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Planned lowsec sentry "fix" - you guys serious?

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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#701 - 2012-08-07 16:54:29 UTC
TheGunslinger42 wrote:
Sorry bro but we're capable of logic, thats why we recognise these changes as awful. I'm sorry you got ganked after stupidly jumping into amamake, but that doesn't mean any change is a good change. Dry your eyes and you might realise this is going to result in you getting ganked MORE.

Let em get ganked more then. Maybe the sentries will get upgraded to pop big ships even faster, and then faster. And jam and scam and web, maybe.


Just like an immoveable CONCORD. Then it's suicide ganking on the gate, which as we all know, suicide ganking was never meant to be profitable.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Random Majere
Rogue Fleet
#702 - 2012-08-07 17:04:58 UTC
Laughing so hard right now!!
Jauheliha
Soviet Finland
#703 - 2012-08-07 18:38:55 UTC
Syphon Lodian wrote:
Don't fight at gates. Problem solved.

Also don't play docking games.

Your killboard will survive. It'll be okay.


And how are the lowsec pirates supposed to make living after this change?
The gate is the only place where to catch incoming traffic...
Dograzor
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#704 - 2012-08-07 19:42:54 UTC
Ulmagod wrote:
Here is a typical reason why this change has been proposed.

http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/combat_record.php?type=player&name=Tee+Kay
http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/combat_record.php?type=player&name=Kuromugi
http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/combat_record.php?type=player&name=Endureth

These leet pilots sit on the Amamake/Osoggur gate in their Loki's and Tengu's with almost instalock abilities and kill everything that comes through the gate. Like shooting fish in a barrel. Adapt you say, get a fleet up and bait them you say. Well they have thought of that, they have an Orca with them at zero on the gate. If anything remotely dangerous happens, they dock on the Orca and it jumps to high sec.

They are getting wonderful KB stats but what are they really achieving? Making low sec inaccessible for casuals and noobs that's what.

They sit on that gate for a few hours most evenings going ctrl click on their overview with their guns cycling every few minutes. Must be hilarious fun and then they have the analysis of their killboard stats later. Wow I can't wait to be that good.

It is a shame, cause generally I'd be against this change, but when you've got people doing this you can see where CCP are coming from.

+1 to this change.


Well, no. Just no.

This is not a reason to implement this change. Lowsec is lawless space. Not noob/casual friendly space. Eve has always been more then just flying a bigger ship then the enemy or fair fights.

Eve challenges you to use your brains.

For example, having lived in lowsec for a while, in your above scenario I can pick up the following pieces:

1) Amamake. Amamake is the famous lowsec clusterfuck of Eve. If you have lived in lowsec, you know that when you go to the top belt in Amamake, you are guaranteed to have a fight. If you don't believe me, you could just google Amamake:

Quote:
With 6 stargates and 19 stations, this system is packed. True, not every moon has its own station, but some have 3 to make up for that. And 38 agents to keep mission runners busy!

Amamake is the access point between the Hed constellation and the rest of Heimatar. Hed being so well connected, this puts Amamake only 2 jumps from 4 separate regions. - Source - Evewiki


So yes, Amamake is bound to have trouble in it.

2) The characters you linked camping. Reason why they are here: read 1). 2ndly, they are B.A.N.E. (Or heretic w/e nowadays). Amamake is their system, and they will kill in it as usual... and have done so for years.

3) The shiptypes you say. Fastlocking T3's. This game is not about beating those ships, its about knowing roles. You don't want to get caught - use a covert ops while passing through. You want to haul stuff - train for a prorator. You want to mission for some reason in lowsec - use a cloaky t3. Know the roles of your ships, and you can evade this at no point.

And the argument of them being unfair and breaking the game... no. They just got good at what they are doing, and you'll have to start becoming better. Thats how Eve works.

Tbh if you keep dying in lowsec start wondering what you can do to avoid that - instead of pointing fingers at others or at CCP for being unfair.
Random Majere
Rogue Fleet
#705 - 2012-08-07 20:38:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Random Majere
Dograzor wrote:
Lowsec is lawless space. Not noob/casual friendly space. Eve has always been more then just flying a bigger ship then the enemy or fair fights.


