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Tech Rebuff

Author
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#81 - 2012-07-26 02:26:06 UTC
Hakaru Ishiwara wrote:
EvilweaselSA wrote:
people advocating moon rotation are, universally, friendless nobodies who hate the fact 0.0 rewards having friends
They also do not recall that it was a rejiggering by CCP in the Dominion expansion (December 2009) of the Tech 2 manufacturing inputs which, in turn, altered the demand for various moon-derived materials.

CCP knew exactly what they were doing and they sat on their hands for over 2.5 years letting this nonsense fester.

Back on-topic: Change the Tech 2 manufacturing inputs and *poof* the demand for various moon materials is altered.

Our ~sea of blues~

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Corina Jarr
en Welle Shipping Inc.
#82 - 2012-07-26 03:04:53 UTC
Making any change that limits the flow of Tech to the Alliances that holds them would only make the prices we (as the consumer) get worse.

Work goes up (or supply drops), prices go up.


Alchemy for tech is (if I understand it correctly) similar to invention for T2 BPOs. A way to add supply from other sources.
highonpop
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#83 - 2012-07-27 13:43:09 UTC  |  Edited by: highonpop
Takeshi Yamato wrote:
highonpop wrote:
Regardless of tech or any moon goo


Alchemy should stay in Fantasy MMOs not in SciFi MMOs.

New Dev doesn't understand EVE yet.


Transmutation of elements is real. Particle accelerators transmute elements on a regular basis. Transmutation also takes place in nuclear plants and during thermonuclear explosions.

At our current technology level it's mostly only of scientific interest and a side effect of nuclear power generation, but in a science fiction universe it's not too far fetched to imagine that it could be used on an industrial scale to create rare and valuable elements.



In understand the concept of synthetic materials. But having some magical formula of, put in 2 trit and 1 scord and wave your magic wand and get morphite is not creating synthetic materials.

If I understand this correctly, and I hope I don't, then you will be able to take 'naturally occurring' elements in New Eden and turn them into other 'naturally occurring' elements. This is not the same as making synthetic materials in a laboratory.

If I can take 'naturally occurring' elements from New Eden and get new synthetic materials that have the same use as other 'naturally occurring' elements of New Eden, that would be cool.

FC, what do?

Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#84 - 2012-07-27 13:51:45 UTC
Didn't the devblog introducing "alchemy" say it was representing innovation or something.

Like having two ways you can duct tape frigates to make a tornado. (one uses Rifters, the other uses Hounds?)

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Nylith Empyreal
Sutar Rein
#85 - 2012-07-27 14:16:00 UTC
Omg that pubbie is threatening our moons, we earned these moons, and with the rewards gained we ****** everyone else, now they're whining, now the dev's are doing something, procede aggressive forum bashing.

What is the point, move moons, someone takes holds, now you have 10 assholes versus 1 whom are rather content in their own regions, leaving the rest to renters pets and bromance. Fade moons, assholes conquer the new moons from the unfortunate alliance it falls upon, using the isk from their previous gains they come and retake with ease. Would we have more fights or more shooting ranges?

Honestly given the age of things from a bunch of lowly city-states and small empires, Alexander was bound to show up to create an empire and now we have multiple empires. Just wait, the Romans ran themselves to the ground the Persians got screwed by raiders, and Attila the hun is around the corner. Honestly be the better 'Great', if you studied half of what BoB, GS, RA, Solar etc did you should have atleast half the map.

Who's the more foolish the fool or the fool who replies to him?

Hiyora Akachi
Blood Alcohol Content
T O P S H E L F
#86 - 2012-07-27 14:20:53 UTC
I kinda like the idea of Alchemy.


I wish to turn every Minmatar ship I come across into gold so that I don't bleed from my eyes when I look at them.
flakeys
Doomheim
#87 - 2012-07-27 14:24:06 UTC
Ivana Twinkle wrote:
You're just jealous because you haven't achieved anything on your own.



Irony overload coming from a goon Lol

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.

Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#88 - 2012-07-27 14:25:19 UTC
Nylith Empyreal wrote:
Would we have more fights or more shooting ranges?

Shooting ranges are fine.

Do we get leaked enemy comms from it?

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Lady Zarrina
New Eden Browncoats
#89 - 2012-07-27 14:26:14 UTC
Make Tech 3 mods. Then I no longer need to worry about tech :)

But seriously, the goons will run outta things to do, the alliance will eventually collapse from within due to greed, ambition or boredom. Currently, they have won null sec. It will eventually reset on its own, like it has many times before. Then someone else can try to get all these moons.

