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How Would It Work: Spaceship Turns
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Hiyora Akachi
Izia Freight Limited
#41 - 2012-07-26 21:34:44 UTC
On a ship with the engines lined up horizontal you could just fire the engines on one side.


Engines:

oo|oo


Fire one or both of the engines on either side of the divide to turn at a semi controllable speed (it's space, control is relative)
Akirei Scytale
Okami Syndicate
#42 - 2012-07-26 21:42:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Akirei Scytale
Hiyora Akachi wrote:
On a ship with the engines lined up horizontal you could just fire the engines on one side.


Engines:

oo|oo


Fire one or both of the engines on either side of the divide to turn at a semi controllable speed (it's space, control is relative)


That is extremely inefficient, as the horizontal component of your thrust is miniscule. Also, it would not allow much control, as you're forcing your ship to accelerate forwards as well, just to turn. This only lets a ship turn in very, very wide arcs, all while using up several orders of magnitude more fuel / energy than it would with a small lateral thruster. It also makes it 100% impossible for a ship to turn while maintaining a constant speed.
Lors Dornick
Kallisti Industries
#43 - 2012-07-26 22:15:21 UTC
Akirei Scytale wrote:
EVE would be like a bunch of fat men sitting on a frozen lake with rocket boosters strapped to their asses playing laser tag..


Hmm, now there's a game I'd like to see ;)

But maybe not play ...

CCP Greyscale: As to starbases, we agree it's pretty terrible, but we don't want to delay the entire release just for this one factor.
Unimaginative Guy
Dutch Squad
#44 - 2012-07-27 01:19:32 UTC
Eve ships should have huge-ass thrusters on the front of them like the stilletto corvet from nexus:The Jupiter Incident!

Imagine two huge rockets on the front of the drake arms Cool
Unimaginative Guy
Dutch Squad
#45 - 2012-07-27 01:21:05 UTC
Akirei Scytale wrote:
Hiyora Akachi wrote:
On a ship with the engines lined up horizontal you could just fire the engines on one side.


Engines:

oo|oo


Fire one or both of the engines on either side of the divide to turn at a semi controllable speed (it's space, control is relative)


That is extremely inefficient, as the horizontal component of your thrust is miniscule. Also, it would not allow much control, as you're forcing your ship to accelerate forwards as well, just to turn. This only lets a ship turn in very, very wide arcs, all while using up several orders of magnitude more fuel / energy than it would with a small lateral thruster. It also makes it 100% impossible for a ship to turn while maintaining a constant speed.


Glad someone here has a fundamental education in modern physics. Actually its in space so i dont think there would be ANY horizontal component. If it were in air then the air resistance would cause the turning but in space there is no resistance.
Akirei Scytale
Okami Syndicate
#46 - 2012-07-27 01:34:11 UTC
Unimaginative Guy wrote:
Akirei Scytale wrote:
Hiyora Akachi wrote:
On a ship with the engines lined up horizontal you could just fire the engines on one side.


Engines:

oo|oo


Fire one or both of the engines on either side of the divide to turn at a semi controllable speed (it's space, control is relative)


That is extremely inefficient, as the horizontal component of your thrust is miniscule. Also, it would not allow much control, as you're forcing your ship to accelerate forwards as well, just to turn. This only lets a ship turn in very, very wide arcs, all while using up several orders of magnitude more fuel / energy than it would with a small lateral thruster. It also makes it 100% impossible for a ship to turn while maintaining a constant speed.


Glad someone here has a fundamental education in modern physics. Actually its in space so i dont think there would be ANY horizontal component. If it were in air then the air resistance would cause the turning but in space there is no resistance.


I think there would be a very, very tiny one as the thrusters are not directly on the ship's central axis. Therefore they're slowly rotating it around its center of mass.
Lord Arakkis
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#47 - 2012-07-27 02:28:30 UTC
If you believe some scientists common theory, ships wont actually turn at all. They will be like boxes with thrusters pretty much pointing in 8 axis' and movement will be in mostly straight lines along 4 axis'. It is believed that ships at this time will have displays that show a full 360 area.

Your still a child in the eyes of the universe
Herr Hammer Draken
#48 - 2012-07-27 03:18:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Herr Hammer Draken
Bootleg Jack wrote:
I like how there are a lot fo smart assed remarks about how ships move, but so few suggestions.

So tell us, in space how would a ship turn?

Would the ship have retro rockets on the front to help turning?
Would the retros be strong enough to spin the ship, or strong enough to actually effect its course?
Would the ship spin around and fire its main engines to change course?
Would the retros cause the ship to arc through a turn?
etc...



There are many different ways this could be done depending on tech available into the construction of the ship.
The limit is always in the structural integrity of the ship. Every ship will have some sort of main engine thrust.

The engineering of the engine mount is dependant upon materials available to the constructors of the ship.

Most often the main engines will be fixed, as in solid mount to the ship, but they could be mounted on gimbals and turnable or they can have thrust vectoring. Neither of these later options will be as strong in total thrust as a solid mount engine would be. Because of the strength of materials used and sheer forces involved.

Then one needs some retro thrusters in the bow of the ship to aim the bow in the new direction of travel.
Thrust vectoring and gimbal main engine mounts would not need as much retro thrusters but would both still benefit from them.

Keep in mind the mass of the ship will continue on the same path at the same speed until a new force acts upon it.
No matter which way it faces.
Now if you are aware of vector math one needs to steer, or over steer the new heading then add thrust from the main engine to effect a new heading. Because your original heading track will continue until it is countered by a portion of the new vector thrust. So in order to take up a new heading you have to kill your original heading which requires some opposite force. You can do this with a little bit of force applied over a long time or a lot of force over a short time. (Think a little oversteer at full throttle for a long time or a lot of oversteer at full throttle for a short duration or any thing in between.) It all works to kill the original heading which is equal to the mass times the velocity= the amount of force that you have to negate to establish your new heading.
Thus your path thru space can be almost any shape you want and will not track at all to the facing of the ship in many cases until all residual vector of an old heading is killed. At that time you have to take off your over steer or you will eventually over correct and turn beyond your intended new heading.

If EVE had this kind of real newtonian flight model everyone would spend all of their time just flying the ship around and fighting another ship would be a joke mostly. Just trying to keep another ship in range would be a feat in itself.
Docking huh forget it. Ever try to land a plane in a flight sim in realistic mode? Docking would be 10 times harder.

Herr Hammer Draken "The Amarr Prophet"
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