No. Null Sec (0.0) is lawless space (even WH space is). Low sec is...well ...it is lower security. I would never qualify low sec as lawless space. You are right on a lot of things you said, but to say that low sec is completly lawless is in my opinion a very wrong assumption and actually provides CCP justification in going ahead with this "proposed" change (if that is how pirates see low sec).
Dograzor
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#706 - 2012-08-07 20:44:34 UTC
Random Majere wrote:
Dograzor wrote:
Lowsec is lawless space. Not noob/casual friendly space. Eve has always been more then just flying a bigger ship then the enemy or fair fights.


No. Null Sec (0.0) is lawless space (even WH space is). Low sec is...well ...it is lower security. I would never qualify low sec as lawless space. You are right on a lot of things you said, but to say that low sec is completly lawless is in my opinion a very wrong assumption and actually provides CCP justification in going ahead with this "proposed" change (if that is how pirates see low sec).


Technically you are right yes. And I know what you mean and I agree with it... What I meant with lawless is that I see it as space where outlaws/pirates like to dwell, so thats why I refer to it as lawless. Pirate
Kingston Black
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#707 - 2012-08-07 22:06:34 UTC
i used to camp gates in T3's as well. Then i got blackops dropped and took an arrow to the knee
sYnc Vir
Wolfsbrigade
Ghost Legion.
#708 - 2012-08-08 00:24:51 UTC  |  Edited by: sYnc Vir
Just for funs we set up a little Archon, 4 bs 1 t3 gate camp. First for 2 hours in losec and then for an hour in prov. Main route too. Cause we here all these people saying every gates camped and such. Given the queue of the their but for the camp people, we figured at lease a couple kills would be ours from blind jumps. If not that, well every gates camped and we'll, at some point get the regular campers too come by and move us on from their spot.

Alas no, even with me scouting in systems in prov telling every roaming gang the damn gate of the carrier, cause it was hour three and good god was I bored. Nothing much happened, couple of tengu's shot at the bait, and some loki died in a fire but that was that.

We did gank the crap out of a goon camping our home station undock. Bad timing for him, funny as **** for a bored fleet. In short, Gate camping is fcuking boring as ****, and doesn't matter what crap you sit on a gate.

If no ones coming, no ones coming.

Is there a way I can get back those three hours? Some people took screen shots in between watching the 2012 Games. Hopefully they will post the awesome emptiness that was our evening.

Don't ask about Italics, just tilt your head.
Herping yourDerp
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#709 - 2012-08-08 00:31:47 UTC
this means a gang of t1 frigs can probably take on a BS or 2 on the gate and get the kill, maybe with some losses but still get it.
also means sec status has more meaning then "zomg i cant go highsec Q_Q"
sYnc Vir
Wolfsbrigade
Ghost Legion.
#710 - 2012-08-08 00:33:44 UTC
Herping yourDerp wrote:
this means a gang of t1 frigs can probably take on a BS or 2 on the gate and get the kill, maybe with some losses but still get it.
also means sec status has more meaning then "zomg i cant go highsec Q_Q"


You can still go to high sec.

I was warping around it in my pilgrim just a few hours ago.

Don't ask about Italics, just tilt your head.
Homo Jesus
The LGBT Last Supper
#711 - 2012-08-08 00:45:11 UTC
Clear the Amamake gate dammit!!!! I want to do something there yo...of course I'm kind of oblivious to the fact that once I'm in space just going into a mission doesn't magically teleport me into a "safe zone". And warping around to planets isn't as fool proof as I think it is. Or hey I know! I'll make a safe by warping from one celestial directly to another and watch for probes like that guide I skimmed told me to do. YESsss That'll work..those stupid impatient pirats will never bust that EVER.

-Carebear Jesus
Medarr
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#712 - 2012-08-08 01:01:14 UTC
hmmm I see a new version of gate camping...

pounce camping.. Since now frigs can sit on the gate and tackle with the rest of the fleet in a gate safe and a cloaky on the other side informing them of juicy tackles... nothing is going to change really.. the frigs tackle while the dps warps in.. pew pew pew.. warp of grid for timer... rinse.. repeat...
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#713 - 2012-08-08 01:06:00 UTC
Medarr wrote:
hmmm I see a new version of gate camping...

pounce camping.. Since now frigs can sit on the gate and tackle with the rest of the fleet in a gate safe and a cloaky on the other side informing them of juicy tackles... nothing is going to change really.. the frigs tackle while the dps warps in.. pew pew pew.. warp of grid for timer... rinse.. repeat...