PS I have no idea if these alchemy changes will help solve this issue and is the best solution. But it is better than no change. Generally I am in favor of depleting resources, but I can understand why many are against it. I think they are wrong, but I can understand :)

EVE: All about Flying Frisky and Making Iskie

Nylith Empyreal
Sutar Rein
#90 - 2012-07-27 14:27:24 UTC
You got a few from -A- didn't you?

Who's the more foolish the fool or the fool who replies to him?

Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#91 - 2012-07-27 14:28:14 UTC
Hiyora Akachi wrote:
I kinda like the idea of Alchemy.


I wish to turn every Minmatar ship I come across into gold so that I don't bleed from my eyes when I look at them.

You mean like

Amarr gold plating?

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Colonel Xaven
Perkone
Caldari State
#92 - 2012-07-27 14:36:13 UTC
RAGE QU1T wrote:
Allchemy didn't work in '08 and will not work in 2012. Please let us all give this new dev a history lesson. The major problem with tech is the allocation the R64 moon to one region (the north) in which a few select alliances can generatate infinte isk and "Win EVE". With the proposed reaction outputt of tech therre is no incentive for other allainces or corps to run muliple POS's with the added expense of fuel I would be losing money on a weekly basis. All this is just skirting around a broken problem that exsisted for years. Allchemy was removed for good reason in the first place, all I see happening is T2 gear will mos def increase, how does everyone fell about paying 3 to 4mil isk for a gyro II?

Floor is open for constructive criticism, questions or concerns

O/


You seem to have some kind of magic ability to see details about the future. show them before ur very own opinion.

www.facebook.com/RazorAlliance

Big Bossu
Primal Instinct Inc.
The Initiative.
#93 - 2012-07-27 14:47:33 UTC
Just going to point out that CCP removed static plexes. There was plenty of whine, how space will be useless to hold, "we worked hard to secure this space" and it will take too long to find them and what not. In the end, they just boosted probing and ultimately we got a much better pve mechanic.

If ccp boosted moon survey(for example deep space moon mineral probe and lower flight times), moons moving wouldn't hurt the game at all.
Gillia Winddancer
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#94 - 2012-07-27 14:49:29 UTC
The tech fail lies not in the fact that the resources are only in a specific area in the universe, but the fact that it is a passive generator with 0 effort to get. Throw in the subtle fact how PoS's work with their nifty shields and 24 hour immunity and so on and so forth. Whilst the PoS system is not the main issue to the problem it definitely adds a layer to it and cannot be ignored completely.

Whilst I currently could care less who owns what as it does not really affect me in a major way, I still do feel that the resource system in EVE is...flawed.

Asteroid belts, whilst requiring "active" play in order to acquire minerals are still static and always in the same location day in day out ad infinitum.

Moons are in an even worse situation. Once a station and the necessary modules are set up - wham. 0 effort to acquire whatever the moons may have. "Refueling stations taking effort" nonsense excuses will be subtly ignored - at least until the day when supply chains are in EVE aka the elimination of jumping. (again, funny how things are so beautifully tied to one another if you look at the whole picture).

Going back to tech, it doesn't really matter too much that it can only be found in certain parts. Done right, this would actually be a GOOD thing. Rare stuff is rare after all. Now, if people actually had to put effort into getting tech and say actively mine it somehow else then it would be ten steps to the right direction. If nothing else it would require:

A: More effort to get the rare stuff insted of less. The actual acquirement of the stuff should be an active effort. Then the PoS's should be used to process the stuff and whatnot else.

B: It would give enemies and such at least a better chance in disrupting/choking/whatever the system owners , even without the need for mega-blobs. Of course, effort would still be required.


Now this won't really "solve" any problems but it would definitely improve the balancing scale somewhat.

As for how this would affect prices and stuff - well, who cares. Fix the mechanics and let prices adjust to whatever. People will adapt regardless of whatever whine that may come out of it.
Pipa Porto
#95 - 2012-07-27 14:52:06 UTC
Gillia Winddancer wrote:
The tech fail lies not in the fact that the resources are only in a specific area in the universe, but the fact that it is a passive generator with 0 effort to get. Throw in the subtle fact how PoS's work with their nifty shields and 24 hour immunity and so on and so forth. Whilst the PoS system is not the main issue to the problem it definitely adds a layer to it and cannot be ignored completely.


