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The end of Hulkageddon?
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baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#81 - 2012-07-24 21:47:28 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:


No with ice < 1k pu it nets about 20M-ish per hour, which is somewhat less than what you get with incursions. Unless you do Incursions in a Drake maybe.


Hell of a lot less input for that 20 mil though.


Yes, having to spam directional scan, double checking everyone entering in local or logging in to see if they are known gankers, staying aligned or circling around stuff...

It's like missioning in low sec, with the difference that in low sec it takes more than 2 x 5M ships to finish you off.

You should know, you are part of those who created such situation.

Before you, the same ice yielded 4.5M per hour. The delta is the risk factor.

You can't blame goods cost enough to provide 20M per hour when you are the one killing miners enough so that price quadruples.


I just fit a tank, deploy drones and mine for a cycle.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#82 - 2012-07-24 23:57:11 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:


No with ice < 1k pu it nets about 20M-ish per hour, which is somewhat less than what you get with incursions. Unless you do Incursions in a Drake maybe.


Hell of a lot less input for that 20 mil though.


Yes, having to spam directional scan, double checking everyone entering in local or logging in to see if they are known gankers, staying aligned or circling around stuff...

It's like missioning in low sec, with the difference that in low sec it takes more than 2 x 5M ships to finish you off.

You should know, you are part of those who created such situation.

Before you, the same ice yielded 4.5M per hour. The delta is the risk factor.

You can't blame goods cost enough to provide 20M per hour when you are the one killing miners enough so that price quadruples.


I just fit a tank, deploy drones and mine for a cycle.


I have fiddled with a 22k EHP mack, aka "fit a tank". It works but mines a lot worse than a max yield one (requiring the attentions described above).
In numbers, before the whole Hulkageddon + Bat Country + interdictions events, ice was 440 pu. With tank it could easily go to 650. The inefficiency has its price. Even without any more Hulkageddon.

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Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#83 - 2012-07-25 00:26:10 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
I have fiddled with a 22k EHP mack, aka "fit a tank". It works but mines a lot worse than a max yield one (requiring the attentions described above).
In numbers, before the whole Hulkageddon + Bat Country + interdictions events, ice was 440 pu. With tank it could easily go to 650. The inefficiency has its price. Even without any more Hulkageddon.


Just like a shield-tanked ship loses utility, just like an armor tanked ship loses DPS.

Working as intended.

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Arkturus McFadden
Anukar
#84 - 2012-07-25 01:23:15 UTC
Carlton Foster wrote:
The details of the new mining barges were just posted in the Science and Industry forums.

So is this the end of Hulkageddon?


It won't end because many will still fit for high yield instead of high tank ability Smile
CREATOR PLAYER
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#85 - 2012-07-25 03:07:01 UTC
Well I didnt realise how weak a Hulk was till I had one blown up in 0.7.

I tell you what it takes you a long time to afford a new Hulk with 0.7 ore.

And I just bought one 1month ago and havent used it yet, I guess I will lose a lot in value now with this news
:-(
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#86 - 2012-07-25 03:55:43 UTC
CREATOR PLAYER wrote:
Well I didnt realise how weak a Hulk was till I had one blown up in 0.7.

I tell you what it takes you a long time to afford a new Hulk with 0.7 ore.

And I just bought one 1month ago and havent used it yet, I guess I will lose a lot in value now with this news
:-(


like any ship, it is weak if you refuse to give up yield for a tank

but miners do not need to understand the purpose of fitting your ship because they are special little snowflakes like that

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
pussnheels
Viziam
#87 - 2012-07-25 04:46:41 UTC
there will be more hulkaggedons , like some of you said there always will be people going for a max yield hulk instead of safety
probably best thing that would happen that hulkaggedon now becomes a group effort , no worries somebody will figure out how to gank those skiffs and macks that is just the strenght of the game and of the community

I do not agree with what you are saying , but i will defend to the death your right to say it...... Voltaire
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#88 - 2012-07-25 04:48:52 UTC
Richard Desturned wrote:
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
I have fiddled with a 22k EHP mack, aka "fit a tank". It works but mines a lot worse than a max yield one (requiring the attentions described above).
In numbers, before the whole Hulkageddon + Bat Country + interdictions events, ice was 440 pu. With tank it could easily go to 650. The inefficiency has its price. Even without any more Hulkageddon.


Just like a shield-tanked ship loses utility, just like an armor tanked ship loses DPS.

Working as intended.


NP with that, but then the posts above stating mining = incursion alike income have no point.

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Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#89 - 2012-07-25 06:09:02 UTC
Dave stark wrote:
yes but to make use of an orca you need a 2nd account, with a 37k m3 ore bay mackinaw... it's a whole different pot of frogs.


I see far more jet canning by frigate and cruiser pilots than barge pilots. Some folks use GSCs to transfer ore to haulers from barges. I will wait until the ORE mining frigate comes out before making any statements about the end of jet canning. The new Mckinaw will replace the existing max yield + cargo hold optimization mackinaw setup, not the Osprey + Badger solo miner setup.

Day 0 Advice for New Players
Parsee789
Immaterial and Missing Power
#90 - 2012-07-25 06:18:08 UTC
Regardless of changes people will still fly hulks for min/max yield, regardless of consequences.

There will be plenty of fools who will do so.