Yeah, a bit more coordination than just sitting on gate with sebos running, weapons prefired, and an eye on local/overview for a target.

*shrug*

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Kmelx
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#714 - 2012-08-08 11:31:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Kmelx
Strider Hiryu wrote:

The gate guns are not the problem here.
Docking agressed ships into capitals/orcas is.
CCP need to fix the docking of agressed ships into capitals/orcas.

Remove the ability to escape risk free, then see how many people camp in insta locking t3's.
Even with logistics, those ships will die to a superior fleet.

Then theres the fact that t3's are overpowered....
Massive HP, Tiny Sig Radius, Great damage + more bonuses.
But thats for another thread Big smile

In summary, CCP need to fix orca docking and t3's before wreaking gate guns.


One of the few times I've found myself in agreement with any member of Neg Ten on anything, fix the orcas, stop the risk free camping of low sec entry gates with T3s and guys in NPC corps and Orca's this will force the pirates to accept more risk when camping, allowing the camps to be smashed if they can be caught and it will free up access to lowsec in general, then work on gate guns.
arcca jeth
Dark Alliance
#715 - 2012-08-08 18:35:42 UTC
Liang Nuren wrote:
Arkturus McFadden wrote:
True piracy lied in the asteroid belts and safespots, not on a stargate.


True roams lie in fights on the gate, not in the asteroid belt.

-Liang


that's not exactly roaming if you are sitting on a gate all night is it?...Roll
Lin-Young Borovskova
Doomheim
#716 - 2012-08-08 18:41:10 UTC
Jauheliha wrote:
Syphon Lodian wrote:
Don't fight at gates. Problem solved.

Also don't play docking games.

Your killboard will survive. It'll be okay.


And how are the lowsec pirates supposed to make living after this change?
The gate is the only place where to catch incoming traffic...



I'm sure the real ones are not going to live under the bridge from now on, those are better at what they do, they will succeed because they're really good.

The bad ones? -you mean the Timberlake fans "cry me a riveeeeeeer..." ? -peh who cares, adapt or die. Twisted

brb
alittlebirdy
All Hail The Liopleurodon
#717 - 2012-08-08 18:49:19 UTC
Kinda hope they do this... O man sitting on a gate with a hero tankined damnation... LAWLLLL O hey 10 guys why you dying to my one ship OOOO the gate guns killing you too hard? not enough dps? LAWL...
arcca jeth
Dark Alliance
#718 - 2012-08-08 18:52:52 UTC  |  Edited by: arcca jeth
gah double post Roll
arcca jeth
Dark Alliance
#719 - 2012-08-08 18:54:19 UTC
Isalone wrote:
Quote:
CCP Greyscale moves on to explain his work on sentry guns. Sentry guns will now shoot anyone with a criminal flag, suspect or otherwise. Sentry guns will also start with smaller amounts of damage, and ramp up with time. Ideal tuning will be to where triage carriers will die at around 4 1/2 minutes. This way, if you want to use triage carriers in lowsec on gates you can, but you must commit to the cycle for a length of time before starting your reps, if you want to deactivate triage before the sentry guns kill you and jump out. CCP Greyscale also points out that another goal is to make it so that the first couple of hits won't kill an interceptor immediately, enabling a quick tackle, and then a warp out.


I've lived in lowsec for quite a while now and gotta tell you - this is probably gonna cause as much "whine 'n' unsub" threads as nex store/greed is good did. For those who don't go to low often - most of fleet/gang fights in low take place at gates. If gateguns are gonna pop carriers 4.5mins into the fight, cruiser/bc fleets going gcc on a gate aren't gonna happen at all. When was the last time you have seen a carrier at a gate? I don't think I've ever seen one.

Gatecamps - those aren't the problem, people who won't learn/adapt are. You can easily get through all of them, just do a little research.

discuss, lol


BUT LOWSECKS IS EMPTYE!??!!

well sounds like you need to learn/adapt to this change else you become "part of the problem"

gate camps should be a NULL sec thing, so go camp a gate or station in NULL then, problem solved
lastriko1
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#720 - 2012-08-09 14:09:12 UTC  |  Edited by: lastriko1
this is terrible news for me as lowsec pirate, i hope that CCP do not do this What? otherwise its maybe time to look for diffrend game...
its easy enough for carebears, for pirates is harder and harder every time they making a changes