Yes, defense fleets take 0 Effort to put together.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto

Mallak Azaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#96 - 2012-07-27 14:57:08 UTC
Gillia Winddancer wrote:
The tech fail lies not in the fact that the resources are only in a specific area in the universe, but the fact that it is a passive generator with 0 effort to get.


You mean I can get my very own Tech moon with out having to scan moons, set up a POS, refuel it, collect the goo or defend the tower!? Sign me up bro.

This post was lovingly crafted by a member of the Goonwaffe Posting Cabal, proud member of the popular gay hookup site somethingawful.com, Spelling Bee, Grammar Gestapo & #1 Official Gevlon Goblin Fanclub member.

Pipa Porto
#97 - 2012-07-27 14:58:02 UTC
Mallak Azaria wrote:
Gillia Winddancer wrote:
The tech fail lies not in the fact that the resources are only in a specific area in the universe, but the fact that it is a passive generator with 0 effort to get.


You mean I can get my very own Tech moon with out having to scan moons, set up a POS, refuel it, collect the goo or defend the tower!? Sign me up bro.


SISI ------------>

Bear

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto

Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#98 - 2012-07-27 15:27:01 UTC
Colonel Xaven wrote:
RAGE QU1T wrote:
Allchemy didn't work in '08 and will not work in 2012. Please let us all give this new dev a history lesson. The major problem with tech is the allocation the R64 moon to one region (the north) in which a few select alliances can generatate infinte isk and "Win EVE". With the proposed reaction outputt of tech therre is no incentive for other allainces or corps to run muliple POS's with the added expense of fuel I would be losing money on a weekly basis. All this is just skirting around a broken problem that exsisted for years. Allchemy was removed for good reason in the first place, all I see happening is T2 gear will mos def increase, how does everyone fell about paying 3 to 4mil isk for a gyro II?

Floor is open for constructive criticism, questions or concerns

O/


You seem to have some kind of magic ability to see details about the future. show them before ur very own opinion.

So more options for making the T2 makes the price increase, interesting.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Gillia Winddancer
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#99 - 2012-07-27 16:45:10 UTC
Mallak Azaria wrote:
Gillia Winddancer wrote:
The tech fail lies not in the fact that the resources are only in a specific area in the universe, but the fact that it is a passive generator with 0 effort to get.


You mean I can get my very own Tech moon with out having to scan moons, set up a POS, refuel it, collect the goo or defend the tower!? Sign me up bro.


Scan moon: Done once

Setting up POS: Done once

Refuelling: Ignored as stated earlier.

Collecting the goo: Oh my the backbreaking effort. Any regular miner would be so PROUD of you son. Pretty much falls into the same category as refuelling. Basically a trip or two every so many timeunits from X to Y. Oh wait, did I say trip? I mean jump. Man, logistics in nullsec. What a backbreaking activity it is.

Defending the tower: Yup, quite the effort when you have a huge alliance behind your back. Besides, how many times per week do you necessarily have to defend it with said alliance behind your back? 4 times? 10 times? Give me an average number so we can deepen our discussion regarding this part at least.

Mallak Azaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#100 - 2012-07-27 16:48:55 UTC
Gillia Winddancer wrote:
Mallak Azaria wrote:
Gillia Winddancer wrote:
The tech fail lies not in the fact that the resources are only in a specific area in the universe, but the fact that it is a passive generator with 0 effort to get.


You mean I can get my very own Tech moon with out having to scan moons, set up a POS, refuel it, collect the goo or defend the tower!? Sign me up bro.


Scan moon: Done once

Setting up POS: Done once

Refuelling: Ignored as stated earlier.

Collecting the goo: Oh my the backbreaking effort. Any regular miner would be so PROUD of you son. Pretty much falls into the same category as refuelling. Basically a trip or two every so many timeunits from X to Y. Oh wait, did I say trip? I mean jump. Man, logistics in nullsec. What a backbreaking activity it is.

Defending the tower: Yup, quite the effort when you have a huge alliance behind your back. Besides, how many times per week do you necessarily have to defend it with said alliance behind your back? 4 times? 10 times? Give me an average number so we can deepen our discussion regarding this part at least.



I keep turning around but my large alliance seems to be missing. Which alliance was that exactly?

This post was lovingly crafted by a member of the Goonwaffe Posting Cabal, proud member of the popular gay hookup site somethingawful.com, Spelling Bee, Grammar Gestapo & #1 Official Gevlon Goblin Fanclub member.