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Barge Fairy Tale

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Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#2881 - 2012-08-07 21:49:43 UTC
Nerf Burger wrote:
they prob eventually came realize that suicide ganking involves zero risk, zero skill and only hurts the game to the benefit of low-life trash who dedicate countless hours to the goal of annoying others, probably out of their own frustrations in life. Why would CCP continue to enable a minority of d-bags when the majority of their income comes from people who just like spaceships? It doesn't make sense.


please don't say anything regarding "risk" when you're explicitly saying that the only risk left in hisec should be eliminated

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#2882 - 2012-08-07 21:50:51 UTC
Pankas Carter wrote:
Yea, I admit I'm being contrarian mostly to be a jerk. That said, I really wish you all would stop pretending you're doing nothing "wrong" - it's not the victim's fault. Whether or not what you did is a crime is not my debate, my debate is the fact that the miner didn't grab your hand, push the gun to his head, and pull your trigger.


please keep up these uncreative comparisons of ganking to real-life murder

they are absolutely hilarious

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Pipa Porto
#2883 - 2012-08-07 21:51:03 UTC
Pankas Carter wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
I remember when people would get mocked endlessly when they'd cry about losing their multibillion ISK ships on gates to gankers, having their stuff looted and probably even salvaged. Now everyone just has sympathy for the poor ~victim~ and they bleat risk/reward re: suicide ganking, despite it being literally the only risk left for anybody in hisec that isn't dumb enough to mine/haul/run missions during wardecs.


Well, lets step back a minute and take stock:

You're a goon. Most of us would probably defend kicking puppies just to contradict you. Hide your corporation/alliance on the forum or post with an alt, if you want to have a rational discussion. I'm sorry, but that's the way things work. You all earned that reputation.



Well that's some impressive courage of your convictions. You'd condone kicking puppies out of spite for the person saying it's wrong to kick puppies.

You realize, of course that you've gone ahead and conceded the point by saying that? If there is no way you can conceive of changing your mind about a topic (esp just because of the other person's affiliations), you're taking part in an argument anymore. You're just making noise.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Pankas Carter
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#2884 - 2012-08-07 21:51:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Pankas Carter
(edit ate my post)

Just go re-read what I said elsewhere. I'm not going to change my opinion because you said "na-uh!"

Adama: Starbuck, what do you hear? Starbuck: Nothing but the rain. Adama: Then grab your gun and bring in the cat.
Pankas Carter
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#2885 - 2012-08-07 21:52:44 UTC
Richard Desturned wrote:
Pankas Carter wrote:
Yea, I admit I'm being contrarian mostly to be a jerk. That said, I really wish you all would stop pretending you're doing nothing "wrong" - it's not the victim's fault. Whether or not what you did is a crime is not my debate, my debate is the fact that the miner didn't grab your hand, push the gun to his head, and pull your trigger.


please keep up these uncreative comparisons of ganking to real-life murder

they are absolutely hilarious


Fine. Replace guns with creme pies if you want. Then there's no crime, real or imagined, but you're still putting someone's face into the pie.

Adama: Starbuck, what do you hear? Starbuck: Nothing but the rain. Adama: Then grab your gun and bring in the cat.
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#2886 - 2012-08-07 21:53:48 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Pankas Carter wrote:

These consequences are completely arbitrary. As he said, he didn't explode for no reason. Someone made a decision to shoot him. The fault lies with the shooter, period.

Lets be clear here: i'm not saying ganking is necessarily wrong. You just need to accept the fact that the ganker is responsible for pulling the trigger. If bitching/whining/patching is the result of abusing it, well, that's your own damn fault.


The person wouldnt be ganked if it wasnt worth it. It all ends with the victims choice, be it putting too much wealth in a poorly tanked ship or jumping blind into a bubble camp. It was the victim who put the cogs in motion.

