortisLegati wrote:
So when is the ORE Frigate coming out? I would have expected it to flank the release of revamped mining barges, especially since the Amarr actually lack a mining frigate.


Actually, I'm expecting they'll release the ORE mining frigate when the current mining frigates get revamped later this fall. See this DevBlog for more info.

The things we do today we must live with forever.... Think about it

Urgg Boolean
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#214 - 2012-08-09 18:24:33 UTC
Maybe someone already asked this, but what happened to the switch to make "shift-click" windows the default? If it's there, I can't find it...
Urgg Boolean
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#215 - 2012-08-09 18:25:27 UTC
Khoul Ay'd wrote:
MortisLegati wrote:
So when is the ORE Frigate coming out? I would have expected it to flank the release of revamped mining barges, especially since the Amarr actually lack a mining frigate.


Actually, I'm expecting they'll release the ORE mining frigate when the current mining frigates get revamped later this fall. See this DevBlog for more info.

In chat the morning of the patch, the Devs said "winter" for the ORE frigate.
Dirch Passer
State War Academy
Caldari State
#216 - 2012-08-09 18:48:47 UTC
I'm happy about most of the improvements in this patch! No doubt about that.
I do, however, feel a bit disappointed about the Unified Inventory. As much as it helps to spawn new windows from Mother Tree, I could have sworn that CCP Arrow promised us a way to glue the shortcuts to the Neocom.
Was that a false promise?
Nitinol
Flat Earth Believers
#217 - 2012-08-09 18:54:33 UTC
CCP Greyscale wrote:
Nitinol wrote:
CCP Greyscale wrote:
James Selkirk wrote:
Rapid patch deployment: check Smile
Client patched cleanly: check Smile
Patch works: check Smile

"Ethnic Relations skill changed into Diplomatic Relations. The old effect of segregating corporations by races is gone, so all corporations can have all races, always. The skill now reduces the cost to hire allies in war. The skill will not be reimbursed as it is not being removed, but changed." (Italics added)

So, Ethnic Relations has a changed name and a changed function, yet somehow this does not count as removing a skill and adding a whole different skill. Because I trained Ethnic Relations to have a multicultural corporation, not to hire allies in wars I'm not about to get into.


From a technical perspective, it's the same type with the same internal ID number. To count as removing a skill and adding a whole different skill - again, from a technical perspective - it'd mean deleting the old skill and adding a new one with a different ID.


This is an unacceptable, and condescending response. Normal user's don't care about the structure of your data tables or whether a row's key has changed.

What I care about, and what James Selkirk cares about, is that you have changed the purpose of a core skill. If you had changed the gunnery skill to affect mining there would be riots in Jita again. Just because the impact is smaller, does not make the error trivial.

I want the SP back for the skill I trained, which no longer exists. period.


I'm just trying to explain why the patchnotes say what they do. We understand that some players will be unhappy with this as they feel that some skills they've trained are less useful to them. This is however something that happens pretty much every time we make any serious balance changes, and it's been long-standing policy that we don't reimburse skill points due to this kind of change. We appreciate that this is not to everyone's liking but we currently feel it's the best way to deal with these situations overall.


Thank you for responding CCP Greyscale. I decided to go back through the old patch notes and see how many times a skill has been removed and/or replaced, while characters were forced to take a new unrelated skill. I wanted to see if there was a precedent, and to be absolutely sure that I'm not not talking out of my ... well, here's what I found:

This seems to be the first time in the history of eve that one skill magically became a different unrelated skill. I'm not sure the *policy* should apply. I do think that it is a better method of handling it than letting the unusable skill exist only as a collectors item; however, the removal of the learning skills and modifications to connection skills seem to have set a precedent.

The wall of text below are the similar changes found in old patch notes, displayed to illustrate my point.

###

Build 3364:
The following skills have had their bonuses changed to capacitor need reduction: Electronic Warfare, Sensor Linking, Weapon Disruption, Propulsion Jamming.

Surely the propulsion jamming skill still effected propulsion jamming modules.

Build 31460:
The Salvage Drone Operation skill was incorrectly added to TQ as a mission reward, and has been removed.

I don't know the impact of this. Were characters able to train the skill before it was removed, or was the listed mission reward simply incorrect? It's not mentioned in the forum thread linked from the patch notes.

Build 3680:
The skill Astronautic Engineering has been taken off the NPC market

Build 69477:
The Chief Financial Officer skill book has been removed from the market.

Build 213149:
All learning skills were removed from characters, and the skill points were reimbursed.

Build 259851:
Accompanying the changes to Agent Divisions, seven ‘Connection’ skills will be removed. The skill books of the old connection skills will be replaced with their new equivalents which are listed below. Players who have the old skills already trained will have those skills removed and receive replacement skillbooks in the hangar of their home station and have the skillpoints reimbursed.

Inferno 1.2:
Ethnic Relations skill changed into Diplomatic Relations. The old effect of segregating corporations by races is gone, so all corporations can have all races, always. The skill now reduces the cost to hire allies in war. The skill will not be reimbursed as it is not being removed, but changed.

###
Khoul Ay'd
The Affiliation
#218 - 2012-08-09 19:17:03 UTC
Bubanni wrote:
Soundwave... a patch should really not be deployed until every thing that people giving feedback about has been fixed... otherwise you really should delay the feature until you can fix it... \


Based on this rationale no patch would ever be released. In my four years in EVE I've never seen a patch that someone didn't have some issue with. Just because your pet peeve wasn't fixed to your satisfaction doesn't mean it wasn't considered, it just means you got over ruled. You can rest assured that someone loves this change.

The things we do today we must live with forever.... Think about it

Lyric Lahnder
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#219 - 2012-08-09 19:34:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Lyric Lahnder
Im pretty Sure Ravenclaw is a troll trying to get miners Ire. Ignore Ravenclaw.

Any one who tries to appear that they have such little understanding of english grammar and spelling is trolling.

Noir. and Noir Academy are recruiting apply at www.noirmercs.com I Noir Academy: 60 days old must be able to fly at least one tech II frigate. I Noir. Recruits: 4:1 k/d ratio and can fly tech II cruisers.

Khoul Ay'd
The Affiliation
#220 - 2012-08-09 21:08:33 UTC
This is an excellent upgrade, THANK YOU CCP!!! Big smile

I offer a few of suggested tweaks for future patches:

  • Allow mining agents to recognize ore holds on your active ship. This should allow you to complete mining missions without having to drag the objective to your personal hanger.

  • Cause ore looted from a jetcan to drop into the ore hold by default, instead of the cargo hold.

  • Mining yield for mining lasers/strippers/harvesters (like the DPS for weapons) in the tool tip.
  • The things we do today we must live with forever.... Think about it