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Mining barge changes [now with feedback]
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Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#121 - 2012-07-24 22:54:58 UTC
I want blueprint changes amarr dammit.

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Urgg Boolean
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#122 - 2012-07-24 23:20:00 UTC
I can't get to SiSi as I'm working back2back 12 hour shifts. So let me ask:
1) How does the ice mining skill apply ? To the rigs or the mods?
2) How do they alter existing ships ? Like, do you log in to find that the existing rigs have been auto deleted?
3) If we buy ships now, I am assuming that they will be auto-converted into the new versions when the patch hammer drops ?
Trespasser
S0utherN Comfort
#123 - 2012-07-24 23:40:09 UTC
Urgg Boolean wrote:
I can't get to SiSi as I'm working back2back 12 hour shifts. So let me ask:
1) How does the ice mining skill apply ? To the rigs or the mods?
2) How do they alter existing ships ? Like, do you log in to find that the existing rigs have been auto deleted?
3) If we buy ships now, I am assuming that they will be auto-converted into the new versions when the patch hammer drops ?





They Do alter the existing ships, so if you have one right now or buy one, come patch day they will be updated to the new version
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#124 - 2012-07-24 23:41:16 UTC
Urgg Boolean wrote:
I can't get to SiSi as I'm working back2back 12 hour shifts. So let me ask:
1) How does the ice mining skill apply ? To the rigs or the mods?
2) How do they alter existing ships ? Like, do you log in to find that the existing rigs have been auto deleted?
3) If we buy ships now, I am assuming that they will be auto-converted into the new versions when the patch hammer drops ?


If its anything like the past: Existing ships just get modified. As no rigs are being removed from the game, no rig will be deleted from your ship. If the slot layout of any ship is changed so it has fewer slots, the "extra" fitted items are placed in that ship's cargo hold. (Making sure this works right and suddenly finding that on the live server there is an unexpected event that never showed in testing is one reason we get extended down times).

I assume the ice mining skill will reduce cycle time, like it always has.

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Javajunky
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#125 - 2012-07-25 00:08:25 UTC
P3po wrote:
I have dreamed a day where i can cary full set of crystals + 1 or 2 crystals spare if one gets destroyed .... guess i will have to wait few more years.

I think this guy "carry it in orca" never mined with 5-6 hulks at once, and have no idea how annoying it is with the crystals.


Yeah imagine that... I've probably posted this wish item a hundred times over the years.

Of course they went the extact opposite direction by not letting us even sport a full set of crystals.... of course they could be a sport and just drop the crystal m3 size down to 1m3 per crystal... nice to dream right?
Mortimer Civeri
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#126 - 2012-07-25 00:15:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Mortimer Civeri
Dave stark wrote:
Mortimer Civeri wrote:
500m3 is all you need for crystals. That will give you enough space for 10 T2 crystals, or 16 T1. T2 crystals in a Hulk/Covetor can be configured for 3 sets plus 1 spare crystal of your most important type, or two sets plus two spare of each set. T1 crystals can have 4 sets with a spare for each, or three sets with a full replacement for one set and two spare crystals for the other two sets.

This bullspit about, "I NEED A FULL SET OF EVERY ORE TYPE CRYSTAL IN MY HOLD OMG!!!!!1" is hogwash. Any competent miner is only going to go after a few ore types ( the ones that have high ISK/m3 ) anyway. Miner/Producers, are going to mine the highest ISK/m3 ore they can and sell what they don't use to buy the minerals that they do need, so again limiting the range of ores to just a few which can be easily covered by a limited crystal set in a 500m3 cargo hold.


any competent miner [in a hulk] will be in a fleet stripping belts of everything, there's at least 4 ores per belt in high sec alone, then when we get to grav sites etc that goes up. in 0.0 you WILL mine everything including the hideous spodumain in order to cycle the grav site.

so yes, you do need a full set of crystals in a hulk, pehaps not in a mack or skiff, but you do in a hulk.


Psst, I bolded the part YOU DIDN'T READ. That takes care of the highsec belts. As for 0.0, haulers can shuttle crystals as needed from a Roqal or Orca that is safely in a POS, or if you want to John Wayne it, the rat tank can shuttle the crystals from the Orca or Roqal in the gravametric site (never EVER have them in the site, ever, unless you want to show people a hilarious lossmail.)