I've done both of the things you mentioned, and in each case thought to myself, "In hindsight, that was pretty dumb." But it doesn't change the fact that a friendly group of HIC's and nano pests in one instance and a mael (pre gank insurance nerf) were more than happy to make themselves available to teach me those lessons.
Pipa Porto
#2887 - 2012-08-07 21:54:09 UTC
Nerf Burger wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
I remember when people would get mocked endlessly when they'd cry about losing their multibillion ISK ships on gates to gankers, having their stuff looted and probably even salvaged. Now everyone just has sympathy for the poor ~victim~ and they bleat risk/reward re: suicide ganking, despite it being literally the only risk left for anybody in hisec that isn't dumb enough to mine/haul/run missions during wardecs.


they prob eventually came realize that suicide ganking involves zero risk, zero skill and only hurts the game to the benefit of low-life trash who dedicate countless hours to the goal of annoying others, probably out of their own frustrations in life. Why would CCP continue to enable a minority of d-bags when the majority of their income comes from people who just like spaceships? It doesn't make sense. Greifers are trash people and I'm glad CCP is finally taking away their easymode.


So, besides Suicide Ganks, what "risks" do miners in HS face? Please note that Miners derive no benefit from being in a Player corp, so AWOAXing isn't a risk, and even if wardecs weren't trivial to avoid, Wardecs aren't a risk.

Belt Rats?

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Yeep
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#2888 - 2012-08-07 21:54:55 UTC
Pankas Carter wrote:

Yea, I admit I'm being contrarian mostly to be a jerk. That said, I really wish you all would stop pretending you're doing nothing "wrong" - it's not the victim's fault. Whether or not what you did is a crime is not my debate, my debate is the fact that the miner didn't grab your hand, push the gun to his head, and pull your trigger.


Firstly there is nothing "wrong" with destroying another pilot's ship so long as you don't use an exploit to do it.

Secondly, you can be at fault without being responsible. You can be at fault without something being your fault. Its not your fault your hulk exploded but you were at fault for not tanking it or watching local or aligning.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#2889 - 2012-08-07 21:55:07 UTC
Nerf Burger wrote:

they prob eventually came realize that suicide ganking involves zero risk, zero skill and only hurts the game to the benefit of low-life trash who dedicate countless hours to the goal of annoying others, probably out of their own frustrations in life. Why would CCP continue to enable a minority of d-bags when the majority of their income comes from people who just like spaceships? It doesn't make sense. Greifers are trash people and I'm glad CCP is finally taking away their easymode.


suicide ganking involves 100% risk, takes more skill than shown by the victims, in no way hurts the game and benefits lowlifes who dedicate hours to making a fortune in isk. Why would CCP get rid of a corserstone of its gameplay that has been with us for 9 years?
Pankas Carter
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#2890 - 2012-08-07 21:57:11 UTC
Yeep wrote:
Pankas Carter wrote:

Yea, I admit I'm being contrarian mostly to be a jerk. That said, I really wish you all would stop pretending you're doing nothing "wrong" - it's not the victim's fault. Whether or not what you did is a crime is not my debate, my debate is the fact that the miner didn't grab your hand, push the gun to his head, and pull your trigger.


Firstly there is nothing "wrong" with destroying another pilot's ship so long as you don't use an exploit to do it.

Secondly, you can be at fault without being responsible. You can be at fault without something being your fault. Its not your fault your hulk exploded but you were at fault for not tanking it or watching local or aligning.


Mmm, true enough. ... and I thought I said I didn't think there was anything wrong with it. My problem is with the person doing the shooting pretending they didn't act, and that the target just magically exploded on their own.

Adama: Starbuck, what do you hear? Starbuck: Nothing but the rain. Adama: Then grab your gun and bring in the cat.
Pipa Porto
#2891 - 2012-08-07 21:57:33 UTC
Pankas Carter wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
Pankas Carter wrote:
Yea, I admit I'm being contrarian mostly to be a jerk. That said, I really wish you all would stop pretending you're doing nothing "wrong" - it's not the victim's fault. Whether or not what you did is a crime is not my debate, my debate is the fact that the miner didn't grab your hand, push the gun to his head, and pull your trigger.


please keep up these uncreative comparisons of ganking to real-life murder

they are absolutely hilarious


Fine. Replace guns with creme pies if you want. Then there's no crime, real or imagined, but you're still putting someone's face into the pie.