Meanwhile I will afk mine in a procuror/skiff while watching a movie.
sYnc Vir
Wolfsbrigade
Ghost Legion.
#91 - 2012-07-25 06:30:23 UTC
Richard Desturned wrote:
yes, hulkageddon is a thing of the past

feel free to afk mine in your max-yield fit hulk in 0.5 space, only going back to your computer to move ore to your orca

you are now untouchable


You can't afk in a hulk with a orca for more than 3 minutes and 50 seconds. Only holds 1 cycle. I haven't been on sisi yet, but from the stats I've read, I'm wondering if a Max yield Mac with the added hit points is the better choice. Need to check though.

Don't ask about Italics, just tilt your head.
Dave Stark
#92 - 2012-07-25 06:36:29 UTC
Mara Rinn wrote:
Dave stark wrote:
yes but to make use of an orca you need a 2nd account, with a 37k m3 ore bay mackinaw... it's a whole different pot of frogs.


I see far more jet canning by frigate and cruiser pilots than barge pilots. Some folks use GSCs to transfer ore to haulers from barges. I will wait until the ORE mining frigate comes out before making any statements about the end of jet canning. The new Mckinaw will replace the existing max yield + cargo hold optimization mackinaw setup, not the Osprey + Badger solo miner setup.


that's on account that cruiser/frig pilots have cargo space for about 5 mins of mining, vs nearly 15 mins for a max cargo hulk... nobody wants to be warping to and from the station every 5 mins.

people mining in frigs/cruisers are never doing so for long, training times for barges aren't that long. those new players will be mining in rookie systems where can flipping isn't allowed so i feel can flipping will indeed be a thing of the past unless you can find a paranoid solo miner jetcanning from a skiff perhaps.
Ginseng Jita
PAN-EVE TRADING COMPANY
#93 - 2012-07-25 06:40:29 UTC
sYnc Vir wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
yes, hulkageddon is a thing of the past

feel free to afk mine in your max-yield fit hulk in 0.5 space, only going back to your computer to move ore to your orca

you are now untouchable


You can't afk in a hulk with a orca for more than 3 minutes and 50 seconds. Only holds 1 cycle. I haven't been on sisi yet, but from the stats I've read, I'm wondering if a Max yield Mac with the added hit points is the better choice. Need to check though.


Yes the max yield, un-tanked Machinaw is the better choice(with the right rig, 2 MLU's and a mining implant). It has more armor, holds more ore, and has the same yield as a tanked hulk. So why bother taking a chance in losing that 300m ISK Hulk when a ship for half the price has more armor and has better yield.
flakeys
Doomheim
#94 - 2012-07-25 06:42:14 UTC
No More Heroes wrote:
This is a huge buff for botters and afk "players."



Achieved thanks to you guys , now how ironic is that ?

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.
dexington
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#95 - 2012-07-25 06:47:17 UTC
Parsee789 wrote:
Regardless of changes people will still fly hulks for min/max yield, regardless of consequences.

There will be plenty of fools who will do so.


Probably, but at least they will have the option to use are better suited vessel for mining in a harsh environment. The patch is not going to stop people from doing dumb things, or others from exploiting that. The Rokh with 8 Miner II and 3 MLU II is not a bad mining ship, if people want they can build a mining ship with battleship ehp, with what already is available in the game.

The patch is not not to change mining that much, making it easier to fit defensive ships with the skills normally associated with mining, and it's going to make hauling easier for miners without support.

I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous.
Ginseng Jita
PAN-EVE TRADING COMPANY
#96 - 2012-07-25 06:50:17 UTC
dexington wrote:
Parsee789 wrote:
Regardless of changes people will still fly hulks for min/max yield, regardless of consequences.

There will be plenty of fools who will do so.


Probably, but at least they will have the option to use are better suited vessel for mining in a harsh environment. The patch is not going to stop people from doing dumb things, or others from exploiting that. The Rokh with 8 Miner II and 3 MLU II is not a bad mining ship, if people want they can build a mining ship with battleship ehp, with what already is available in the game.

The patch is not not to change mining that much, making it easier to fit defensive ships with the skills normally associated with mining, and it's going to make hauling easier for miners without support.


No, what the new barges do is promote AFK mining and botting.
Dave Stark
#97 - 2012-07-25 06:51:19 UTC
Ginseng Jita wrote:
dexington wrote:
Parsee789 wrote:
Regardless of changes people will still fly hulks for min/max yield, regardless of consequences.

There will be plenty of fools who will do so.


Probably, but at least they will have the option to use are better suited vessel for mining in a harsh environment. The patch is not going to stop people from doing dumb things, or others from exploiting that. The Rokh with 8 Miner II and 3 MLU II is not a bad mining ship, if people want they can build a mining ship with battleship ehp, with what already is available in the game.

The patch is not not to change mining that much, making it easier to fit defensive ships with the skills normally associated with mining, and it's going to make hauling easier for miners without support.


No, what the new barges do is promote AFK mining and botting.


please, continue.

amuse me.
dexington
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#98 - 2012-07-25 06:55:43 UTC
Ginseng Jita wrote:
dexington wrote:
Parsee789 wrote:
Regardless of changes people will still fly hulks for min/max yield, regardless of consequences.

There will be plenty of fools who will do so.


Probably, but at least they will have the option to use are better suited vessel for mining in a harsh environment. The patch is not going to stop people from doing dumb things, or others from exploiting that. The Rokh with 8 Miner II and 3 MLU II is not a bad mining ship, if people want they can build a mining ship with battleship ehp, with what already is available in the game.

The patch is not not to change mining that much, making it easier to fit defensive ships with the skills normally associated with mining, and it's going to make hauling easier for miners without support.


No, what the new barges do is promote AFK mining and botting.


I feel the same way about titans!

I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous.