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except only the pilot can get stuff out of the corp hangar unless you have roles in the corp... trust me, it's a problem i have daily.

…so they didn't fix the problem. Look, I can go off and test it if people want to, but I'd prefer to just ask. It's just that the answers are pointing in pretty much every direction right now.

So organise your fleet better. Have each corp form an Orca-based group. Use shuttle services if Orca pilots are that few and far between (which seems highly unlikely in a corp with any kind of mining ambitions). Alternatively (or additionally), assign roles — who does what, and let people pick up what they need before you begin. It's not like there aren't ways to hand off equipment to surrounding ships. The whole notion that every ship needs to carry every crystal is pretty silly to begin with, and keeping the Hulks fed with charges is just something to plan the fleet around.

Riight… 16×30m³×4 = 1,920m³ for the T1s, 16×50m³×4 = 3,200 for the T2s = 5120 in total… that's pretty much not a single number correct (not to mention a pretty poor mix of crystals). It's not so much me who's claiming the Orca should carry it — it's the express purpose of the design change for the Hulk: to be used in a fleet where a separate ship takes care of the ore. The Hulk is just meant to sit and suck up rocks and immediately spit them out again. The same ship that takes care of the ore will be available to feed the Hulk with whatever crystals it needs.

That said, giving the Hulk a utility high would actually be interesting for a number of purposes.

So I forgot that T1s are smaller.
Also, if you're mining Mercoxit, you aren't going to be mining anything else, so it's 15 crystals or 1 crystal that you care about. 15 * 4 * 50 = 3000. I'm glad that if you need to shlep about with T1s that it isn't as bad as I made it out to be, but still.

A proper mining operation has:
1 Rat tank ship if needed.
1 Orca sitting around pulling in jetcans and providing boosts. If there's a Rorqual involved, he's hiding next to a Deathstar POS compressing ore and providing bonuses, the orca just mentioned turns into:
Another Orca snagging ore from the stationary one.
Everybody else is in a Hulk.
If there are enough hulks, you wind up with two Orcas hauling with little down-time.
There is nobody left to pass around crystals or have an Orca/corp, etc.
Orcas have an insane tractor beam range, you may as well ask the Hulk to warp back to the station when they need crystals that they don't have on them.

So, um, who is supposed to get the crystals from the Orca to the Hulks?

Drox

Why does this mining op not just have different ships mining different ores instead of everyone mining all of them? Would that maybe require organisation?

From that list? Use the ratter as a shuttle — it's a combat ship and should be fitting an MWD anyway.

As for the whole “they need crystals that they don't have on them”, that just comes down to planning. Pick one or two ores each, depending on how common they are in the belt. Your 500m³ hold can now hold at least a full replacement set for each pick, plus spares, giving you plenty time to have that shuttle come by with replacements if you manage to burn out all three strips in one go.

edit: Even if you don't know what to mine until you get there, again: the Orca can carry the crystals. Pick what you need from the pile and get to work.

You are referring to me I think, so correct me if I'm wrong on this, but I tell it as I see it.

It is my opinion, that the cargo holds do need to be bigger - across the board if they're not going to reduce mining crystal size.

The Cargohold of a Barge needs to be able to hold 3 types of Ore crystals with 1 spare.
The Cargohold of an Exhumer needs to be able to hold 5 types of Ore crystals with 2 spares.
(see the T1 / T2 advantage progression there?)

So, let's compare: T1 crystals are 30 m3 each, T2 are 50 m3.

We'll use T2 crystal math (since they are bigger).

Cargohold Size = T2 Crystal Size * # of Strips * # of crystals (active + spares) * # of ore types

Procurer / Skiff : CH range is : 300 - 750 m3
- T1: 2 crystals / 3 ores: 50 * 1 * 2 * 3 = 300 m3
- T2: 3 crystals / 5 ores: 50 * 1 * 3 * 5 = 750 m3

Retriever / Mackinaw : CH range: 600 - 1500 m3
- T1: 2 crystals / 3 ores: 50 * 2 * 2 * 3 = 600 m3
- T2: 3 crystals / 5 ores: 50 * 2 * 3 * 5 = 1500 m3

Covetor / Hulk : CH range: 900 - 2250 m3
- T1: 2 crystals / 3 ores: 50 * 3 * 2 * 3 = 900 m3
- T2: 3 crystals / 5 ores: 50 * 3 * 3 * 5 = 2250 m3


Just like using T2 crystals in fighting ships - the only difference is that it's a "mining ship" so their crystals seem to need to be 30 - 50 times larger.

Either reduce crystal size or increase the cargoholds - it's that simple.

Crystals increase yield, therefore there needs to be a disadvantage to combat the advantage they provide. Somebody already said they are cheap, so that means the storage issue is it, since cost is not. Don't want to worry about where to put backup crystals? Use T1 miners or head back to the base to pick up new crystals for your T2. Easy peasy.

there already is a drawback, they use more cap.

I love the new ore bay, finally a place for ore where it does not get mixed up with my hold of crystals, but when mining multiple ores to strip a belt/grav (especially if its a small grav where a lot of the rocks vanish after just a few cycles) you need a far bigger selection than the 500m3 hold can carry, and no I don't want to shuttle back and forth to a station/pos/orca/rorq to change up my crystals each time you suck a roid dry and need to change over.

Simply reduce the size of these crystals, can you imagine how annoying it would be for combat if you could only carry 1 or 2 types of lenses for your lasers?

Hello. I have seen some people asking about ICE aspects. I did some personal calculations in TQ and SISI today just for myself. But since i noticed nobody is even mentioning it in this thread i will share it so that the people who did not do that would at least have raw impression how much worse it will be,

Curent Mach. - 2 x IHU + 3% yeti + maxed out orca boost. Has an interval of 49 seconds per ice block. 49/1

After pache

Mach - 3 x IHU + 3% yeti + maxed out orca boost + ICE RIG. 51/1
skiff - 2 x IHU + 3% yeti + maxed out orca boost + ICE RIG. 56/1
Hulk - 2 x IHU + 3% yeti + maxed out orca boost + ICE RIG. 47/1