"I don't know which is worse, ...that everyone has his price, or that the price is always so low." Calvin
Javajunky
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#127 - 2012-07-25 00:50:30 UTC
Mortimer Civeri wrote:
Dave stark wrote:
Mortimer Civeri wrote:
500m3 is all you need for crystals. That will give you enough space for 10 T2 crystals, or 16 T1. T2 crystals in a Hulk/Covetor can be configured for 3 sets plus 1 spare crystal of your most important type, or two sets plus two spare of each set. T1 crystals can have 4 sets with a spare for each, or three sets with a full replacement for one set and two spare crystals for the other two sets.

This bullspit about, "I NEED A FULL SET OF EVERY ORE TYPE CRYSTAL IN MY HOLD OMG!!!!!1" is hogwash. Any competent miner is only going to go after a few ore types ( the ones that have high ISK/m3 ) anyway. Miner/Producers, are going to mine the highest ISK/m3 ore they can and sell what they don't use to buy the minerals that they do need, so again limiting the range of ores to just a few which can be easily covered by a limited crystal set in a 500m3 cargo hold.


any competent miner [in a hulk] will be in a fleet stripping belts of everything, there's at least 4 ores per belt in high sec alone, then when we get to grav sites etc that goes up. in 0.0 you WILL mine everything including the hideous spodumain in order to cycle the grav site.

so yes, you do need a full set of crystals in a hulk, pehaps not in a mack or skiff, but you do in a hulk.


Psst, I bolded the part YOU DIDN'T READ. That takes care of the highsec belts. As for 0.0, haulers can shuttle crystals as needed from a Roqal or Orca that is safely in a POS, or if you want to John Wayne it, the rat tank can shuttle the crystals from the Orca or Roqal in the gravametric site (never EVER have them in the site, ever, unless you want to show people a hilarious lossmail.)


You fail to take into account the multi-boxers perspective. Shuttling Crystals means shutting down a Exhumber to sit on ammo? Seriously, you must be an empire pubbie. If you weren't you'd see rorq's out as haulers all the time. I've got 1 boosting and 1 hauling. When you have 9 exhumbers an orca doesn't come close to cutting it. Oh yeah and that hauler rorq - parked right in the middle of the belt and has been for the last year.

Thankis for playing - t-shirt's in the mail....
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
#128 - 2012-07-25 00:51:18 UTC
The QQ over mining crystals in this thread is hysterical. "WE DONT WANT TO DO POINTLESS LOGISTICS." Ya'll really aren't satisfied unless you're in a perfect mining environment that is as conducive to not having to think at all as possible.

This post was crafted by a member of the GoonSwarm Federation Economic Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.

fofofo
Javajunky
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#129 - 2012-07-25 01:04:48 UTC
corestwo wrote:
The QQ over mining crystals in this thread is hysterical. "WE DONT WANT TO DO POINTLESS LOGISTICS." Ya'll really aren't satisfied unless you're in a perfect mining environment that is as conducive to not having to think at all as possible.



Obviously as someone who doesn't mine, thank you for your troll bait. If you had any skin in the game, you'd actually care. It's not like we're asking for a new feature, we're just asking for the capability we previously had???
Gevlin
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#130 - 2012-07-25 02:24:03 UTC


for a mining co-ordinator I aill be looking forward to encourage newb miners to fly the skiffs and a 4 machinas. as they are going to fit a nice tanks and not too much lose in mining yield.
as I can put plenty of these in one of my rorquals, then have the other rorqual hold hulks for the experienced.

Some Questions

Question 1
I am wondering if the construction costs are going to increase for the Retriever or Procurer. if not it will be a hard choice to switch to hulk or covetor if you are a mysre. Especially that the cost of tech 2 crystals are going to be minimal for the Skiff.

Question 2
Also is the increase in tank to solution for the old reduction of chance to produce a cloud?

Question 3
Just a gut feeling the Mach and the Skiff have no strong bonus that grows with skill of the ship like 5%
Alternate Ideas instead of a Mining yield bonus:
-->Increase in the Number of mining drones a player can control would be fun. Vs Increase the yield or the increase in Yield or HP of mining drones. (Mach Preference)
-->Decrease in Signature radius (Skiff Preference)
-->Increase in Shield Resists.(Skiff Preference)
-->Increase in Movement (Skiff preference)
-->Increase Targeting and Mining Laser Range bonus (Mach preference.) allowing the pilot become even lazier Roid Sniper
-->Increase in Power Grid (skiff Preference)



Someday I will have the time to play. For now it is mining afk in High sec. In Cheap ships
Draconus Lofwyr
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#131 - 2012-07-25 04:17:22 UTC
are they planning on unfitting rigs from existing fits since a lot of exhumers have cargo rigs fitted. the ore hold changes now make these rigs practically worthless.
Industrializata
Imperial Logistics And Research
#132 - 2012-07-25 04:37:54 UTC
while now getting with a mack 4 cubes of ice @ 191 seconds ( orca boosted ) , anyone know what would be the new output considering Ice Harvesting Upgrades and the rig?