Which is Assault. Which is a Crime.

Since it's an unknown substance, and it's probably gonna get into a mouth, nose, or eye, some states statutes for attempted murder might cover it as well (East Coast states especially take dim views on poisonings, and their laws were written a long time ago, so their murder/attempted murder statutes are pretty fun like that).

If you're talking about a Clown at a Carnival, where he's consented to take part (like the miners consenting when they Log in/Undock), then yes, there's no crime, but then your analogy kind of falls apart.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#2892 - 2012-08-07 21:58:00 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:
Belt Rats?


if belt rats provide any risk I guess the chance-based nature of wreck loot is also risk

funny how that works!

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Sentamon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#2893 - 2012-08-07 21:59:05 UTC
baltec1 wrote:

suicide ganking involves 0% risk, takes no skill, makes casual players quit, and benefits lowlife scared of real PvP gankers who dedicate hours to making a fortune in isk Why would CCP throw out the trash instead of letting it fester and stink up the place?


I ganked your thoughts, how you like it?

~ Professional Forum Alt  ~
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#2894 - 2012-08-07 21:59:48 UTC
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
I've done both of the things you mentioned, and in each case thought to myself, "In hindsight, that was pretty dumb." But it doesn't change the fact that a friendly group of HIC's and nano pests in one instance and a mael (pre gank insurance nerf) were more than happy to make themselves available to teach me those lessons.


Gankers are not responsable for your actions, just the consiquencesBlink
Pankas Carter
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#2895 - 2012-08-07 22:00:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Pankas Carter
edit: you know what? no. I'm done arguing with trolls and their cousins.

Adama: Starbuck, what do you hear? Starbuck: Nothing but the rain. Adama: Then grab your gun and bring in the cat.
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#2896 - 2012-08-07 22:00:58 UTC
Sentamon wrote:
I ganked your thoughts, how you like it?


again I find it hilarious that people bleat "risk/reward" re: the only thing that provides any meaningful risk to hiseccers

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#2897 - 2012-08-07 22:01:29 UTC
Sentamon wrote:
baltec1 wrote:

suicide ganking involves 0% risk, takes no skill, makes casual players quit, and benefits lowlife scared of real PvP gankers who dedicate hours to making a fortune in isk Why would CCP throw out the trash instead of letting it fester and stink up the place?


I ganked your thoughts, how you like it?

Oh I'm sure they'll get around to "PvP gankers" soon enough.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
minerdave
wiggle Tech.
#2898 - 2012-08-07 22:01:35 UTC
I find it somewhat amusing that people are getting all butthurt over the fact that a bunch of ships are getting a bit of a much needed tank upgrade rather than having a tank made of Cardboardium™ Alloy and there T2 Counterparts being made of of TinFoilium™ enhanced Cardboardium™ Alloy
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#2899 - 2012-08-07 22:03:03 UTC
and hey let's turn the tables a bit here

suicide gankers have allegedly enjoyed "risk-free" PvP for years, and crimewatch will allow their looting alts to be shot at by anyone, with neutral RR that they can't shoot

why should the "vigilantes" enjoy risk-free PvP?

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Nerf Burger
Doomheim
#2900 - 2012-08-07 22:05:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Nerf Burger
Richard Desturned wrote:
Nerf Burger wrote:
they prob eventually came realize that suicide ganking involves zero risk, zero skill and only hurts the game to the benefit of low-life trash who dedicate countless hours to the goal of annoying others, probably out of their own frustrations in life. Why would CCP continue to enable a minority of d-bags when the majority of their income comes from people who just like spaceships? It doesn't make sense.


please don't say anything regarding "risk" when you're explicitly saying that the only risk left in hisec should be eliminated



I'd also hate my player base for all the moronic assumptions.

I never said suicide ganking should be eliminated. Like soundwave, I LOVE that it is possible. I just don't think it should be profitable, easy, and with such a predictable result. This game is easy enough for griefers as it is. Its amazing how so many think catering to d-bags is somehow sustainable in what is supposed to be a sandbox game. You want to see a game population where the wolves outnumber the sheep and no safety zones? Take a look at Darkfall.