Thanks in advance!
Janet Patton
Brony Express
#133 - 2012-07-25 05:28:44 UTC
Droxlyn wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Droxlyn wrote:
Please boost the storage of the Hulk's Ore bay to 11000 because two perfect cycle sets results in 10918.5 m3 of ore.
1819.75 * 6.
Good thing that you have a fleet at hand to take that ore off your hand, and that 4 individual laser cycles is more than enough time, no matter how you cut it, to dump the ore either into a can or into a nearby storage vessel. Blink

The Hulk is a fleet mining ship. They assume that you will be handing the ore over to someone else, so very little local storage is actually needed.


My desire is to do it every-other-cycle, not every-cycle. I'd like a little extra time for potty breaks and forum browsing.

Drox


You can wait 5.59 minutes and do two cycles. Empty it just before then 2nd cycle finishes.

Why do I have this sig? I don't smoke.
Dave stark
#134 - 2012-07-25 06:21:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Dave Stark
Mortimer Civeri wrote:
Dave stark wrote:
Mortimer Civeri wrote:
500m3 is all you need for crystals. That will give you enough space for 10 T2 crystals, or 16 T1. T2 crystals in a Hulk/Covetor can be configured for 3 sets plus 1 spare crystal of your most important type, or two sets plus two spare of each set. T1 crystals can have 4 sets with a spare for each, or three sets with a full replacement for one set and two spare crystals for the other two sets.

This bullspit about, "I NEED A FULL SET OF EVERY ORE TYPE CRYSTAL IN MY HOLD OMG!!!!!1" is hogwash. Any competent miner is only going to go after a few ore types ( the ones that have high ISK/m3 ) anyway. Miner/Producers, are going to mine the highest ISK/m3 ore they can and sell what they don't use to buy the minerals that they do need, so again limiting the range of ores to just a few which can be easily covered by a limited crystal set in a 500m3 cargo hold.


any competent miner [in a hulk] will be in a fleet stripping belts of everything, there's at least 4 ores per belt in high sec alone, then when we get to grav sites etc that goes up. in 0.0 you WILL mine everything including the hideous spodumain in order to cycle the grav site.

so yes, you do need a full set of crystals in a hulk, pehaps not in a mack or skiff, but you do in a hulk.


Psst, I bolded the part YOU DIDN'T READ. That takes care of the highsec belts. As for 0.0, haulers can shuttle crystals as needed from a Roqal or Orca that is safely in a POS, or if you want to John Wayne it, the rat tank can shuttle the crystals from the Orca or Roqal in the gravametric site (never EVER have them in the site, ever, unless you want to show people a hilarious lossmail.)


i did read the bolded part, what good is 1 crystal when you have 3 strips to reload?
also who is going to waste a player tanking rats when all the new exhumers will be capable of tanking them and an abundance of light drones will provide ample dps to deal with even a 3 bs spawn? it's just one less miner.

corestwo wrote:
The QQ over mining crystals in this thread is hysterical. "WE DONT WANT TO DO POINTLESS LOGISTICS." Ya'll really aren't satisfied unless you're in a perfect mining environment that is as conducive to not having to think at all as possible.


it's more a fact that the hulk's cargo has been separated in such a poor manner. the hulk is a fleet ship so there's no reason for it to need to carry more than one cycle of ore; so why does it have 7500m3 of space? move the wasted space back to the regular cargo bay and the issue is solved without giving the hulk more space, or reducing the size of mining crystals.

the cargo allocation on the hulk has just been poorly thought out.
Stefan1978
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#135 - 2012-07-25 07:17:40 UTC
Top Miner in Hulk do before and after Patch 5884m³ or ore in one cycle drones in121 sec (closest to astroid) 824m³ (mining drones rig tech II) so what you have after go pissing in 121 sec x2 - 1 sec for hauling?? Math is not yours? 5884m³ + 4x424m³ = 7580!!!! That is reason for 7500m³ !!

And now give back the old Cargo and stop Stupid 8.August Patch!!!! It Hurts.
Sigras
Conglomo
#136 - 2012-07-25 07:37:48 UTC
Did i miss a change or something? did they remove the ability for the orca/hulk to jettison a can or set up a giant secure container in space?

really, how hard is it to ask when the orca comes by to pick up your ore, to ask him to leave a few crystals when youre running low? IIRC T2 crystals last around 200 cycles, this means that AT MOST youre going to need a spare set of crystals for what you're currently mining, a set of crystals for what you want to mine next, and a spare set of crystals for what you want to mine next.

So say youre mining veldspar because trit is ridiculous and the next ore youre gonna mine is scordite.so you have 3 veldspar crystals in your lasers that probably already have damage from your last op, 3 more brand new veldspar crystals in your cargo, 3 used scordite crystals, and 3 new scordite crystals for a grand total of 450 m^3
If your orca buddy hasnt come by in the time it took you to either break all of those crystals, or mine all of those rocks out, mining crystals are not going to be your main problem.

All that being said, I would like to see the hold on the Mack get buffed as it is designed to be self sufficient, I would like to see it get a 1,500 m^3 cargo bay so it can hold 2 of every T2 crystal in the game if you include the ones loaded into the miners.

In fact it would be easier to switch the roles for the mack and the skiff so that you only have to carry one of each crystal.
Sigras
Conglomo
#137 - 2012-07-25 07:40:15 UTC
Stefan1978 wrote:
Top Miner in Hulk do before and after Patch 5884m³ or ore in one cycle drones in121 sec (closest to astroid) 824m³ (mining drones rig tech II) so what you have after go pissing in 121 sec x2 - 1 sec for hauling?? Math is not yours? 5884m³ + 4x424m³ = 7580!!!! That is reason for 7500m³ !!

And now give back the old Cargo and stop Stupid 8.August Patch!!!! It Hurts.

if you want to AFK mine, go buy a Mackinaw
Dominika Brumarova
Mission Patrol Elite High Sec
#138 - 2012-07-25 08:04:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Dominika Brumarova
Sigras wrote:
Stefan1978 wrote:
Top Miner in Hulk do before and after Patch 5884m³ or ore in one cycle drones in121 sec (closest to astroid) 824m³ (mining drones rig tech II) so what you have after go pissing in 121 sec x2 - 1 sec for hauling?? Math is not yours? 5884m³ + 4x424m³ = 7580!!!! That is reason for 7500m³ !!

And now give back the old Cargo and stop Stupid 8.August Patch!!!! It Hurts.

if you want to AFK mine, go buy a Mackinaw


Well i want to go to WC or to check my dinner in the kitchen........?2 cycles are ussualy enought for that.
Dave stark
#139 - 2012-07-25 08:06:36 UTC
Dominika Brumarova wrote:
Sigras wrote:
Stefan1978 wrote:
Top Miner in Hulk do before and after Patch 5884m³ or ore in one cycle drones in121 sec (closest to astroid) 824m³ (mining drones rig tech II) so what you have after go pissing in 121 sec x2 - 1 sec for hauling?? Math is not yours? 5884m³ + 4x424m³ = 7580!!!! That is reason for 7500m³ !!

And now give back the old Cargo and stop Stupid 8.August Patch!!!! It Hurts.

if you want to AFK mine, go buy a Mackinaw


Well i want to go to WC or to check my dinner in the kitchen........?2 cycles are ussualy enought for that.


get a mackinaw or suck it up that the game won't play itself while you're not at the computer.
Annette Aumer
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#140 - 2012-07-25 09:10:28 UTC
Dave stark wrote:
Dominika Brumarova wrote:
Sigras wrote:
Stefan1978 wrote:
Top Miner in Hulk do before and after Patch 5884m³ or ore in one cycle drones in121 sec (closest to astroid) 824m³ (mining drones rig tech II) so what you have after go pissing in 121 sec x2 - 1 sec for hauling?? Math is not yours? 5884m³ + 4x424m³ = 7580!!!! That is reason for 7500m³ !!

And now give back the old Cargo and stop Stupid 8.August Patch!!!! It Hurts.

if you want to AFK mine, go buy a Mackinaw


Well i want to go to WC or to check my dinner in the kitchen........?2 cycles are ussualy enought for that.


get a mackinaw or suck it up that the game won't play itself while you're not at the computer.



This is one of those gold nuggets worth panning for. o7